Could I get the regs on a couple of things?

[Eclecticism]

I was refurbing the kitchen and my housing officer has pointed out I am not a qualified electrician, so, could someone please tell me about the following:

There is a drywall/cavity wall/partition wall between the kitchen and the livingroom. In the middle of the wall is a mains cable going from ground to first floor. Also part of the cable has been encased in bonding.

Double socket hanging out the wall. Basically the plaster has deteriorated around it and whole thing is kept in place by the cable.

And this:



Its actually to the right of this that the ring goes upstairs.

Its one ring for the house, its a single cable going upstairs, I dont know where the ring comes back to the consumer unit. So anyone know why there are two cables coming out the conduit? (as well as if the whole job is within regs?)

Im no electrician but Im pretty sure there must surely be something about cable being so deep or to be in conduit/armored as well as something about cable being rated for being encased in plaster/bonding and something about wall sockets remaining in the walls and 240v cable shouldnt support the conduit its in.

And out of curiosity how does this hold up:



Im guessing the conduit beside the switch is the supply for the house and the box on top of that is a fuse/isolator. Right behind there is the bathroom and the shower is back to back with it, thats its door to the left.

You might have guessed we are decorating, not long moved in, I havent a clue what to do with that mess in the hall ... what can I do? Needs compacted and boxed in (in my opinion) ... but prolly look just as unsightly and hazardous to anyone over 5'8".

 

[malcolmsanford]

If we are talking about that double pole switch with the neon, that has writing on it that I can't quite make out then it looks like there are 3 cable coming from it. I would imagine that the supply side of the switch is fed via the ring (2 of the cables) and the load side is a single cable, which could be feeding that single socket below...............pure guess work though

The part about cables being "so deep" I think you are referring to regulation 522.6.101 with cable being given additional protection if they are buried less than 50mm. This is a fairly new regulation, introduced in 2008 and your installation maybe older than this and so at the time of install obviously it would not be applicable

There is a section in the regulations about Current or load ratings in the regulations, this is found in appendix 4 and to find the ratings of cables there are calculations you need to do. If your sockets/switches are fed in a 2.5mm ring then there is a very good chance it complies, unless there were some exceptional circumstances

Your 3rd point about 240volts (230v now) and cables supporting conduit is a bit vague to be honest.

That white channel is trunking and I would hazard to guess that it contains the mains cable feeding your installation The black box directly on top of that trunking is your main fuse from the supplier. Then you have the meter and between the meter and your fuse box is a small double pole isolator which seems to be using just one pole.

The Supply seems to go into the top and the load to your CU comes from the bottom. There seems to be a connector block for the Neutral next to it. Technically I would say that you may have a problem there.

There could be interpretations that this small isolator is the main isolator that is called for in regulation 537.1.4 at the origin of the installation. Others may argue that the double pole switch in the actual CU itself could act as this. Whichever way you go it's a mess that needs sorting.

As you say your not electrical and for piece of mind I would call someone in to help you. You say you have not longed moved in, did you get any form of certification before you did?

Either way I'm sure there maybe one of the lads off here that is local to you who would gladly come in to help and advise just post your rough location on here and I'm sure you will get someone to help.

You may also be pleasantly surprised how reasonable the costs are. For a few hundred pounds it could all be sorted for you, certificates issued to ascertain the installations conditions and any faults put right. Well worth it I believe for you and your families safety and piece of mind

 

[Eclecticism]

Cost isnt a problem to me as long as it is justified, I aint paying for it. The landlord, a housing association which is how we have a housing officer, did all the electrical safety checks before we moved in, allegedly. The HO refused to get this work fixed so I phoned head office and they said I wasnt to pay for necessary repairs, like it should be.

What I mean by 240v supporting conduit is that the two cables coming from the trunking are supporting it. The wall is badly decayed and it is not fixed in place. In fact all the groundfloor walls are in poor condition because of years of water penetration and thats why in one case the socket is out the wall along with the back box. If we had known we wouldnt have moved in. 13 weeks to get the place dry and still risk of flooding.

