Discuss Becoming a electrician in few weeks! (Crash courses) in the Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

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sparkz

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I know a local guy, calls himself a handy man. His doing a Electrical Crash Course with Trade Skills 4 U. He was telling me his going to be more qualified than me because his doing 17th edition and also a Part P course. I believe learning the hardway is the best way. I attended college and did my 16th Edition an NVQ's for 3 years then worked on site for another 2 years as a aprrentice. Thats 5 years of studying. I dont understand how these courses work? How can they combine everything in such a small amount of time. Could someone explain to me what these courses invole?
At the end of the day i did mention to him he wouldnt last long on price work or even getting a job on a building site.

Appreciate your help....
 
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I know a local guy, calls himself a handy man. His doing a Electrical Crash Course with Trade Skills 4 U. He was telling me his going to be more qualified than me because his doing 17th edition and also a Part P course. I believe learning the hardway is the best way. I attended college and did my 16th Edition an NVQ's for 3 years then worked on site for another 2 years as a aprrentice. Thats 5 years of studying. I dont understand how these courses work? How can they combine everything in such a small amount of time. Could someone explain to me what these courses invole?
At the end of the day i did mention to him he wouldnt last long on price work or even getting a job on a building site.

Appreciate your help....
I'm still learning and I've been at the game for 30 years.;)
 
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Stixicus

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  • #3
it would be interesting to see the "pass rates" on these Part P courses - particularly ones run by profit-making training companies rather than colleges etc.
I suspect there will be a very, very high pass rate as I can well imagine they are "cramming" people to pass an exam and not necessarily to understand the principles involved and the reasons that they are so.
 
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wet string

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  • #4
i did one of these 6weeks courses , i served an apprenticeship and worked in various electrical/electronic industries for 20yrs but wanted to go self employed as a domestic installer, yes its cramming based,and your head is spinning after 4weeks of study plus cramming at night,but its a good way of getting all the bits of paper in a short time, the practical work you do is far to short,fortunately i had plenty of experience, just didnt have up to date knowlede of the regs, 2391 sorts the chafe tho. some of the lads there shouldnt have been ,as far to thick and failed every thing, so wasted their money, not cheap.. its not easy either especially if no previous, now got to go and do my 17th, will it never end, all these largely
worthless bits of paper, part p has good intentions, but makes our game more expensive to the clients,who still have work done by cowboys to save loads,most punters arnt worried about a cert. untill part p is properly advertised and some way of enforcing it on clients is found part p will remain an expensive joke......on us.:(
 
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WarrenG

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  • #5
Just to clarify, Part P is NOT a qualification.

Part P is a Building Regulation for electrical safety.
Planning Portal - Approved Document P

The course is to prove that you are competent to safely isolate the supply and remove for example a socket face plate by someone (say a kitchen fitter) who isn't qualified as an electrician but may need to do it in the course of their work. It isn't an electrical qualification hence it is only a short course.

Other that removing and repacing switch and socket plates there isn't much more that can be done because they are not qualified electricians.

Qualified electricians obviously don't need to attend Part P courses because they have far surpassed any competency levels within their years of training at a much higher level.

It is unfortunate that people get the impression that they can attend one of these courses and then believe they are a qualified electrician and its easy. This does happen and has caused may debates.

So the answer to your question is that there is no quick fix, continue as you are doing so and don't worry about a Part P course because your not going to need it.
 
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ezzzekiel

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  • #6
one week course no previous experience needed will give you full scope cert to register for part p (guy who teaches says he only ever knew of one lad who failed the course)
 
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Spudnik

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  • #7
And again.....

You can have all the qualifications in this trade but that DOES NOT make you a good electrician.

All you need to do is wait for the phone call from him to bail him out:D

I know what my answer would be.....
 
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aaronstuart

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  • #8
I did one of these 4 week courses, because i had been in and out of the trade since leaving school (19 yrs ago), Did my 3 year apprenticeship, to the 16 th, but for one reason and another decided to go on my own, so decided this was a good option.

