Removing fused switches

[serval]

Im doing my kitchen and have a question regarding the arrangement of some wall mounted fused switches and in cupboard mounted sockets

On the wall I’ve got a couple of switched FCU’s.

Each of these FCU’s are linked to 2 non switched single sockets that are inside the cupboards.

The wall mounted FCU’s are mounted in between a couple of wall mounted plug sockets.

In an effort to have fewer wall mounted gear visible I want to do the following:

-Remove the FCU’s

-Join the cables going to the under cabinet switches using a suitable MF connector

-Replace the under cabinet sockets with switched versions

-Blank off the area where the FCU’s were with a flush steel plate or something similar screwed into the back box

-Tile over.

I think creating the cable joints seems fairly straight forward provided i use suitable MF connection methods (i was thinking of using wago 773's)

What im unsure about is the fact that tiling over means there would be a couple of sets concealed live cabling behind the tiles.

Although the steel plate would provide some degree of protection, im unsure of the correct and accepted method of going about this.

Im aware that I could fit surface mounted blank plates but id like to have as few sockets/switches and blank plates showing as possible.

Can anyone provide some advice on how to do this for a DIY'er?

Thanks in advance

 

[telectrix]

leave it as it is. maybe replace the FCUs and visible sockets with BG metal ones. 1 or 2 sockets with USB. that's what I'd do in our gaff.

 

[Octopus]

Can anyone provide some advice on how to do this for a DIY'er?

What you are outlining is NOT a good idea ..... my advice is to consult a spark and if I understand your steps correctly, then you sound as if you are planning a kitchen make over, so some of your budget to get this correct isn't going to add much to the overall cost.

I see more "bodges" in kitchens than any other room in the average house .....

 

[Pete999]

Im doing my kitchen and have a question regarding the arrangement of some wall mounted fused switches and in cupboard mounted sockets

On the wall I’ve got a couple of switched FCU’s.

Each of these FCU’s are linked to 2 non switched single sockets that are inside the cupboards.

The wall mounted FCU’s are mounted in between a couple of wall mounted plug sockets.

In an effort to have fewer wall mounted gear visible I want to do the following:

-Remove the FCU’s

-Join the cables going to the under cabinet switches using a suitable MF connector

-Replace the under cabinet sockets with switched versions

-Blank off the area where the FCU’s were with a flush steel plate or something similar screwed into the back box

-Tile over.

I think creating the cable joints seems fairly straight forward provided i use suitable MF connection methods (i was thinking of using wago 773's)

What im unsure about is the fact that tiling over means there would be a couple of sets concealed live cabling behind the tiles.

Although the steel plate would provide some degree of protection, im unsure of the correct and accepted method of going about this.

Im aware that I could fit surface mounted blank plates but id like to have as few sockets/switches and blank plates showing as possible.

Can anyone provide some advice on how to do this for a DIY'er?

Thanks in advance

Employ an Electrician

 

[ackbarthestar]

If you remove the SFCUs and replace with connector blocks you will have two unfused spurs going to two switched sockets hidden in the cupboards.
Firstly what was/is connected in the cupboards, secondly do the appliances need access to isolation and/or emergency switching?
Standard common sense switching will always have local and accessible isolation and fusing.

 

[Des 56]

In an effort to have fewer wall mounted gear visible I want to do the following:

For goodness sake,its a Kitchen

I find it incredible,proposing to make a mess of what may be a sound installation,all for the sake of reducing the amount of accessories in what after all is a food workstation

 

[Toneyz]

Employ an Electrician

NOT KEVIN!!!!!!!!

 

[telectrix]

In an effort to have fewer wall mounted gear visible I want to do the following:

For goodness sake,its a Kitchen

I find it incredible,proposing to make a mess of what may be a sound installation,all for the sake of reducing the amount of accessories in what after all is a food workstation

problem is, some customers see a kitchen as a showpiece to impress the neighbours. same as a new bathroom.it's there to get the crap and sweat off your body and some even have a karzi in them. , nothing more, nothing less. kitchens are for cooking. end of.

