How much to charge for an EICR

[Rpa07]

Those little buttons are too close together and as the 'like' and 'dislike' are next to each other I nearly gave up trying to 'like' a post on my phone. I didn't know what that brown box on the right was, I thought it was an envelope! I need a bigger phone or better eyes, whichever one is cheaper or doesn't hurt!

 

[Mumfi]

Is that for a 1bedroom flat with 2 circuits.

No I think most of the tests are for the local authority so I would guess it woud be for a three bedroom house

 

[Deleted account]

No I think most of the tests are for the local authority so I would guess it woud be for a three bedroom house

Wow! How can 3 get done in a day?

 

[Mumfi]

I guess by working very fast and doing the paperwork in the evening

 

[Mumfi]

Worked for a company back in 2011 who expected testers to test 40 circuits a day, this was a large concern with many sparkies (but a high turnover of workers), the testing consisted of a quick resistance rest and maybe a trip of the RCD, the rest was "calculated" in the office. This company has contracts for local authorities testing schools, swimming pools and offices. I don't think a test can be carried out properly and the tester make any money at it.

 

[Octopus]

I guess by cutting corners and prolific use of "LIM" and doing the paperwork in the evening

corrected that for you.

 

[SparkyChick]

Wow! How can 3 get done in a day?

By not being very thorough. Our house had a fault on the ring, it's had two inspections since it was installed (the affected ring was tested apparently) and deemed to be satisfactory because Zs was OK, despite other tests indicating an issue.

When I changed the CU as a result of a fault, I spotted the issue straight away, r2 was way over what I expected to see given r1 and rn. Turned out to be a loose earth connection in one socket that had never been touched since the day it was installed. Took the socket off the wall and the CPCs practically fell out of the terminal.

 

[Mumfi]

I thought that a high resistance reading was ok if you have an RCD somewhere , usually as a main switch? Up to a few hundred ohms?

 

[Mumfi]

I thought that a high resistance reading was ok if you have an RCD somewhere , usually as a main switch? Up to a few hundred ohms?

Is zs another name foe resistance ?

 

[Mumfi]

What does the z stand for?

 

[Octopus]

A high zs should be checked by confirming R1 + R2

 

[Mumfi]

A high zs should be checked by confirming R1 + R2

What is the r1 and r2?

 

[westward10]

What is the r1 and r2?

Are you winding people up.

 

[Octopus]

What is the r1 and r2?

You aren't a spark then!

It's capitals.... Lower case is something very different

 

[davesparks]

What does the z stand for?

Z is impedance

 

[Mumfi]

You aren't a spark then!

It's capitals.... Lower case is something very different

Yes Ive been doing electrical work of about 40 years

 

[Mumfi]

But not come across Z

 

[Deleted account]

But not come across Z

You have come across Zs & Ze. Surely.

Please no jokes regarding don't call me surely

 

[Deleted account]

I've just been reading a certain members comments on other threads and have concluded that I am not going to bite any more. Troll was mentioned by another member. I think your right.

 

[Mumfi]

I'm sorry you are unwilling to furnish me with the answers to my questions, I thought that the function of this site was to pass on relevant information. Still don't know what a troll is.

 

[SparkyChick]

I suggest you use Google and run a search for "internet troll", but just in case you're not....

As @davesparks has stated Z is used to refer to impedance.

Zs is the earth fault loop impedance at a point on a given circuit. Ze is the external earth fault loop impedance (measure at the origin of the installation).

Zs = Ze + (R1 + R2)

Where R1 is the resistance of the line conductor from the consumer unit to a given point on a circuit and R2 is the resistance of the CPC from the consumer unit to that same point on the circuit.

We are obliged to ensure Zs is within specified limits to ensure the protective devices operate correctly within the required timescales. And yes, if you breach Zs and you have an RCD present you can use that as the fall back for fault protection as the maximum Zs permissible is much higher than that for MCBs and RCBOs.

