UK Vertical Consumer Unit

[maxbox]

Hi. Can a horizontal 200A consumer unit be fitted vertically, or is there a vertical configuration? I have a 350mm wide space...thanks.

 

[nicebutdim]

Can't see any issue with vertical installation, provided specified IP ratings are met and door won't flop about. Out of interest, what brand is this 200A 'consumer' unit?

 

[SJD]

By a 200A consumer unit, do you mean a TPN unit which is typically vertical anyway? Or do you mean something else? How many ways do you need?

 

[maxbox]

Thanks for replying. I dont have a brand. Im an architect and shown a consumer unit fitting in this space. Builder says it cant go there! I want to make sure that is right before telling my client it needs to go somewhere else. 200A is the ampage that it needs to achieve, according to builder.

 

[SJD]

What is this consumer unit supplying? Approx building size / use? I'm thinking it is perhaps a very large house with a 3-phase 200A supply, or maybe something else?

 

[nicebutdim]

In honesty I don't think it's ideal to shoehorn a distribution board sideways into a new or newly refurbished property.

I'd also want a lot more detail before specifying anything. A residental property with 200A supply would generally have a considerable number of outgoing circuits connected and a reasonably large board (by domestic standards) to accomodate these.

 

[maxbox]

What is this consumer unit supplying? Approx building size / use? I'm thinking it is perhaps a very large house with a 3-phase 200A supply, or maybe something else?

Its a 3.5 bed/ 1 living room/1 bath/kitchen/1Wc house.

 

[nicebutdim]

Its a 3.5 bed/ 1 living room/1 bath/kitchen/1Wc house.

There's either going to be some heavy equipment in there or the builder hasn't got a clue.

I suspect the latter.

 

[maxbox]

There's either going to be some heavy equipment in there or the builder hasn't got a clue.

I suspect the latter.

I think you are probably right! thanks for all your advice

 

[nicebutdim]

I think you are probably right! thanks for all your advice

There should be some way of working within the stated confines, provided aquequate height is available, but it seems less than ideal for a new installation to current regulations. Rather than installing sideways, I'd be inclined to look at two row boards.

I'd also be inclined to believe the available supply will be less than 100A and would probably press the builder on that issue.

 

[SJD]

As above, you can get a dual row consumer unit that will easily fit the space. For example, Hager do a 10+10 dual row unit that is approx 300mm wide (and 480mm high), can't imagine you'd need more than 20 ways total.

 

[maxbox]

So it is 200A at the moment! There are two main switches and two RCDs of 80A each plus additional MCBs separate from those.

 

[davesparks]

So it is 200A at the moment! There are two main switches and two RCDs of 80A each plus additional MCBs separate from those.

Then you have a problem, and a really bad electrical design.
If the supply is 200A then the main switch needs to be rated for at least 200A as do those RCDs unless they have some form of 80A protection before them.

If the installation really needs 200A then 2x 80A RCD’s will be no good as that would only allow 160A!

Plus DNOs don't provide single phase supplies greater than 100A to domestic properties (not sure they will ever provide more than 100A SP) so the supply must be 3 phase, in which case you'll be having a much bigger consumer unit than anything you've seen in a regular house.


Have you actually had an electrician look at this?

 

[Rockingit]

As others have said, before conversation goes on about the right equipment you need to have an appropriate electrical / M&E design for this which has been properly calculated for loads and diversity. Just because the sum total of all the breaker values equals a big number does absolutely not mean that the supply needs to be that as well.

There is actually a technical argument about placing distribution panels on their side, bizarrely able to be (grossly) paraphrased as 'the electricity falls out'. Before you all think I've (finally) lost the plot.... the IP ratings for consumer units are different for the top, front, sides and bottom. So by rotating a unit through 90° we change the designed - and therefore Manufacturers type-tested - ratings by eg the bottom now being a side. You also end up in a situation where, assuming most domestics will be constructed so that the cable runs into the CU are from the above ceiling void then given that almost all consumer units are designed with horizontal spacing for cable entry, so this means that you end up with a massive mess of crushed and 'grouped' circuits buried in the wall as you furiously try to go from 300mm wide 50mm deep to 50mm wide and a god-awful mess of what's left of a wall.

 

[maxbox]

Then you have a problem, and a really bad electrical design.
If the supply is 200A then the main switch needs to be rated for at least 200A as do those RCDs unless they have some form of 80A protection before them.

If the installation really needs 200A then 2x 80A RCD’s will be no good as that would only allow 160A!

Plus DNOs don't provide single phase supplies greater than 100A to domestic properties (not sure they will ever provide more than 100A SP) so the supply must be 3 phase, in which case you'll be having a much bigger consumer unit than anything you've seen in a regular house.


Have you actually had an electrician look at this?

I think the builder's electrician has looked at it and confirmed it cant fit in the space available. I wanrt to make sure that isnt just a cop out. Also, SPN have said that the incoming cable cant be adjacent to a boiler..news to me.

 

[oscar21]

Are you just adding up all the MCB/RCD values to get 200A? It doesnt work like that.

 

[MDJ]

Its a 3.5 bed/ 1 living room/1 bath/kitchen/1Wc house.

the chances it needs a 200 amp supply allowing for diversity is almost impossible in a normal sized house which from your description this must be, anyhow you will not get bigger than a 100 amp single phase supply anywhere and if you want 3 phase there will be questions that have to be answered. I have a feeling we are dealing with an inexperienced electrician who has added up all the MCB sizes and got close to 200, it doesn't work that way, I very much doubt you will hit 80 amps, even with an electric hob, oven and shower.

 

[westward10]

If the consumer unit doesn't fit the intended space then put it somewhere else either direct to the mains or indirect by way of a switch-fuse if required. It is highly unlikely a dwelling of that size needs 200A and a dual RCD board is not the way forward. This has all the hallmarks of a builder's microscopic knowledge on any subject put before them so seek the advise of a competent independent electrician.

 

[LukeD]

200 amp..... Thats a weed farm in the making !

 

[Rockingit]

the chances it needs a 200 amp supply allowing for diversity is almost impossible in a normal sized house which from your description this must be, anyhow you will not get bigger than a 100 amp single phase supply anywhere and if you want 3 phase there will be questions that have to be answered. I have a feeling we are dealing with an inexperienced electrician who has added up all the MCB sizes and got close to 200, it doesn't work that way, I very much doubt you will hit 80 amps, even with an electric hob, oven and shower.

I've a (large, with private water treatment, ground source heating, workshops....) house I built in Devon many years ago - by the 'add it all up' principle I think from memory it was well into the 5-600's. By diversity this fell to something like 350A. It's been sat on a 100A fuse (nb, with full knowledge of the local DNO engineer as we had to get a pole TX installed for it) since forever with zero ill effects at all.