18th Edition cash cow for the IET

[westward10]

Hum ........... a pointless change of a few regs .............. costing us all time and MONEY

Roll on the 19th.

 

[Octopus]

Roll on the 19th.

Yup - will have given up by then............

Wonder what would happen if sparks by the thousands stuck 2 fingers up the IET and the schemes?

Its not as if many people actually give a txss about the regs.

 

[Percyprod]

Regs are basically voluntary, after all, who checks on it? Sure, if you go to the book the work is tested and reported on by the electrician or bc, but if I do some work on my house, who will know, unless there is a serious problem. You can buy all the gear at any diy store, no control there. And 90% of the time there is no problem. If it is done to the 17th edition, great, doesn't need to be tested by an expert, although it is always a good idea. The price of the regs is a rip off, even allowing for it being a relatively small market. I can buy an amateur radio book, a much smaller market, a much bigger book for a fraction of the price.

 

[Percyprod]

Regs are basically voluntary, after all, who checks on it? Sure, if you go to the book the work is tested and reported on by the electrician or bc, but if I do some work on my house, who will know, unless there is a serious problem. You can buy all the gear at any diy store, no control there. And 90% of the time there is no problem. If it is done to the 17th edition, great, doesn't need to be tested by an expert, although it is always a good idea. The price of the regs is a rip off, even allowing for it being a relatively small market. I can buy an amateur radio book, a much smaller market, a much bigger book for a fraction of the price.

 

[Percyprod]

Don't know why it's uploaded twice, sorry!

 

[Percyprod]

Don't know why it's uploaded twice, sorry!

 

[Colin33]

Yet if any of us did go against it and, say refuse to be in a scam and just carry on certifying and giving to the customers only what they expect - ie the EIC EICR or MWC - no one would come after us. No one.
LABC don’t want anything to do with part P so they give it to the schemes to control.
Nothing would happen. Let’s do it - REVOLUTION!
Let’s have a cup of tea first though!

I've never been part of any scam/scheme. And you're right, because no one has ever come after me! Most of my work has been single new builds and renovation projects where Building control are already involved. I say to them that I'm fully qualified, are they happy for me to do the work? They say, "can you certify your work?" I say, "yes of course". At the end of the job a copy of the certification goes in their folder and job done. Only once has a BC guy asked to see my quals which I duly showed him, along with insurance of course. I've never understood why so many people bother with the scams when there are obviously ways around the system. I've never heard of anyone being taken to court for not complying with Part P unless of course they've been found to be doing sub-standard or dangerous work. So, as long as you're qualified and competent, and work to the regs, then what's to worry about? Finish that tea and join the revolution!

 

[Midwest]

I've never been part of any scam/scheme. And you're right, because no one has ever come after me! Most of my work has been single new builds and renovation projects where Building control are already involved. I say to them that I'm fully qualified, are they happy for me to do the work? They say, "can you certify your work?" I say, "yes of course". At the end of the job a copy of the certification goes in their folder and job done. Only once has a BC guy asked to see my quals which I duly showed him, along with insurance of course. I've never understood why so many people bother with the scams when there are obviously ways around the system. I've never heard of anyone being taken to court for not complying with Part P unless of course they've been found to be doing sub-standard or dangerous work. So, as long as you're qualified and competent, and work to the regs, then what's to worry about? Finish that tea and join the revolution!

Of course your right, I've not heard of many electricians being prosecuted for not being in a scheme as you've mentioned.

However, it is a criminal offence, not complying with Building regs (Part P), and punishable with a fine up to £5000. It may also be possible that your clients are complicit in the offence, and could also be liable, 'With all building work, the owner of the property (or land) in question is ultimately responsible for complying with the relevant planning rules and building regulations (regardless of the need to apply for planning permission and/or building regulations approval or not)' (Planning Portal).

So if your not complying with Sect 3.1 Part P (England & Wales), you're a very naughty boy, and putting your clients at risk of prosecution. You may also be invalidating your insurance.

So however guiling it is, and it is, its the law. ​

 

[Midwest]

Let me know what that is

To be fair with OP, he offered to share his secret of job opportunity with me.

 

[happysteve]

Yet to comply with 18th I'm going to have to take a 3 day top up course costing £520 and with 3 days loss of earnings, and the books, I'll be close to £2,000 out of pocket.