And to clarify the difference... r1 (as opposed to R1) is the end to end continuity of a ring final circuit line conductor (like rn is end to end for the neutral, r2 is end to end for the CPC). Using those you can gain some insight as to whether your RFC is connected as expected as R1+R2 should be approximately (r1+r2)/4. Likewise R1+Rn should be approximately (r1+rn)/4.

 

[Upton Sparks]

As stated above it a free market, you can Charge what you like, but....
If you've not done them before its good Patrice to start, but you really should make sure your confident in doing them, there is quite a bit of responsibility here your taking on/ Liability, your making a profession statement about an electrical installation in comparison to the wiring Regulations. you should also check out GN3 as it will help you a lot with the Testing. for example you don't want to do the R1 + R2 on the Lighting circuit as this means you will have to remove all the fitting. Now in some simple house hold installation that might be fine but in reality its a nightmare, modern houses Can have loads spot lights, wall lights under cupboard lights, blah blah blah. you get the idea, A 30m length of earth cable 1.5 or a wonder lead if your posh and do the R2 read supported by Zs at the Extremity of the circuit, if you can find it.

Price Wise, as a guild Which I think is reasonable and a fair price for domestic house hold, a small flat 4-6 circuits , £100- £150 if its a 3 bed house£150- £200 large hosue £200 plus, the paper work will take you a few hours to fill out, depending on whats wrong and I have always had to wright a report with them, you don 't make any money per-say out of EICR but they sometimes lead to work and I find they are a good tool in building trust with the customer if you know what your talking about.

Hope that Helps

 

[Mumfi]

I suggest you use Google and run a search for "internet troll", but just in case you're not....

As @davesparks has stated Z is used to refer to impedance.

Zs is the earth fault loop impedance at a point on a given circuit. Ze is the external earth fault loop impedance (measure at the origin of the installation).

Zs = Ze + (R1 + R2)

Where R1 is the resistance of the line conductor from the consumer unit to a given point on a circuit and R2 is the resistance of the CPC from the consumer unit to that same point on the circuit.

We are obliged to ensure Zs is within specified limits to ensure the protective devices operate correctly within the required timescales. And yes, if you breach Zs and you have an RCD present you can use that as the fall back for fault protection as the maximum Zs permissible is much higher than that for MCBs and RCBOs.

And to clarify the difference... r1 (as opposed to R1) is the end to end continuity of a ring final circuit line conductor (like rn is end to end for the neutral, r2 is end to end for the CPC). Using those you can gain some insight as to whether your RFC is connected as expected as R1+R2 should be approximately (r1+r2)/4. Likewise R1+Rn should be approximately (r1+rn)/4.

I thankyou very much for that information it is most useful in my understanding of the problem. It is not my intention to carry out any Trolling I just need the answers to my questions which I think is what this site is about

 

[Octopus]

^^ you need to answer questions too. On. Another thread you claim to only earn £8k per year.. Which is clearly not accurate for a full time spark

 

[Mumfi]

^^ you need to answer questions too. On. Another thread you claim to only earn £8k per year.. Which is clearly not accurate for a full time spark

I think I said that my take home pay was 8000, which is what I end up with after all my business expenses are paid eg Accountants fees, van costs,diesel,insurance in its various forms and all the rest, just checking to see if I'm being correct in what I say...Looking at accounts and on a turn over of 26,144 my costs were 19,105 leaving 7039 so a little under 8000

 

[Mumfi]

I think I said that my take home pay was 8000, which is what I end up with after all my business expenses are paid eg Accountants fees, van costs,diesel,insurance in its various forms and all the rest, just checking to see if I'm being correct in what I say...Looking at accounts and on a turn over of 26,144 my costs were 19,105 leaving 7039 so a little under 8000

So any advice as to where I'm going wrong will be gratefully received because clearly I am doing something incorrectly ..many thanks

 

[HandySparks]

So any advice as to where I'm going wrong will be gratefully received because clearly I am doing something incorrectly ..many thanks

How about starting another thread listing your expenses in detail and see if anyone can suggest where savings could be made. On the face of it, your expenses seem high in relation to turnover.