The house was rewired about 5-7 years ago so what you say about the regs on buried cables being 2008 means it wouldnt have applied, but what about now in regards to them having to remedy the wiring in the kitchen and add two sockets, one on that wall?

Whats the problem with the neutral? This is something they are adding to all new installations even this year as well as the double pole. In homes with prepayment meters the other half of the double pole goes to the white meter heating or whatever it is called. The neutral connection has room for another two cables going into the top. So I think basically the contractor has said 'you need this' and used a maximum markup bulk standard template, as you would with a contract to renew the wiring and kitchens for the largest housing association in a major city. Theyve added all the extras for the heating supplies that arent even required because if someone went to prepayment then this would be added. So what the problem is-is that they are adding tons of extra crap.

 

[Knobhead]

Your housing officer has pointed out that you’re not a "registered" (dues paid to scam provider) electrician. I think you should take that as a hint to get someone in that is.
Just be sure that you’re not putting you’re tenancy on the line.

 

[malcolmsanford]

Reg 537.1.4

A main linked switch or linked circuit-breaker shall be provided as near as practicable to the origin of every installation as a means of switching the supply on load and as a means of isolation

A main switch intended for operation by an ordinary person e.g. of a household or similar installation, shall interrupt both live conductors of a single phase supply

Above is the regulation I referred to and what I said was that your double pole switch between the meter and the CU in my interpretation of the regs would be that main switched and so by it not switching both lives (LINE/NEUTRAL) it is in contravention of the regs.

I also stated that some would argue that the switch in your CU is this main switch, and I would disagree with that by the wording of "origin of every installation" would for me be the first switch .

 

[Eclecticism]

Tony, as I said I aint paying for it ... it means they are they are

Im here to find out where I stand because Im not qualified and they arent going to get anything done unless I point it out. But I need to be able to point it out and I no know the regs. To me I know what looks logical, but dunno the specifics of how it should be implemented exactly to code.

Malcom, now I think I see what what you mean by the DP switch and the regs. All Im saying is that this has been their standard installation for the live and neutral last 7 years or so and how they do it and they, I think, must do it for the heating system in prepayment homes. We have a dry meter, which apparently aint that common around here :s The live DP and neutral connector were both installed by the supplier though, Scottish Power. Basically a contractor would rewire everything and then Scottish Power connected it to the supply. Also below the DP switch there is a sticker, left says live and the right says do not connect, but that could be put on by the engineer I guess.

I just basically need to know the regs that apply to my situation. Its not that Im dumb around electricity, I mean I built my own lab in my last house complete with its own ring and lighting circuit. Which was wired the new colours and when they came around to rewire the rest of the house from black and red they checked mine and found no faults, though I had to fork out for an RCBO, now, wait I didnt, I had already bought one 'just in case'. Built my own lab DC power supply. I use 5v and 12v dc powered relays to switch power for mains equipment and I control them by using MPU's. So the logistics of the job arent really a problem and my standards are high, I get stick from my brother in law for 'over-engineering' things, but I dont want to return to a job Ive done and waste time repairing something that for the sake of a little thought and some extra effort the first time round it would be fine. For example I would have put the cable going vertically through the wall in metal conduit just simply because its in a wall where something is likely (and is) to be hung. Last thing I need is 'oops, I forgot'. Then there's welding, soldering etc. that I do. I just dont know the regs and what my landlord really should be getting done (as a necessary repair), what/why exactly I should be asking them for and what, if any, regs are being broken in the current state.

I could easily fix the walls and add the sockets and it would be sound but it wouldnt be certified. Also I dont like this situation of us viewing a place and everything is OK on the surface and Im told 'everything has been checked, rewire was only 7 years ago' and then when the last tenant moves out I find the crap I have and the housing officer is like 'you accepted it in this condition'.

Imagine driving a test car. Viewing the one your going to get in the showroom. Buying it. Driving it and while driving find out there are no brakes. But hey, you accepted it in that condition. You couldnt see there were no brakes and it should have been like the test model and up to code, but hey ...