Re Garage installation

[ipf]

Not wishing to add my twopenneth to a terminated thread, but along the same lines.

I was asked by an ex industrial client to install a couple of extra sockets in his brand new, 4 bed house, really nice joint, out in the sticks. Getting ready to move in.
No prob doing the job really, the garage wasn't involved...until I had a look in the external incommer box.
PME labelled supply, 80 amp fuse, isolator fitted
Henly blocks with one set of tails to the CU and a 10mm, 3c SWA also connected. SWA not glanded, just open, with one 10mm core taped g/y, end stripped and in mid air. No separate isolation or protection and a definite lack of room.
Hello, hello??



Trip to the garage. Insulated cu with swa supply not glanded and steel wire heatshrunk (or taped) not terminated or earthed.
The 10mm core taped g/y was connected to the earth bar with another 10mm off to a rod, in mucho crapo cheap plastic flexible conduit to a stop end plastic conduit box in the ground.
The garage is wired completely in plastic conduit, sockets all over the place, not an RCD to be seen.
At this point the builder shows up and explains that the electrician doing the job is NIC and when asked to provide the EIC he rushed off and came back with the Part Pee, not the full cert.

Anyway, it's up in the air at present. I'm 50 miles away waiting for the EIC details before I do a MWC with additional notes

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Not sure why you are 'policing' the garage install when it has nothing to do with your house install.Sounds like a builder installed afterthought .....just note the observed defects on the comments of your MWC and it's up to the client to chase it.

 

[Engineer54]

Haha, so the highly acclaimed NICEIC brigade strikes out again!!

Just do as wirepuller suggests, and observe the noted defects in he comments on your MWC.

 

[ipf]

Not sure why you are 'policing' the garage install when it has nothing to do with your house install.Sounds like a builder installed afterthought .....just note the observed defects on the comments of your MWC and it's up to the client to chase it.

I am 'policing', as you call it, because the client is of good standing and has been a good business customer for the last 20 years. I know the family well and he wants things right for when they move in. As a result, I am involved.
What would you do, ignore and form fill, then get involved a few weeks down the line when the questions start regarding the defects listed.

You are indeed correct (amazingly) regarding the afterthought, I wouldn't have thought of that......honestly. Do you think you're talking to someone on the DIY section.

As regards noting the defects, what do you think the last paragraph of the OP refers to.

I'm not posting asking what to do, just a point of interest.

Oh, and by the way, just happened to find out when the builder asked me to look...the unoccupied detached house next door is exactly the same.

 

[Deleted member 9648]

I am 'policing', as you call it, because the client is of good standing and has been a good business customer for the last 20 years. I know the family well and he wants things right for when they move in. As a result, I am involved.
What would you do, ignore and form fill, then get involved a few weeks down the line when the questions start regarding the defects listed. Fair enough,I'd do the same if personally involved.That wasnt made clear in the OP though

You are indeed correct (amazingly) regarding the afterthought, I wouldn't have thought of that......honestly. Do you think you're talking to someone on the DIY section.Why the sarcasm?I did not question your ability,merely your motives in interferring in something which did not concern you based on the information you gave in post 1. There are enough ego-tripping-electrical-police-do-gooders on here as it is,without you adding to them!


As regards noting the defects, what do you think the last paragraph of the OP refers to. It does indeed refer....but the previous paragraphs refer to a lot more than just noting on a MWC

I'm not posting asking what to do, just a point of interest.

Oh, and by the way, just happened to find out when the builder asked me to look...the unoccupied detached house next door is exactly the same.

................

 

[guest119]

Come on now girls, lets not let the Electrical Trainee brigade see us argueing.

Boydy

 

[ipf]

................

Both being a bit presumptuous perhaps. Bit of a cob on yesterday, so sorry if any offence.

Sometimes, to give the whole story takes a page or ten, so cut things down to pretty basic.

 

[markc123]

Now lads, don't get in a muddle...

Iron out the differences with a kiss & cuddle...

Or is that just how they do things on site around here? :leaving:

 

[ipf]

It seems the original spark has been back on site and fitted 'a switch,' in the meter cupboard, for the garage supply. What the 'switch' is god knows. Just been asked to go down, probably next week and check things out, with a view to installing some garden lighting. I'll be about 25 miles away tomorrow so I may call for a quick view, if i can get an hour.

Could prove interesting as I'm sure the supply will have to be taken from the garage.
Hope he's not botched it up even more.

 

[markc123]

Sounds like a FCU feeding twin and earth clipped(if you're lucky) down the garden fence, through a knocked out brick into the garage to feed a gizzilion (it is a number, i swear) sockets and lights.

The very best of luck

 

[ipf]

Sounds like a FCU feeding twin and earth clipped(if you're lucky) down the garden fence, through a knocked out brick into the garage to feed a gizzilion (it is a number, i swear) sockets and lights.