Edit: On the other hand, if you're managing to include your mortgage or rent as a 'business expense', then maybe your expenses are reasonable!

 

[Octopus]

I think I said that my take home pay was 8000, which is what I end up with after all my business expenses are paid eg Accountants fees, van costs,diesel,insurance in its various forms and all the rest, just checking to see if I'm being correct in what I say...Looking at accounts and on a turn over of 26,144 my costs were 19,105 leaving 7039 so a little under 8000

Costs of £19k, really..... Take home just over £7k...... Doesn't add up

 

[Mumfi]

How about starting another thread listing your expenses in detail and see if anyone can suggest where savings could be made. On the face of it, your expenses seem high in relation to turnover.

Edit: On the other hand, if you're managing to include your mortgage or rent as a 'business expense', then maybe your expenses are reasonable!

Yes I was of the opinion that these costs may be high, but talking to others that I work with they seem to be inline with what they pay, alas no mortgage only rent , others have suggested increasing turnover in some way. Looking at the costs, fuel seems to make up a fair chunk at nearly 4000, and van lease of 2796 per year. I'm not sure if this is in line with what other people expect to pay?

 

[Mumfi]

Yes I was of the opinion that these costs may be high, but talking to others that I work with they seem to be inline with what they pay, alas no mortgage only rent , others have suggested increasing turnover in some way. Looking at the costs, fuel seems to make up a fair chunk at nearly 4000, and van lease of 2796 per year. I'm not sure if this is in line with what other people expect to pay?

Accountant says that I must pay a sum of money for the use of a room as I may get stung for business rates ....don't want that

 

[Octopus]

So £19K total expenses , less £4K fuel (which sounds high), less £2796 van equals £12204 of "other costs" - really?

Last year, my total business expenses (I own my vehicle outright) came to £6916 all in (excluding income tax and NI)... as Handsparks suggested, maybe you should start another thread as something sounds very wrong to me

 

[Mumfi]

Ok so it seems that I'm paying too much for something, without betraying any commercial confidences can I as if you turnover is more or less than mine, many thanks

 

[Mumfi]

sorry ask

 

[Octopus]

My turn over last year was just over £70K

 

[Mumfi]

My turn over last year was just over £70K

Wow, I'm very puzzled now at my costs

 

[Octopus]

^^ you and me both...

I give up... troll

 

[WiganCasino]

Great i'm doing one next week { Only observing & Learning as my friend is doing one } So i will get back to you on this one next Wednesday maybe From South Yorkshire.

 

[WiganCasino]

Well i did my first EICR last week { Well watched as a Competent person did it } there was 7 to test 2 sockets to replace & 2 light fittings to replace it took us 3 hours to do but remember he was instructing me all the way through on a small 2 up 2 down house but it was really great to actually see it for real as i've had to learn at home on my own at home due to lack of funds from online tuition so it was great for me to see how easy it was compared to the complicated written instruction i've had to follow so far i've passed my part P { Buildings regulations for electricians } my Health & Safety exam for my ECS Card & my 2382 17th edition exam that i failed by 10% a few moths ago. I've been invited out to do some more testing this week but my Yellow 17th edition book has fallen to bits & i could do with a new one so anyone got one i can have that would be great anyway took the online test on this site today & got 55% Gutted onwards & upwards maybe HA HA

 

[Deleted account]

Hi Danny,
Pleased you enjoyed you EICR.

As for the big yellow book, you should be able to pick one up really cheap as the new 18th edition is in the pipeline so the 17th will be obsolete soon.
If your working with other sparks who have access to book I wouldn't bother getting one until the new blue book is out unless you really need to.

I'm impressed you got a full EICR done on 7 circuits in just 3 hours. It would take me a full 7-8 hour day to do an EICR without doing any work like replacing sockets and light fittings.

Curious to know how long it takes others to do an EICR.

Pete

 

[Octopus]

^^ took me 2 hours once to find out exactly what was on what circuit in an extended house