Some training centres will be offering a 1-day top-up course for those who already have the 2382-15 qualification (i.e. the 17th Edition to the 3rd Amendment) and who are already up to speed with the current Regs. In the morning you just go through the changes, and sit the exam in the afternoon, for (e.g.) £225 including certificate fees and VAT.

It's not ideal, but it's a bit cheaper than £520, and you only lose a day's work.

 

[Colin33]

Of course your right, I've not heard of many electricians being prosecuted for not being in a scheme as you've mentioned.

However, it is a criminal offence, not complying with Building regs (Part P), and punishable with a fine up to £5000. It may also be possible that your clients are complicit in the offence, and could also be liable, 'With all building work, the owner of the property (or land) in question is ultimately responsible for complying with the relevant planning rules and building regulations (regardless of the need to apply for planning permission and/or building regulations approval or not)' (Planning Portal).

So if your not complying with Sect 3.1 Part P (England & Wales), you're a very naughty boy, and putting your clients at risk of prosecution. You may also be invalidating your insurance.

So however guiling it is, and it is, its the law. ​

I suppose the maximum fine for speeding is £2500, but I don't know anyone who's ever had to pay that. There's always that little element of risk but it makes life more exciting Looking at that particular wording it seems that the spark may not be liable at all, with all the onus on the client to comply?

 

[Marti]

for the digital / pdf versions of the books and ...

The what! Been chasing the IET for updates on this for months. Dylexia makes the processed tree version a bit of a challenge. Their grasping, money grabbing answer...I can pay a yearly fee of £100 to access the bloody thing on line. No £100 or no internet signal, no access.

Someone with money and time could probably challenge this in the courts under equal access. Me, gotta go to work to pay the IET extortion money.

 

[Marti]

for the digital / pdf versions of the books and ...

The what! Been chasing the IET for updates on this for months. Dylexia makes the processed tree version a bit of a challenge. Their grasping, money grabbing answer...I can pay a yearly fee of £100 to access the bloody thing on line. No £100 or no internet signal, no access.

Someone with money and time could probably challenge this in the courts under equal access. Me, gotta go to work to pay the IET extortion money.

 

[Percyprod]

Although it is against the law to not comply with part p etc, it is also against the law to use a mobile phone, eat or drink whilst driving, yet people do, and 90% of thr time get away with it. Mostly, it is not actually dangerous, but it could be. The consequences could be several people being killed or injured. Even if an electrical installation is dangerous, usua
Lt only one person is affected, still one to many. Same spplues to working on vehicles. How many people on here work on their cars or vans, yet have no qualifications to do so. Again could be very dangerous. Yet someone who asks for advice on here and may do a perfect job on a rewire is slated for not being qualified to do so.

 

[ashrow]

I don't think we should complain....
Plumbers charge so much more as they have to do various updates for their gas/oil etc and they get away with charging their day rate etc due to their over heads.
Us electricians need to start charging what the job is worth.
We have to pay the tax man from our profits but the books and training are running costs......so ie we have to pay someone so let it be us to improve what we offer.

 

[sparksfly]

I did approach the IET stand end of last year at a trade show and questioned why the 17th Amd 3, along with other relevant books, was not on discount as the 18th is 10 months away....reply..."We are not allowed to...sorry".

 

[MFS Electrical]

The way the digital books are supplied, you would have to licence the digital copy to e.g. a single laptop then share that one laptop around.

Compile a pdf of screenshots?

 

[MFS Electrical]

View attachment 41855 I got mine today at ELEX at Westpoint Exeter - here is a picture of it with IGOR my butler holding it for the camera!


Confirmed today that Earth Rods will not be a requirement for PME systems in the 18th because people from Inverness complained about the impossibility in their rock strewn ground so if everyone can’t do it no one will. We can thank Elecsa for arguing our side.

Is that the small print microscope version or just a very big hand

 

[Octopus]

I think ALL signed up scam members need to warn their scams that the 18th maybe an exam too far , and thus the scams will then be under threat

Somebody needs to speak up for us, and the scams / gravy train have absolutely no incentive to do this for us ......

 

[MFS Electrical]

I think ALL signed up scam members need to warn their scams that the 18th maybe an exam too far , and thus the scams will then be under threat

Somebody needs to speak up for us, and the scams / gravy train have absolutely no incentive to do this for us ......

Ive never actually heard of anyone failing an amendment update exam or edition update. Thinking it’s not really worth the paper it’s written on and doesn’t prove competency or even prove the person in question knows how to even use the regs books.