 

[Spoon]

Hi OP. Welcome to the forum.
The design you currently have sounds good.
The change you suggest may be possible but I would say that is't not as good as what you have now.
You probably don't care about the functionality/design of it and would just like a 'less cluttered' kitchen.
Post some pick up of the sockets so we can have a better idea of what you are suggesting.

 

[Toneyz]

problem is, some customers see a kitchen as a showpiece to impress the neighbours. same as a new bathroom.it's there to get the crap and sweat off your body and some even have a karzi in them. , nothing more, nothing less. kitchens are for cooking. end of.

You posting that Tel reminds me of going around to someone's house (not work related) once took my shoes off walked in lounge put one foot on this rug "don't stand on that it's just for show".

 

[serval]

Thanks for the posts all, reckon ill get a spark in to do it correctly based on your advice.

On another note, im assuming the cabling from the FCU to the sockets is chased into the wall and runs down behind the kitchen work top.

If that is the case would it be likely that the worktop and base units would have to be removed in order to make the changes im looking for?

 

[serval]

Hi OP. Welcome to the forum.
The design you currently have sounds good.
The change you suggest may be possible but I would say that is't not as good as what you have now.
You probably don't care about the functionality/design of it and would just like a 'less cluttered' kitchen.
Post some pick up of the sockets so we can have a better idea of what you are suggesting.

To be fair, the current design is alright
Its just that as you said some of the walls look cluttered.

The worst is a 2ft round of continuous switches and sockets etc with no space between them and only half of the things are in use.

I think the previous owners had several integrated appliances that are no longer there and not likely to be replaced. Thats why i wanted to do away with some of the unused wall switches and keep the sockets in the base units just in case.

 

[serval]

If you remove the SFCUs and replace with connector blocks you will have two unfused spurs going to two switched sockets hidden in the cupboards.

Would the fuse fitted into the appliance plugs not suffice in this situation? (each fcu feeds a single socket)

Firstly what was/is connected in the cupboards, secondly do the appliances need access to isolation and/or emergency switching?
Standard common sense switching will always have local and accessible isolation and fusing.

most of the sockets are unused, one of them is for a dishwasher. I think the previous owner had some integrated appliances in the units. I wont be replacing them due to the new kitchen layout.

secondly do the appliances need access to isolation and/or emergency switching?

I figured the only time id need to isolate is when im pulling the appliance out so id just do that at the socket anyway.
In the case of an emergency my first thought would have been to isolate at the CU which for me is close by instead of going near the appliance if it catches fire or something like that.

 

[bigspark17]

If an appliance is intergrated and the socket is behind this then a sfcu to isolate it would be required, a switched socket in the adjacent cupboard would be a good alternative. I increasingly get asked about having no sfcu at worktop height and dont have a problem. A bit more thought and talking to customer during 1st fix goes a long way to getting the desired finish.
what are your thoughts on a cooker isolator being in the adjacent cupboard?

 

[serval]

If an appliance is intergrated and the socket is behind this then a sfcu to isolate it would be required, a switched socket in the adjacent cupboard would be a good alternative.

fortunately i have this arrangement for the two FCU's that i want to remove...the sockets are mounted under the unit which houses the sink/plumbing etc. The dishwasher is in the adjacent unit and the other socket is unused.

Im not sure if its good practice having sockets near stuff that could potentially leak but that's a story for another thread!

what are your thoughts on a cooker isolator being in the adjacent cupboard?

I already have a cooker isolator but thats fitted on its own, located on a different wall so not a problem

 

[telectrix]

youmay well find that the FCUs are fed from adjacent sockets, so ant redundant ones could have their supply dissed at relevant socket. doing it that way would not compromise cables in prescribed zones not being easily identified by in-line accessories.

 

[serval]

supply dissed.

Dissed = disconnected right???

 

[telectrix]

yep. like my brain after 12 pints.

 

[Midwest]

If it twos down to me, I'd have what I wanted in my nice new shiny kitchen, stuff what some fuss pot electricians said.

Rip out your old kitchen, if you get access from above, pull down your plasterboard ceiling and have you electrician wire up your new kitchen to your spec, i.e. no ugly FCU's etc.

