Reporting People

[Gravid]

Hey up, went to see an extension job after work today, run of the mill job. Went through it with the lady and asked can i see your fuse brd, no problem she said. so she takes me inside opens the cupbrd and there's a brand spanking crabtree starbreaker, dual RCD and spare way.
" Fantastic " I said
" yes we'd like certificates "
" of course blah blah"
" No for the whole board " she said
It turns out they know this spark who she says is qualified but can't sign anything off yet who'd done the board change but he hadn't given her any certs. I asked whether he had tested and she wasn't sure, I told her to get in touch and ask him. Then agreed to come back in a week or so as she was still unsure of exactly what she wanted and it was only half built.
Are we supposed to report these people? and would you report him ?

Here's a guy doing notifiable work in my area with no annual fees to pay !
On the other hand least he's a spark, did look a neat job but not had the cover off yet, who knows his story, laid off kids to feed etc kind of think life's hard enough without grassing fellow tradesman in. Would LABC ever know ....

I realise if the installation is dangerous it might be a different story also if the client had done it themselves but for now lets imagine it tests out fine.
I am also aware of not signing other peoples work off but don't we do that everytime we upgarde a consumer unit anyhow, also why should I have to act as the part p police and potentially screw up someones year and more than likely make an enemy of a fellow spark?
What would you do? and have you ever reported anyone?

 

[Spudnik]

Trouble is though mate, its ultimately the responsibility of the homeowner to inform the council.

You could always give them a call.

You never know.

 

[Gravid]

Mmmm, well can't see them doing that she kept saying " he's ever so nice and i don't want to get him in trouble ".

 

[Spudnik]

Makes you wonder why he isnt doing the extension though.

 

[nickblake]

The answer to this question is they wont do any thing about it it has to be the home owner , i rang the nic regarding a spart who did dangerouse installation live wires wrong polarity ,all they said was get the home owner to ring us , so all you can do is to advise her to contact the council regarding this

 

[ian.settle1]

Mmmm, well can't see them doing that she kept saying " he's ever so nice and i don't want to get him in trouble ".

Not as he is my brother

 

[Gravid]

Makes you wonder why he isnt doing the extension though.

It's because it needs signing off.

Haha probably is her friggin brother Ian fresh out of a 5 day course !

 

[Spudnik]

It's because it needs signing off.

That is down to LABC.

Even the electrical installation.

 

[mickytuff]

My advice would be to fully explain the implications of signing off somebody elses work and fully test, i mean 100 percent visual on all accesories and price for this accordingly, cover your backside, because if this work does cause a problem i'e a fire, they mite well be knocking your door, as you said all was safe on your installation certificate,never come across it yet, but its best to be as sure as you can be that ALL is safe and to code. Hope this helps bud.

As for reporting him , if alls ok personally i wouldnt bother.

 

[Gravid]

I see what you mean, he does the work and the labc inspect it 1st and 2nd fix, well the builder uses me, so thats one reason.
They seemed happy with his work though and like i said first glance it looked a tidy job.
I don't want to not do the job, it's just she wants certs for the rest of the house, which lets face it isn't a problem, one days testing, only we're not supposed to do it are we.

 

[Gravid]

My advice would be to fully explain the implications of signing off somebody elses work and fully test, i mean 100 percent visual on all accesories and price for this accordingly, cover your backside, because if this work does cause a problem i'e a fire, they mite well be knocking your door, as you said all was safe on your installation certificate,never come across it yet, but its best to be as sure as you can be that ALL is safe and to code. Hope this helps bud.

As for reporting him , if alls ok personally i wouldnt bother.

Yeah cheers, If i end up doing it I'll definately give it a good going over.

 

[mickytuff]

Technically speaking we're not no, but this is the real world where people do this to potentially save money, like i said be very thorough with your testing/inspection, and if your not completely comfortable after this, make a note on your cert stating on the limitations section that you are testing the installation only, and didnt install, to cover yourself and limit your liability for what you have done i.e testing it, thats my take on it, hope this helps you out.........

