Are Electricians Qualified to do Data terminations

[Nightfox122]

We have recently carried out some small electrical works as a sub contractor, which included some data cable terminations (Cat 6 mods/RJ45 ends etc). Anyway client we have been working too is a larger electrical contractor and has asked for our engineers certificates which isn't a problem. However they have now come back to say our engineers aren't qualified to carry out works on data cables.

I know there is a course which you can do for this but surely an experience Electrician is more than qualified to terminate data cables? Networking I would expect an IT Technion but for pulling in cables and terminating?

We've carried this work out for years and its the first time an issue of competency on this has arisen, Id be keen to know your thoughts.

 

[Lister1987]

BS 6701 (I think) deals with telecommunications and networking cables. First part to proving competence is being able to refer to and demonstrate understanding of applicable standards. Not 100% on courses teaching termination etc but being able to cite and work to the standard should go someway towards it.

Like with fire alarms, you need to know and understand the standards to be able to confidently say your work is compliant. Most can wire up RJ45/RJ11 with practice but being able to go into the depths of information (Cat 4 v Cat 6, which is better and why, which is best suit to which application) requires more thinking and research.

 

[telectrix]

qualifications to be a data monkey??? just eat bananas and save the skins.

 

[Nightfox122]

qualifications to be a data monkey??? just eat bananas and save the skins.

Was pretty much my exact thoughts when this joker quizzed me about it.

 

[Nightfox122]

BS 6701 (I think) deals with telecommunications and networking cables. First part to proving competence is being able to refer to and demonstrate understanding of applicable standards. Not 100% on courses teaching termination etc but being able to cite and work to the standard should go someway towards it.

Like with fire alarms, you need to know and understand the standards to be able to confidently say your work is compliant. Most can wire up RJ45/RJ11 with practice but being able to go into the depths of information (Cat 4 v Cat 6, which is better and why, which is best suit to which application) requires more thinking and research.

OK so we wouldn't know all the standards but in literally all cases we are told install cat5/6 which ever, we install, terminate, and test with the fluke meter which gives a full certificate for each cable and gives full bandwidth etc. Apparently that's not enough for this crowd

 

[DPG]

Surely they can tell you exactly what their requirements are that you haven't met.

 

[plugsandsparks]

Suppose its a bit like an electrician doing PAT without a specific PAT day course cert. There are a few specific areas where the install could be stressed and as such would need a high degree of skill in design and installation, thinking here of high density Cat6 + cables running at 10G into a server room or datacentre, long runs keeping away from noisy power cables, correct termination of shielding and earthing and the fine art of dressing which appears to be a fading skill nowadays.

 

[pc1966]

As @DPG said, they should be able to tell you what they need. Exactly.

I am not aware of any safety issue for this, nor any legal requirements, so it comes down to any specific standards they need.

If you have the proper tools (crimp tools, test kit), which it sounds like you do, then most run-of-the-mill stuff is easy for any competent electrician/technician. Only the very high-end stuff like 10G or fibre optic cabling is beyond most folk without very expensive equipment (and matching training).

 

[Strima]

BS 6701 (I think) deals with telecommunications and networking cables.

It doesn't go into the finer details of it, mostly says refer to BS7671 and use more earth cables...

 

[pc1966]

use more earth cables...

Always. It is the "more cowbell" for the electrical world...

 

[telectrix]

to qualify for data cabling you need to be able to do the following:
1. sling 40 cat5 cables over a ceiling grid, making sure they rest on as many recessed lights as possible.
2. break at least 10 tiles whist installing above.
3. only fit back tiles where you need cable support.
4. wherever possible run data cables along with LV cables. 3 phase cables are preferred

 

[Nightfox122]

to qualify for data cabling you need to be able to do the following:
1. sling 40 cat5 cables over a ceiling grid, making sure they rest on as many recessed lights as possible.
2. break at least 10 tiles whist installing above.
3. only fit back tiles where you need cable support.
4. wherever possible run data cables along with LV cables. 3 phase cables are preferred

Thankfully ours had been installed properly on containment for data cables alone, but yes your installation methods are what we usually see ?

 

[pirate]

Mixing up "qualified" and "competent" as is often the case...
If you are given the spec and simply told to install cables and terminate them, what "qualifications" do you need? BGR ALL! Some comm-petency would be handy though!
Data guys do their thing, and you probably wouldn't ask them to replace your CU, nor would they ask you to configure a server room. It harks back to the days of the Unions...they don't want you doing their job in any area whatsoever...protection for them...just as qualified electricians need protection too. However, my neighbour's son, aged 12, is a marvel at installing cat5/6 and doing all the terminations, and more besides...he's also small enough to squeeze into attics and under floors...he's competent, but has no qualifications. It's all nonsense.

 

[Mike Johnson]

Think I have posted this before, so bear with me, On the Tower Hotel project an old boy welder with no qualifications Oxyacetylene welded a Phosphor Bonze supporting angle together, me being the know it all told him it could not be done and I would have it tested, cut a long story short our Geotechnics dept had it X Ray analysed and it was a full penetration weld, competence vs qualified.

 

[Ziggie]

I seem to remember that data cables need to be connected to the earth system in certain circumstances.?

 

[Ziggie]

As a complete aside, I worked for a major supermarket as a software engineer.

Part of our job was to pull the data cables &(equipment cables) through the ducting and voids. We had to jump on the floor tiles to get them flat as the voids were so packed.

got paid time and a half as it was out of hours work

memories are made of this

 

[ruston]

@Mike Johnson

Think I have posted this before, so bear with me, On the Tower Hotel project an old boy welder with no qualifications Oxyacetylene welded a Phosphor Bonze supporting angle together, me being the know it all told him it could not be done and I would have it tested, cut a long story short our Geotechnics dept had it X Ray analysed and it was a full penetration weld, competence vs qualified.

I have posted this before, but thought you may like to see it . The phone camera does not do in justice.
To be fair , a time served competent man , but just naturally gifted.
It is made from stainless steel left over scraps.

 

[Mike Johnson]

Nice, but the difference is that the bracket the guy welded together was holding up a couple of tonne's of pre-cast concrete flank wall stones on the Tower Hotel.

 

[telectrix]

Nice, but the difference is that the bracket the guy welded together was holding up a couple of tonne's of pre-cast concrete flank wall stones on the Tower Hotel.

was it bronze to eliminate rust problems as with steel?

 

[Mike Johnson]

All the brackets and dowel bars where Phosphor Bronze to locate the stones and help eliminate pre-mature failure, but it did not stop the local scrotes from digging them out of the grout overnight to sell to the local scrap yard, the main contractor (TWP) used to send one of the guys out in the morning to negotiate their return, now I think about it, they used to send more than one guy out. nudge nudge wink wink say no more.