For me it was teriffic and would recommend it to anyone with electrical experience and wants to update qualifications etc....

But for total novices who think they can become a spark in 4 weeks.....NO WAY......
 
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wet string

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  • #9
just dont get snooty about the likes of those who are trying to better themselves, like some do, as has been said, we are all still learning, iv met excellent domestic installers who are aware of their limitations so err on the side of safety and do everything to the book, and time served old lags
who cut corners and use old methods when they should know better.;)
 
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aaronstuart

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  • #10
Not getting snooty i agree with what your saying.

Great if you're working with electricians and using this to improve at a quicker rate.

Agree some poor electricians out there..old school...but alot of good ones too
 
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Spudnik

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  • #11
just dont get snooty about the likes of those who are trying to better themselves, like some do, as has been said, we are all still learning, iv met excellent domestic installers who are aware of their limitations so err on the side of safety and do everything to the book, and time served old lags
who cut corners and use old methods when they should know better.;)
Not the point.

I am all for people wanting to better themselves and learn a new trade, but when you have people like the OP knows then its not surprising when some time served sparks get a little edgy.
 
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wet string

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #12
sorry didnt mean to imply anyone was being snooty,more of a warning to all against getting all superior . like you say good and bad in all trades regardless of the type of training received, a quality attitude to the work you do,and not being scared to stop and find out if theres doubts, counts for a lot, regardless of experience and bits of paper.
 
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Dave

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  • #13
I don't think anyone was getting snooty here.......so lets not get carried away before we hit the enter key...:).....


cheers lads..
 
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aaronstuart

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  • #14
I have been in the trade for along time......but i find this site extremely useful when unsure about certain things.....

You never know everything and are always learning
 
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smoggy

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  • #15
I did one of these courses a couple of years ago, yes it gives you the theory but when you go into the real world you have no practical experience, and that is one steep learning curve :eek:, Went back in Nov and sat my 2391, that was interesting:confused: I did pass tho, hard work and lot's of revision. I still don't call myself an electrician tho. when i have more 3 phase and commercial experience then maybe i will.
 
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Spudnik

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  • #16
I did one of these courses a couple of years ago, yes it gives you the theory but when you go into the real world you have no practical experience, and that is one steep learning curve :eek:, Went back in Nov and sat my 2391, that was interesting:confused: I did pass tho, hard work and lot's of revision. I still don't call myself an electrician tho. when i have more 3 phase and commercial experience then maybe i will.
Good for you!

However, domestic and commercial are different things so commercial experience may not prepare you for what the domestic world throws at you.

Best to try and do them all at some point.

At lease you will then be able to decide which one is right for you.
 
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smoggy

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #17
Good for you!

However, domestic and commercial are different things so commercial experience may not prepare you for what the domestic world throws at you.

Best to try and do them all at some point.

At lease you will then be able to decide which one is right for you.
Thanks
Being going out with my future ex father in law, he does alot of commercial work. I do prefer commercial work, no bloody customers saying don't make a mess, or i don't want my new carpet lifting, can't you run the cable half way round the house:rolleyes:

And i have learnt quite a bit from this forum aswell,
so thanks to you all.:)
 

slocm3105

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Arms
I did one of these courses with a big company, British Gas in fact. In between I worked on site with an electrician of 38 years experience. I'm out on my own for them doing domestic work and I love it. Im pretty confident with most things even rewires etc, just sometimes when you get a dodgy fault from a badly wired house do i struggle a bit, however in the fututre im guna sit through the 2330 Courses and then take it from there, as im only 21 it gives me plenty of time to settle down :).
 