 

[SirKit Breaker]

Mmmm, well can't see them doing that she kept saying " he's ever so nice and i don't want to get him in trouble ".

She will change her tune i bet if something goes pete tong and the insurance won't pay her out. Point out to her that if the work isn't notified and the place burns down, all she will be left with is a pile of uninsured ashes, and then ask her how nice the electrician (probably uninsured) is. Tell her to shop him, he's not a fellow spark if he is nicking your work, paying no fee's and not properly equipped or insured i bet. I am all for competition, when my competitors are as good as or better than me, but won't tolerate cowboys no matter how tidy their work may be. There is tidy, and there is tidy and safe.

Cheers......Howard

 

[poirot]

Issue an EIC for the extension and do a PIR for the existing installation and board.

 

[spsparks]

Issue an EIC for the extension and do a PIR for the existing installation and board.

and take the cash

 

[SKY]

Were all the main bonds ok when you had a quick lookie?

 

[Gravid]

She will change her tune i bet if something goes pete tong and the insurance won't pay her out. Point out to her that if the work isn't notified and the place burns down, all she will be left with is a pile of uninsured ashes, and then ask her how nice the electrician (probably uninsured) is. Tell her to shop him, he's not a fellow spark if he is nicking your work, paying no fee's and not properly equipped or insured i bet. I am all for competition, when my competitors are as good as or better than me, but won't tolerate cowboys no matter how tidy their work may be. There is tidy, and there is tidy and safe.

Cheers......Howard

Your absolutely right, he's probably alot cheaper as well.

Issue an EIC for the extension and do a PIR for the existing installation and board.

Yes that was the plan.

Were all the main bonds ok when you had a quick lookie?

Looked like it, didn't have cover off, 2 10 mils left the con unit. Like I said for now imagine everythings fine. Was just wondering how people felt about this because lets face it this must be happening all the time.

 

[topquark]

You certainly couldn't sign off on the install (could you be 100% sure all the cables are run according to regs), you could validate the design according to it's current use and test by doing a full PI though. Issue a PIR and comments form relating to lack of previous cert and no Instalation Certificate (plus anything you advise on during the PIR).

 

[mbga9pgf]

Heres one for you. According to the test paperwork,

I/We CERTIFY that the said works do not impair the safety of the existing installation, that the said works have been designed, constructed, inspected and tested in accordance with BS 7671:2008 (IEE Wiring Regulations), amended to ........................(date) and that the said works, to the best of my/our knowledge and belief, at the time of my/our inspection, complied with BS 7671 except as detailed in Part 1 above.

Whats to say you have to be part P registered to sign the above document? Surely, any unregistered but competent person could make the above declaration. Without paying money to effectively a trade body. For example, I have a degree in electrical engineering to Masters level. Not a member of a scheme, but I reckon I can read a set of electrical regs and do my own installation without going outside of the above.

Another forinstance...

My current property has absolutely no documentation at the moment. not a single LABC submission, single periodic and not a single wiring diagram. I am in the process of treating underfloor woodworm, which also gives me an opportunity to replace junction boxes with modern equivalents, same with some very dodgy crimping without heatshrink and documenting all the routeings. I am completing my own testing In accordance with guidance note 3 of 7671 using hired test equipment, had documented corrections to frankly disgraceful wiring that had been done prior to purchase, would you shop me if you could see the work was done to a high standard, just because I hadnt paid a subscription to a trade body if you arrive to do some work for my wife whilst I am away on business?

 

[telectrix]

Heres one for you. According to the test paperwork,



Whats to say you have to be part P registered to sign the above document? Surely, any unregistered but competent person could make the above declaration. Without paying money to effectively a trade body. For example, I have a degree in electrical engineering to Masters level. Not a member of a scheme, but I reckon I can read a set of electrical regs and do my own installation without going outside of the above.

interesting. there is nothing in part p that states you have to be a member of a scam to self certify your work. mate of mine is JIB and has no problems,