Discuss How do I certify when there are no rcds to test in the Electrical Wiring, Theories and Regulations area at ElectriciansForums.net

Welcome to ElectriciansForums.net - The American Electrical Advice Forum
Head straight to the main forums to chat by click here:   American Electrical Advice Forum

Hi - it’s ok to replace accessories as a maintenance activity. It’s not ok to change the installation cabling and not comply with current Regs when you are doing that.
I guess the cheaper alternative is to replace the MCBs with a couple of RCBOs if it keeps the costs down for the client - how do other people get around this?
 
I guess the cheaper alternative is to replace the MCBs with a couple of RCBOs if it keeps the costs down for the client - how do other people get around this?

good in theory, however rcbo's are not available for all the old boards.
wylex 4 off rewirable fuse unit springs to mind.
 
It’s difficult to inform a client, especially elderly that they require additional protection, when they just want another socket in the kitchen or lounge, when the other existing sockets don’t have it. They might think you are trying to defraud them. I often use to give them some leaflets from Electrical Safety First, just to show there’s no skullduggery on my part.
Otherwise, I’d just decline the work.
I get that - it’s just when you walk into a property and there are lots of extension leads that an old person can easily trip over, I try to get a work around that still complies and is easy on the purse. This is the frustrating thing with the regs and old installations - if I carried out this type of work, it would be no less safe than what is already there.
It also highlights the issue with the cowboys out there that would happily put in that extra socket or 2 without testing or certifying but the client is happy because “it works fine, what’s the problem?”....
 
I get that - it’s just when you walk into a property and there are lots of extension leads that an old person can easily trip over, I try to get a work around that still complies and is easy on the purse. This is the frustrating thing with the regs and old installations - if I carried out this type of work, it would be no less safe than what is already there.
It also highlights the issue with the cowboys out there that would happily put in that extra socket or 2 without testing or certifying but the client is happy because “it works fine, what’s the problem?”....

You can only do what the 'Law' allows, otherwise we just make up our own rules. Then there's just chaos.
 
Thanks guys for your responses - I do know what the regs say, I was just wondering if there was a viable solution that would allow me to still comply but not cost the client too much.... clearly there isn’t!
 
Thanks guys for your responses - I do know what the regs say, I was just wondering if there was a viable solution that would allow me to still comply but not cost the client too much.... clearly there isn’t!

Doing the job properly costs what it costs, if the customer can't afford it then they can't have it done.

If it is an elderly or otherwise vulnerable customer and the work is required for any safety reason then there are systems in place to help them get the work done. Their local council may be able to assist with a grant, or else there are many charities, such as Age UK, who will advise and assist.
 
If the CCU is unable to take RCBo's, you could always put a couple in an enclosure next to the board, I'm sure that wouldn't break the bank too much and still quicker and cheaper than a complete board change
 
This is where having an old drum of red and black comes in handy. ;)

not suggesting anything, but those sockets have been there for years, Guv
 
Not sure on changes with 18th Edition, but with 17th Edition it would have been OK to wire in Ali-tube cable and use RCD sockets.

It adds around £12 to socket price, but it is the Al-tube cable that I found the problem, as a retired spark I can go to local supplier and buy 5 meters of twin and earth, but if I want ali-tube it's a drum or nothing.

So in the main whole job costs same as changing a consumer unit, so is a non starter.

So the only real way is the RCD FCU and use all fused spurs for extra sockets.

Of course the BS7671 is not law, so as a retired electrician I can add sockets as long as not a kitchen, or outside (I live in Wales) without needing to tell the LABC there is no law to stop me. However most electricians who work on domestic sign paperwork with their scheme provider to say they will follow BS7671, so they are breaking the law if they don't follow BS7671 unless their scheme provider says they can, and of course since a safety matter this must be in writing, an email or text is OK, but not a phone call.

Yes I know until 2004 we had very few RCD's and it was not until 2008 that we really started to fit them, and I see why one would think done without for a centenary why do we need them now?

What my answer is "people now expect them" so people are not as careful, and as an electrician we must look at if it all goes wrong, what then. There was a court case over the death of Emma Shaw, to me an eye opener, the foreman got a prison sentence, the electricians mate who was one of four tradesmen who made errors, got away with it. And no amount of insurance will cover a prison sentence, so simply not worth doing anything which will remove your ability to earn money.

I had mothers house rewired because she saw a red flicker on an extension lead (it was the neon) thought it was no fire and put it in a bucket of water. Yes she had dementia and eye sight problems. But so may your little old lady in 5 years time. Just not worth the risk, know it sounds like sucking through teeth and jobs worth, but it is exactly that, not worth risking your job to do it, after all she can use extension leads.
 
Earth bonding might also be another consideration and need installing/upgrading, to complete a satisfactory test certificate!
 
Earth bonding might also be another consideration and need installing/upgrading, to complete a satisfactory test certificate!
Thanks, there is no gas and the water is bonded next to the fuseboard so no problem there. I’ll go with the rcbo option, spoken to the client and she is happy to pay small amount extra to be safe
 

Reply to How do I certify when there are no rcds to test in the Electrical Wiring, Theories and Regulations area at ElectriciansForums.net

OFFICIAL SPONSORS

Electrical Goods - Electrical Tools - Brand Names Electrician Courses Green Electrical Goods PCB Way Electrical Goods - Electrical Tools - Brand Names Pushfit Wire Connectors Electric Underfloor Heating Electrician Courses
These Official Forum Sponsors May Provide Discounts to Regular Forum Members - If you would like to sponsor us then CLICK HERE and post a thread with who you are, and we'll send you some stats etc
This website was designed, optimised and is hosted by Untold Media. Operating under the name Untold Media since 2001.
Back
Top
AdBlock Detected

We get it, advertisements are annoying!

Sure, ad-blocking software does a great job at blocking ads, but it also blocks useful features of our website. For the best site experience please disable your AdBlocker.

I've Disabled AdBlock