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salisbury spark

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #19
I did my EAL full scope (part p) last summer. - Disgusted that some of the guys are out there now working in houses after seeing there work having not a clue on the course. We had a tutor that was strict ,half the course failed. - Then speaking to my new 2330 tutor at college - he said he had run the part p course and didnt fail anyone - after all they had paid £1000 for the course!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Must agree,im seeing 'corners cut' by electricians with a lifetime of experience.... Steep learning curve for me too. My thanks to all the advice from guys on this site,- I needed it at the start of my business..... Love being out there working as a Part P guy while i finish my 2330. -AGREE THERES NO FAST TRACK- every jobs different and only experience can get you though (and hours of research on products and regs).
 
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alexg

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  • #20
Did mine over 4 months with part home study. Fully registyered with NIC 3 wweks after, and now 2391 and 2392 after 3 months expereience.. Have been busy 85% of working datys at 200 squids a day, and KNOW my work is safe qnd effcetive. Hard work, bit of brains applied and creating my own luck. My take out is that if you want to do a good job - custmers will pick this up - and you will. OK... its' domestic. What's wrong with that? Get over it. Muppets always get found out.

PS I had a desk job before this for 15 years
 
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Anonomoose

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  • #21
hands up I did a "quick course" with a profit run private college place. I thought what they offered was ok as it got me my 17th edition ok and taught me the theory but luckily i was working with an electrician for the last three years or so learnt the pratical too.
I think they should state with them that you should do them along side work experience "apprenterships". As at college i was along side McDonalds managers and shop assistants that between the weeks at college didnt touch a tool and expected to go out on their own once they had finished the course.
Due to unforseen circumstances (a falling out with my boss) i am now starting on my own and have my first part P assessment on 4th Feb (nervous as heck about it) I would have liked to stay with my boss for another year to gain more experience but here we are.
 
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Jutt

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  • #22
I did the trade skills 4 u course 17th & part p as a starter as i was retraining from electronics trade & then enrolled on the 2330 at college to learn the trade properly & can tell you there is no way he is more qualified than a proper sparks, it's a good starting point if your re-training but if you think you can do theses 3 week courses & think your a spark then you have another thing coming. I'm luckily enough to of found a company that will take me on while i'm doing the 2330 & can tell you site experience is the key & have learnt so much more, theses courses are good but just a starting point, but are good if your already a spark & need the 17th.
 

Des 56

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Arms
Esteemed
IUts a pity that these courses cant be outlawed
The tried and tested way of becoming a competent electrician is the apprentiship route
For anybody deluding themselves that a short course will give that competence then either the person themselves are in for a surprise or the customers they sevice will probably be put in unknown and unforseen danger by inexperience
Do it right or not at all
It only lowers the perseption of the trade which has been demonstrated the last few years notably by the niceic who have welcomed these charletons for gain without thought of safety
 

slocm3105

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Arms
IUts a pity that these courses cant be outlawed
The tried and tested way of becoming a competent electrician is the apprentiship route
For anybody deluding themselves that a short course will give that competence then either the person themselves are in for a surprise or the customers they sevice will probably be put in unknown and unforseen danger by inexperience
Do it right or not at all
It only lowers the perseption of the trade which has been demonstrated the last few years notably by the niceic who have welcomed these charletons for gain without thought of safety
I really think that you have a bad perception of these "short courses", it really depends on the person and HOW they utilize their learning experience, I agree totally that if you did a 4 week short course, then went out on your own house bashing it would be dangerous to say the least. However, my course was run over a period of 9 months with working on site in between to give me that valuable experience needed to undertake the maintenance and installation of Domestic wiring. I always do all my work correctly, safely and according to regs, so please dont slate all involved with these as there as still many of us who will do a good job, safely and progress onto being very good electricians.

Thanks
 
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ezzzekiel

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #25
took me years to get qualified and more importantly experienced, however nothing wrong with short courses as long as you only do work you are capable of doing and know your limitations.

problem is everyone is different and a lot of these short courses are passing people who quite simply are not capable - if your good enough then fair enough good luck to ya - but if your not fail them and insist on further training - like everything else in the industry theres not enough regulation........

for what its worth.
 