 

[telectrix]

If it twos down to me, I'd have what I wanted in my nice new shiny kitchen, stuff what some fuss pot electricians said.

Rip out your old kitchen, if you get access from above, pull down your plasterboard ceiling and have you electrician wire up your new kitchen to your spec, i.e. no ugly FCU's etc.

stop hitting me with those negative waves.

 

[Midwest]

I thought I was being positive, the customer should have what he wants within reason;

 

[serval]

So i displaced all the face plates this afternoon to have a look at what was going on an this is how everything is hooked up....
it seems that different switches/fuses etc take a feed off something else an so on

This beyond my knowledge so ill be getting an electrician in to do this one for me as advised

For goodness sake,its a Kitchen
I find it incredible,proposing to make a mess of what may be a sound installation,all for the sake of reducing the amount of accessories in what after all is a food workstation

mind you ill avoid this fella as i don't reckon he'd be up for it

p.s ignore the ground symbol up near the extractor cable

 

[Toneyz]

What do you want to get rid off and do you have a photo.

 

[serval]

1. i wanted if possible to get rid of the FCU at the right hand side, but keep the under cabinet single socket that it currently switches on off and change it to a switched socket.

2.again if possible, combine the fuse and switch for the extractor (2nd and 3rd in from the left respectively) into an FCU. If not possible just have a manual switch for the extractor and do away with the additional fused face plate.

3. space everything out nicely, level everything and re-tile, tiling over any redundant face plates rather than having surface mounted blank plates

 

[Midwest]

Jes' that is a monstrosity. I'd have a chat with your electrician at your earliest.

 

[Toneyz]

I would need to see a bigger overview. Did you say you did not want switched fused spurs for appliances just single switched sockets either behind appliances or adjacent units.where is the fan is it directly above.

 

[Des 56]

serval
Here is my apology for the abrupt opinion I gave in my post,sorry for not understanding exactly what you were attempting to modify,my post did not recognise your specific problem
In my defence the usual reasons for people coming on here and getting rid of "unsightly switches" (in a kitchen) it has nothing to do with function,it is almost always aesthetic

Function is disregarded as a nuisance to the point that a kitchen loses its primary purpose in the name of vanity

I assumed incorrectly that was your motive (for some reason that type tends to annoy me)but having viewed your picture I fully understand why you want to modify that eyesore that should never have existed in the first instance

 

[Des 56]

You seem to have ring legs coming in at left hd and at right hd accessories
You could change outer accessories to double sockets and fit a switched fused spur in the centre for switching the extractor

The under worktop supplies can then be straight forward spurs off the double sockets

All you need do is rip out the existing loops and wire your own f cable from the double sockets to the centre switched fused spur

 

[serval]

Did you say you did not want switched fused spurs for appliances just single switched sockets.

Yes that's correct... definitely in the case of the 3rd SFCU (1st in from right hand side)
possibly also for the 2nd SFCU in from the right aswell.

where is the fan is it directly above.

yes the fan is directly above the switch


In addition the 1st SFCU (far left) is directly above the socket in the
cupboard

2nd and 3rd SFCU's are NOT directly above their respective sockets. The sockets are in an adjacent cupboard and would not be obscured by an appliance

 

[serval]

serval
Here is my apology for the abrupt opinion I gave in my post,sorry for not understanding exactly what you were attempting to modify,my post did not recognise your specific problem
In my defence the usual reasons for people coming on here and getting rid of "unsightly switches" (in a kitchen) it has nothing to do with function,it is almost always aesthetic

Function is disregarded as a nuisance to the point that a kitchen loses its primary purpose in the name of vanity

I assumed incorrectly that was your motive (for some reason that type tends to annoy me)but having viewed your picture I fully understand why you want to modify that eyesore that should never have existed in the first instance

No worries Des. will post up some pictures in future post as that always helps to clear up any potential for misunderstandings

 

[Spoon]

No worries Des. will post up some pictures in future post as that always helps to clear up any potential for misunderstandings

As I said in my last sentence in post #9. (ok the spelling is crud... must have been having a bad day..)
Glad you did post a pic as that does look a mess.

 

[telectrix]

could always use a 4 way grid switch.