Fire Damper Actuators

[IAmSparkytus!]

Hello

Working on a site with dampers fitted on the ducting which need fire shut offs connected to the fire panel via an actuator.

The actuators have 4 contacts “Damper Closed NO and NC” and “Damper Open NO and NC”.

Presuming they need a NC contact so the actuator operates and closes the damper when the alarm goes off but not sure which NC contact to utilise.

Any insight appreciated.

Thanks.

 

[IAmSparkytus!]

Sorry for this but…bump

 

[TheatreSparks]

Hi, It sounds that what you have described are the monitoring contacts that would send a signal to a Building Management System or a mimic somewhere that indicate the position of the dampers at any point of time. There should be terminals for the coil, possibly 24v, which would be fed from a power supply unit which would have a fire alarm output module which would change status when the alarm sounds. It may well be a NC set of contacts in the fire alarm interface which hold the dampers open against a fail safe spring so if it looses power it will automatically close.

 

[IAmSparkytus!]

Hi thanks for the reply

Yes so it’s a 24v power supply required, wasn’t sure if there was anything specific that would be required or would a bog standard 24v PSU suffice?

So if the 6 cores are for signalling as you say, would it be feasible to switch the power going to the 24v PSU through a contactor with the coil being supplied by an auxiliary relay on the fire panel?

Thansk

 

[TheatreSparks]

Hi thanks for the reply

Yes so it’s a 24v power supply required, wasn’t sure if there was anything specific that would be required or would a bog standard 24v PSU suffice?

So if the 6 cores are for signalling as you say, would it be feasible to switch the power going to the 24v PSU through a contactor with the coil being supplied by an auxiliary relay on the fire panel?

Thansk

As far as I am aware, any 24v power supply would be suitable, but in particular one designed for fire alarm and includes facilites for back-up batteries to be fitted as otherwise you would need to reset the unit after a power supply.

Yes, the unit would be switched via a relay in circuit with the 24v line off the aux relay on the fire alarm panel, assuming that is a convienent place to pick up a switched contact.

Unless you need monitoring you would not need to connect the 6 wires to anything.

 

[IAmSparkytus!]

As far as I am aware, any 24v power supply would be suitable, but in particular one designed for fire alarm and includes facilites for back-up batteries to be fitted as otherwise you would need to reset the unit after a power supply.

Yes, the unit would be switched via a relay in circuit with the 24v line off the aux relay on the fire alarm panel, assuming that is a convienent place to pick up a switched contact.

Unless you need monitoring you would not need to connect the 6 wires to anything.

Evening,

OK great, well that’s good to know as I initially thought id need a 2 core cable back to the fire panel from either the NO or NC cores of the 6core.

But now if I wire the supply through a contactor which is switched via a NC relay, I only have a 230v cable to pull over to a 24v PSU adjacent to the actuator.

Would the 24V supply having a battery backup not stop if from closing as it would never lose power?

I’ve attached the wiring diagram if you’re able to take a look and just confirm your still happy that it is what you think?

 

[IAmSparkytus!]

Hello

Been advised by the manufacturer that a standard 24v 2A LED driver would suffice.

They said no need to comply with EN54-4 as their equipment is for “passive fire protection” rather than “fire alarms”.

Thoughts?

 

[James]

this is one of those where nobody has all the information.

it depends on
why it is being installed
who is designing the system
what standard the designer is hoping to achieve.

in an ideal world, the person ordering the work would give you all the information at quote time and ask if you can provide to that standard.

 

[IAmSparkytus!]

this is one of those where nobody has all the information.

it depends on
why it is being installed
who is designing the system
what standard the designer is hoping to achieve.

in an ideal world, the person ordering the work would give you all the information at quote time and ask if you can provide to that standard.

Very rarely is a job carried out in an ideal world!

Only info given to me was that the ventilation will have 2 dampers which need to close when the FAP goes into alarm.

Best thing I have to go on so far is manufacturers guidance for their product.

 

[freddo]

What was the make and model by the way?! What type of fire alarm too, most addressable systems you can simply add a relay output module to the loop near the equipment to be operated, some modern bi-wire systems now have this ability too.

 

[IAmSparkytus!]

What was the make and model by the way?! What type of fire alarm too, most addressable systems you can simply add a relay output module to the loop near the equipment to be operated, some modern bi-wire systems now have this ability too.

It’s a C-Tec 2wire FAP

 

[freddo]

What was the make and model by the way?! What type of fire alarm too, most addressable systems you can simply add a relay output module to the loop near the equipment to be operated, some modern bi-wire systems now have this ability too.

It’s a C-Tec 2wire FAP

If it is using Apollo Alarmsense devices a relay for connecting to the zones is available. Do be aware though these reset when the sounders are silenced which may not meet the design specification.