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Tiger

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  • #26
IUts a pity that these courses cant be outlawed
The tried and tested way of becoming a competent electrician is the apprentiship route
For anybody deluding themselves that a short course will give that competence then either the person themselves are in for a surprise or the customers they sevice will probably be put in unknown and unforseen danger by inexperience
Do it right or not at all
It only lowers the perseption of the trade which has been demonstrated the last few years notably by the niceic who have welcomed these charletons for gain without thought of safety

I must be missing something. Before part P There was nothing to stop Joe public or any cowboy carrying out electrical works. Now at least we have a standard and maybe it can be improved on but I personally think that anybody taking these courses are inteligent minded people and can't imagine half whitt cowboys being able to pass.

At least now someone can now be held acccountable for works carried out and yearly inspections to keep people on there toes.
 
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peterspark70

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  • #27
I must be missing something. Before part P There was nothing to stop Joe public or any cowboy carrying out electrical works. Now at least we have a standard and maybe it can be improved on but I personally think that anybody taking these courses are inteligent minded people and can't imagine half whitt cowboys being able to pass.

At least now someone can now be held acccountable for works carried out and yearly inspections to keep people on there toes.
i cant beleave what i am reading about these happy go lucky courses, who runs these courses B & Q lol save your money and go have alook at the display boards in the stores ( cowboys). started as electricians mate and went to night school ,how it should be done!!!!!!!!!!!!!
it took me 7 years night school one day aweek hard gaft and took my, AM1 , NVQ3 and my 2391 , 17 th edition and graded JIB approved electrician IT JUST TAKES (P*** OUT OF SKILLED TRADES ) I HAVE HAD MY OWN COMPANY FOR 5 YEARS , AND I WAS TOLD THAT YOU WILL NEVER STOP LEARNING, HOW TRUE HE WAS!!!!! BEEN A ELECTRICIAN FOR 16 YRS
 
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wet string

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  • #28
I don't think anyone was getting snooty here.......so lets not get carried away before we hit the enter key...:).....


cheers lads..
message from admin at start of debate,
 
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smoggy

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #29
i cant beleave what i am reading about these happy go lucky courses, who runs these courses B & Q lol save your money and go have alook at the display boards in the stores ( cowboys). started as electricians mate and went to night school ,how it should be done!!!!!!!!!!!!!
it took me 7 years night school one day aweek hard gaft and took my, AM1 , NVQ3 and my 2391 , 17 th edition and graded JIB approved electrician IT JUST TAKES (P*** OUT OF SKILLED TRADES ) I HAVE HAD MY OWN COMPANY FOR 5 YEARS , AND I WAS TOLD THAT YOU WILL NEVER STOP LEARNING, HOW TRUE HE WAS!!!!! BEEN A ELECTRICIAN FOR 16 YRS
So you are saying if you had to start out now you wouldn't do one of these courses.?:rolleyes: Seems to be a bit of envy from so called time served sparks that these courses wern't available at the time.:eek:
When i was doing my 17th and 2391 couple of guys who were supposed to be experienced. FAILED. I don't call myself an electrician (Domestic Installer) is correct term. If i am asked to look at a job outside my experience i decline, recommend an Electrician.:D
 
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Tiger

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #30
i cant beleave what i am reading about these happy go lucky courses, who runs these courses B & Q lol save your money and go have alook at the display boards in the stores ( cowboys). started as electricians mate and went to night school ,how it should be done!!!!!!!!!!!!!
it took me 7 years night school one day aweek hard gaft and took my, AM1 , NVQ3 and my 2391 , 17 th edition and graded JIB approved electrician IT JUST TAKES (P*** OUT OF SKILLED TRADES ) I HAVE HAD MY OWN COMPANY FOR 5 YEARS , AND I WAS TOLD THAT YOU WILL NEVER STOP LEARNING, HOW TRUE HE WAS!!!!! BEEN A ELECTRICIAN FOR 16 YRS
I think you compleately missed my point. get off your high horse. point being at least there is a standard now to protect customers before there wasn't.
 