The very best of luck

Looks like you've got it taped.......fancy a job. :wink5:

 

[NJG28]

Come on now girls, lets not let the Electrical Trainee brigade see us argueing.

Boydy

Too Late ! LOL

 

[ipf]

Too Late ! LOL

Yeah, about 2 weeks too late.

 

[Engineer54]

I am 'policing', as you call it, because the client is of good standing and has been a good business customer for the last 20 years. I know the family well and he wants things right for when they move in. As a result, I am involved.
What would you do, ignore and form fill, then get involved a few weeks down the line when the questions start regarding the defects listed.

You are indeed correct (amazingly) regarding the afterthought, I wouldn't have thought of that......honestly. Do you think you're talking to someone on the DIY section.

As regards noting the defects, what do you think the last paragraph of the OP refers to.

I'm not posting asking what to do, just a point of interest.

Oh, and by the way, just happened to find out when the builder asked me to look...the unoccupied detached house next door is exactly the same.

So, have you explained all these defects that you've found to your client?? If it's a new build, then your client should be instructing the builder to correct these defects at his own cost....

 

[ipf]

Well...as I feared, if not worse. He's been back to rectify.
9''x6''x3'' plastic adaptable box fitted below the meter cupboard, at all angles to the wall resulting in the lid not mounting properly...so much for weatherproof.
Din rail and 60 amp dp switch and earth block inside. Swa glanded, internal banjo with 6mm roofing bolt and square nut. Earth cable to block with 3rd core earth. Shroud forgotten, slitted and black taped.
Earth loop at incommer 0.17ohm, at adaptable box about a foot away 72 ohm.
Still no sign of an RCD.
Shame I can't get photos up, phone problem.
The owner isn't best pleased and said the spark certainly wasn't a youngster. He wants me to rectify things. I don't think he wants to upset the builder for some reason, maybe a deal on the property, I don't know.
I'll get the test cert tomorrow get some details of supplies, test results, address, contact and NIC nos, etc and decide what to do thereafter.

 

[Phoenix]

IF he is a genuine NIC member, would they not take some sort of action / sanction against him if you report him to them?

 

[Richard Burns]

IF he is a genuine NIC member, would they not take some sort of action / sanction against him if you report him to them?

I fear you are looking at this through these, reality works differently unfortunately.

 

[coldyron]

Why did you not do the job from the beginning if he's such a good mate of yours and you seem to be competent?

And how is it possible for such a big change in loop impedence?

 

[markc123]

IF he is a genuine NIC member, would they not take some sort of action / sanction against him if you report him to them?

What and lose his membership fee?

I don't think so lol

The NIC unfortunatley has become more of a business, rather than a line of defence in protecting the trade.

 

[coldyron]

Plus it's not hard to join any of the groups is it? Just make sure you revise and get your testing right once a year (it is a year isn't it?) and for the other 364 you can be as thorough or as lazy testing as you like

 

[Phoenix]

Yeah, guess I was hoping for too much. P***es me off though, I take time and care to do a good job and would expect a -------ing or worse from Elecsa if I bodged something. They'd only have to suspend / expel a couple to have an effect...

 

[ipf]

Why did you not do the job from the beginning if he's such a good mate of yours and you seem to be competent?

And how is it possible for such a big change in loop impedence?

Not such a good 'mate' but an occasional respected friend as a result of being a very good client for the last twenty odd years.
Builders tend to use local labour, I'm about 60 miles away but the owner asked me to sort things out knowing he'd get things done correctly.
He hasn't had the house built, he's bought the house. I'm not sure, but it could even have been a plot belonging to the builder.
As regards the measured difference, have a look through the thread and try to work it out. You may have missed it, but it really is quite obvious.:redface: :smiley2:

 

[ipf]

What and lose his membership fee?

I don't think so lol

The NIC unfortunatley has become more of a business, rather than a line of defence in protecting the trade.

True, but this balls up has actually given me a good reason to attend the NICEIC Live North, being held basically down the road from me, next week. I think I'll book and have a bit of a talk with that Cable bloke among others and try to ruffle a few feathers.

 

[Phoenix]

True, but this balls up has actually given me a good reason to attend the NICEIC Live North, being held basically down the road from me, next week. I think I'll book and have a bit of a talk with that Cable bloke among others and try to ruffle a few feathers.

If you get a chance, keep us updated with that!!! Good luck

 

[ipf]

Managed a few photos. The supply to the garage is, in fact, from a 25amp mcb (3871 type 2) so obviously used previously. No RCD's

View attachment 21102View attachment 21103View attachment 21104View attachment 21105View attachment 21106View attachment 21107

Still waiting for a copy of the test certificate.

 

[Deleted member 9648]

attatchments just open a link to the tiling and plumbing forum for me!...not seeing the pics unfortunately.

 

[ipf]

Try again