Discuss Am I right or wrong? in the Electrical Wiring, Theories and Regulations area at ElectriciansForums.net

Maxi

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A question to the experienced electricians out there...
I'm a mature 2365 level 3 student with plenty of previous DIY experience and over the last few months, have been lucky enough to have been doing some casual (as-and-when-needed) work with an all round fully approved electrician. Been doing all-sorts in domestics, commercial and industrial. Although he is not time-served he seems to know what he's talking about when it comes to design and installation. However, when it comes to technique, we are disagreeing somewhat and this is causing a bit of stress and tension between us. The biggest issue I have... or rather, he has... is the way I strip SWA cable...

The way I do it, which is the way I have been taught at college, is to use a hacksaw to score, even almost cutting the armouring making sure it is nice and level all the way round the cable, and then snapping them of by hand. I find this the easiest, quickest, least painful, most accurate way of doing it. His way is to first remove the appropriate amount of outer sheath to reveal the armouring, then with a pair of side-cutters, snip off the excess armour wires one at a time. I find this method physically awkward, difficult, inaccurate, and time consuming, especially when having to wrestle a big 4 or 6mm cable, but despite this he won't "allow" me to do it my way, arguing that his way is more accurate and quicker, even though he has never actually done it in my presence but always gets me to do it. I have seen several youtube tutorial videos showing "my" way and none showing his way. I realise that it is his business, etc, but I'm wondering if anybody else does it "his" way.

The other thing is the way I strip twin and earth. I prefer to pull the cpc out to split the sheath, or run a knife down the centre along the cpc. His way is to split the end, then using thumb and finger to pull one of the insulated conductors back on itself, splitting the outer sheath in roughly half, then taking that half of the split sheath and pulling to separate it, then using side cutters to remove the other half. I think if I do it this way for long enough I am going to develop severe arthritis in the fingers and then early retirement on medical. But again I am "banned" from doing this my way because he says his way is neater and he is very uptight (and I mean UPTIGHT) about how the end of the grey sheath looks, even though it will be behind the accessory. He requires it to be perfectly square with no splits or frays, and said the NICEIC inspectors will pull him on it. Really?

There are a couple of other things which I might mention later but I think I've droned on for long enough for now. Just wanted the thoughts of some other pro's and whether I would experience the same if I was working with someone else.
 
I would say SWA is normally done your way, or with an SWA cutter.
If doing it his way then it can be fairly neat if you can get the cutters under the armour without damaging the bedding, but it does tend to bend the armour strands. Also use his side cutters as normally they are not suitable for steel (though cable loppers generally are) and will rapidly become blunt.
I strip T&E your way, cpc pull for small sizes. Sometimes slit and sometimes pull apart both cores (not good, as it may damage insulation) for larger sizes.
If you can fit a good quality cable into automatic wire stripping pliers then this will split the sheath square and clean and can be done before he sees you doing it!

Unfortunately if you are doing his jobs then do them his way (while he is watching!), life is like that.
 
first i think both of you need sleeping tablets. :sleeping:. personally, i do both the same way as OP, but lately use a armourslice for SWA. to get a neat end on the sheath of T/E, lightly score with stanley knife before stripping.
 
I don't suppose there is any right or wrong way of doing it so long as the end result is the satisfactory.

Ill be honest, sometimes I use my CK armourslice thing, others I trim it back and cut with side cutters, so long as all the strands are the same length, nice and straight and you have not damaged the inner, then I don't see a problem.

I guess its personal preference.

The wrong way of doing it is cutting all the steel off and putting it in a stuffing gland, thats just wrong.
 
You're way the is the best way to do it imo, so much quicker and neater cutting the armour with a hacksaw or mini hacksaw, you get used to judging the depth and can have it done in no time! I spent months doing ends off for boards and would have cracked up if I had to do it the way your tradesman is doing it! As for the t + e, that's also how I would do it, grab the earth and pull it up, then grab the insulation and pull it off if need be! The guy is obviously just stuck in his ways and is using the nic inspector as an excuse for doing it his way, you're just going to have to bite the bullet, the experience you will gain is worth more than getting to strip cable your way, when you go it on your own in the future you can enjoy being able to strip it how you want lol!
 
I agree with you his way is not good as richard pointed out to you.