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wet string

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #31
example, my shower stopped working, landlord sent an odd job man to replace it,
not impressed so complained that a sparky should have at least checked it, so out comes the letting agents electrician, nice bloke i spoke to him as i was awaiting my niceic at the time,he was an old lag, time served,with his own firm couple of apprentices etc. and later worked with him. but all he did was check that the connections were good in the shower... dont need a cert.as its like for like he said as he left. now if that was me as a dommy i would have at least checked the bonding, non evident, and the IR, and recommended fitting an rcbo, he didnt even look at the fusebox ! experienced yes, assuming definately, i went on a rewire job as he was short handed, minimum amount of power and lighting outlets,and didnt put protection over notched joist, despite my suggestion, put smokes on rcd lighting circuit and so on, all he was interested in was getting offsite asap with the cash, i was reminded of Harry Enfields, 'loads of money , splish splash splosh, loads of dosh.'
 
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Tiger

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #32
I think unfortunately you will find that in all trades it dosnt matter how qualified you are some peolpe will cut corners and just take the money. Which is why i think it is a good thing that now someone is accountable for electrical works in a domestic household.
 
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peterspark70

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #33
i think you compleately missed my point. Get off your high horse. Point being at least there is a standard now to protect customers before there wasn't.
some one needs to tell all the customers about the part p ,9 out of 10 people do not know any thing about it, why dont these part p company (napit niceic ) put adverts on tv & radio to explane the part p ,they can use some of the membership money which i keep paying since this fast started
cheers
 
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wet string

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #34
completely agree and have posted similar, most punters arnt interested in getting a cert. as long as it means a cheaper job, part p wont work as it was designed to unless theres a a campaign to inform joe public, and building control work out how to police it, untill then its just an expensive joke on us, that goes for upgrading bonding and rcds as well, its like a plumber being asked to fit an extra sink, who disapears into the loft for an hour only to return and tell the punter they need to upgrade their boiler and mains supply first, ....if they are not informed they about the regs, its no wonder they think you are just on the make
 
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Spudnik

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #35
Chaps, can we calm down a bit.

Remember this is a friendly forum and i'd like to keep it that way.

Cheers.
 
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Sue kelly

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #36
Hi everyone, Iam looking for advice, iam 28, female and have been interested in doin electrician since i was 18 but i chickened out!! am I too old to apply now?
 
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adamh

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #38
If your easy on the eye you will have no problems!
 

cbw

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Hahahahahaha......I think the original post sounds better!!!!!!


(Not what I meant but no harm in bluffing)
 
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Engineer54

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #41
Hi everyone, Iam looking for advice, iam 28, female and have been interested in doin electrician since i was 18 but i chickened out!! am I too old to apply now?
I'm sure there are plenty of electricians in your area that you can ''do'' at 28. Are you sure you won't chicken out again though?? lol!!!!
 
I also dd the fast track courses after working in the motor trade as a master technician/auto electrician for ten years. How do people see me
 
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ps64

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #45
I'm on one of these courses right now (with et4u) and they say that we will definitely not be top sparks on completion, that's given. However we will have done testing, 17th ed., design and wiring circuits, and be 'safe and competent' enough to register with napit, niceic etc. LOnger courses spend much time learning about extinguishers, cpr, life skills etc so long doesn't always mean better. The 4 week courses are a good grounding in electrics though

My aim is to get some work as a mate for a spark so I can gain experience and confidence and only then will I even consider thinking of myself as an electrician, that will take years.
 