I remember when I was young (a long time ago lol ) an old sparky telling me off for pulling the cpc to strip t&e saying his way was best and that was running his blade down the cpc to strip it, he changed his mind after sticking his hand into a CU he was connecting to retrieve another cable and getting a shock off the stripped insulation he had done with his knife, he didnt strip cable that way again lol
 
I don't suppose there is any right or wrong way of doing it so long as the end result is the satisfactory.

Ill be honest, sometimes I use my CK armourslice thing, others I trim it back and cut with side cutters, so long as all the strands are the same length, nice and straight and you have not damaged the inner, then I don't see a problem.

I guess its personal preference.

The wrong way of doing it is cutting all the steel off and putting it in a stuffing gland, thats just wrong.

stuffing gland? thast's a posh way. what's wrong with a bit of tape round the armour?
 
I am the same i strip swa by working out where it needs to be cut then put some tape around that part and then use a hack saw and go round the tape so i get a nice straight line around it then strip the sheaving and bend the armouring off, i have never had a problem with this way it always works out fine with no hockey sticks or out like that.

As for the twin and cpc i was taught at college and by the guy i worked with not to snip the end and pull the cpc to strip it, i was taught this will reduce the csa of the cpc ("apparently") so the way i was taught was to gently score around the twin and cpc with a knife then push the knife down the middle of the cable then break the sheaving off it makes it a very nice clean end to the sheaving.

Either way i personally would not be snipping the armouring's off with my snips mainly due to the fact the swa i strip is usually no less then 35mm 3 or 4 core so the armouring would be too big to easily cut through them with my snips.
 
As for the twin and cpc i was taught at college and by the guy i worked with not to snip the end and pull the cpc to strip it, i was taught this will reduce the csa of the cpc ("apparently") so the way i was taught was to gently score around the twin and cpc with a knife then push the knife down the middle of the cable then break the sheaving off it makes it a very nice clean end to the sheaving.

I was also given that reason for not using the CPC to Strip T&E because it stretches it. Did you do your Training in Hull? Was it Mally Leach who told you that pearl of wisdom?
 
best thing with twin and earth - easy to strip it by pulling on the earth. important when second fixing larger jobs when you have tens of end to do. i would cut myself at some point if had to do all with a knife.
 
they are amongst us. time the OP put a few charged capacitors in his "mentor's" tool box/bag.
 
As for the twin and cpc i was taught at college and by the guy i worked with not to snip the end and pull the cpc to strip it, i was taught this will reduce the csa of the cpc ("apparently") so the way i was taught was to gently score around the twin and cpc with a knife then push the knife down the middle of the cable then break the sheaving off it makes it a very nice clean end to the sheaving.

Yes I have heard some Sparks frown upon pulling on the cpc for fear of stretching it. However there is an argument that the force needed to pull it through the sheath is not enough to stretch it though, at least for sheath of 1 to 2.5 mm cables. With 4mm and larger, I guess it would be easy enough to score or cut with knife instead.
 
If you score round the twin & earth with a knife, it is quite easy (if the knife is sharp) to cut into the insulation on the inner conductors.

A year or two back, I came across an RCD tripping fault caused by exactly this on an outdoor cable - tiny knife cuts into the inner insulation, which where sitting in a damp junction box (supposedly weatherproof, but not quite). This fault was on SWA inner cores, but same could apply to T&E. From then onwards, I never score round with a knife, and would rather have a less tidy cut that I know doesn't compromise the cable insulation.
 
I was also given that reason for not using the CPC to Strip T&E because it stretches it. Did you do your Training in Hull? Was it Mally Leach who told you that pearl of wisdom?

...Utter rubbish...i would ask him to provide "proof",as is the function,of an instructor or teacher,and would provide him with a selection of cable,and a micrometer to demonstrate.

I would accept his apology,and top-up his knowledge,regarding metallurgy.

Many years ago,i was involved in the design of a stripping tool,specifically for T&E. It was self adjusting,for the 1-2.5mm range,similar in principle to the small Thomas Betts tool.

The one piece of advice,which i took off a retired spark,was,when i asked "Why wouldn't folk use it?" he replied "...Because its' easier not to..."

...which is why i never got to bore you all,on dragons' den :D
 

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