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sparks1973

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #46
example, my shower stopped working, landlord sent an odd job man to replace it,
not impressed so complained that a sparky should have at least checked it, so out comes the letting agents electrician, nice bloke i spoke to him as i was awaiting my niceic at the time,he was an old lag, time served,with his own firm couple of apprentices etc. and later worked with him. but all he did was check that the connections were good in the shower... dont need a cert.as its like for like he said as he left. now if that was me as a dommy i would have at least checked the bonding, non evident, and the IR, and recommended fitting an rcbo, he didnt even look at the fusebox ! experienced yes, assuming definately, i went on a rewire job as he was short handed, minimum amount of power and lighting outlets,and didnt put protection over notched joist, despite my suggestion, put smokes on rcd lighting circuit and so on, all he was interested in was getting offsite asap with the cash, i was reminded of Harry Enfields, 'loads of money , splish splash splosh, loads of dosh.'
well part of me thinks...you get what you pays for......but another part of me thinks....how appalling
not to ensure that the circuit in question was fit for continued service.....and also not to ensure that either:
1) supplementary bonding was in place
2) additional protection by means of RCD was not installed
these are boxes that are on a SOI by the way.....
 

kingeri

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Arms
Nothing like dredging up a well ancient thread with a badly written post and then not even bothering to respond again. Is there?
 

ipf

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Mentor
Arms
Esteemed
Nothing like dredging up a well ancient thread with a badly written post and then not even bothering to respond again. Is there?
Probably because she's beetroot red after that illiterate gaff.....poor lass.
 
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hutch6447

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #50
There seems to be loads of negativity about this subject it confuses the **** out of me.

As a Qualified electrician in forces (Royal Engineers EOD) because of the nature of are job we do it for 2 years then get hurled off to bomb disposal for 4 years then hurled back into electrics and so on, now because I decided I didn't want to get blown up any more I decided to leave and in my re settlement year did all the courses to bring me up to standard for domestic work eg. Part P, 17th edition as I had 16 Testing & Inspection I found the course good and was a good refresher I found myself confident enough to work for myself but also working with others on big Re-wires some of these people were Electricians and some Domestic Installers, domestic installers were fine to work with but I also have experience of these forums and to be honest if someone wants advice or tips he doesn't get it he just gets comments to lower his confidence presumably.

So were does this leave me an electrician qualified in forces but need to do the 4-5 week course to get necessary qualifications to work domestically which is what I wanted to do, domestic installer or apprenticeship for 5 years or JIB card or Elecsa, NIC EIC there is more than one way to skin a cat.

I am taking my 2391 or the new form of it soon cause its been split into 2, is it worth going on this forum for advice or will you just get worthless comments that really don,t help.

Soz about the story but its all confusing having been In the army bubble for 12 years?
 

Des 56

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Arms
Esteemed
Short courses may be the perfect tool for your own situation converting from a forces background to a civilian occupation
It may not be so perfect for someone new to the trade

Who ever says training in the forces is somehow inferior to civilian training, or somehow the person working in electrics in the forces is not an electrician outside is talking through their rear end

The intensity of training may be much more in the forces than outside, 6 months or more of intense no nonesense classroom followed by supervised ongoing practical experience ,with added training as time progresses,its top notch and unlikely to be surpassed in a civilian occupation

If you were trained in the forces as an electrician,then you are an electrican end of
 
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hutch6447

  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #52
Yes but at the end of the day you don't know everything and you have skill fade so when you go on this forum just for confirmation they shot you down. I aint gonna lye trained in forces also done domestic installers course gone self employed, its nice to ask questions and get confirmation!
 

ipf

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Mentor
Arms
Esteemed
Yes but at the end of the day you don't know everything and you have skill fade so when you go on this forum just for confirmation they shot you down. I aint gonna lye trained in forces also done domestic installers course gone self employed, its nice to ask questions and get confirmation!
Don't be on the back foot if you need advice. As has been said, it's those starting from scratch, without experience, who think they are qualified to a suitable degree, who cause most grief . Most can see that and comment as a result. Ignore the ignorant who can't. If those asking for help explained their situation it would remove a lot of the presumption.
 

HandySparks

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Stick a short summary of your background and quals in your profile page on this forum and fill in the "location". Then put a reminder in the post when you ask a question. You're much less likely to run into trouble here if members know who they're talking to.
 
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