How to deal with Pyro Cable?

[Mattja]

Situation is there's some 53 year old pyro cable that I need to either remove, or make dead, or cut short and push back into the wall having ensured that the still-live end cannot short out the circuit or come into contact with anything.

No hope of fully removing it, as it goes up the cavity and I don't even know the route it takes.
Chances of finding the junction box that connects it to the downstairs power ring are remote, I suspect it connects at a junction box fixed into the wall behind fixed cupboards, next to pipes, in a kitchen, and below the bath (bathroom above the kitchen), however I cannot be sure. I also am not sure I can take the cupboards down without damaging them (I'm no carpenter/kitchen fitter).

SKIP TO THE POINT:

The obvious thing to do seems to be to cut the cable just after it leaves the outside house, fix the end in such a way that it's not going to short the circuit or make live anything it comes into contact with, and shove it back into the wall (then cement over it). I've not had to deal with pyro before, how would you recommend going about this?

 

[snowhead]

how would you recommend going about this?

NOT in the way you are proposing.

You have to find the other end and disconnect it or disconnect the whole circuit.
Or correctly terminate the end you want rid of in a suitable box, NOT shoved back in the wall

You need a Kitchen fitter or Carpenter.

 

[Mattja]

Alright, will tool up with a phone then!

Edit: thanks for the quick reply btw

 

[Pete999]

Alright, will tool up with a phone then!

Edit: thanks for the quick reply btw

Not sure what you mean "tool up with a phone" is that a sarcy reply to the previous well meant reply, or something else?

 

[Des 56]

The obvious thing to do seems to be to cut the cable just after it leaves the outside house, fix the end in such a way that it's not going to short the circuit or make live anything it comes into contact with, and shove it back into the wall (then cement over it). I've not had to deal with pyro before, how would you recommend going about this?

No,the "obvious" thing to do is not do what you propose

 

[DPG]

Situation is there's some 53 year old pyro cable that I need to either remove, or make dead, or cut short and push back into the wall having ensured that the still-live end cannot short out the circuit or come into contact with anything.

No hope of fully removing it, as it goes up the cavity and I don't even know the route it takes.
Chances of finding the junction box that connects it to the downstairs power ring are remote, I suspect it connects at a junction box fixed into the wall behind fixed cupboards, next to pipes, in a kitchen, and below the bath (bathroom above the kitchen), however I cannot be sure. I also am not sure I can take the cupboards down without damaging them (I'm no carpenter/kitchen fitter).

SKIP TO THE POINT:

The obvious thing to do seems to be to cut the cable just after it leaves the outside house, fix the end in such a way that it's not going to short the circuit or make live anything it comes into contact with, and shove it back into the wall (then cement over it). I've not had to deal with pyro before, how would you recommend going about this?

Am I reading this correctly - you mean literally just cut it short and cement over it? Tell me I've misunderstood - surely you would disconnect it from wherever it is fed from???? If not then I would suggest you need more training before working in anyone's property. And it wouldn't matter whether it was unwanted pyro, T&E or whatever - the principle is the same regarding this issue. Daz

 

[Pete999]

Seems like it DPG, makes you wonder does it not

 

[Pete999]

Think the OP needs to refer to his course notes for advice, Jeez

 

[snowhead]

Think the OP needs to refer to his coarse notes for advice, Jeez

I've made a subtle correction for you.

 

[Pete999]

Wasat then

 

[telectrix]

tie it in a knot. solder a lamp on it. make a art deco feature.

 

[snowhead]

Wasat then

course
coarse

 

[Pete999]

course
coarse

I did s course in Electrics
That file is rather coarse, or am I barking up the wrong tree>?

 

[Mattja]

Had another idea, it wouldn't be an unreasonable place to put an outdoor socket (where the pyro comes out of the wall)

Not sure what you mean "tool up with a phone" is that a sarcy reply to the previous well meant reply, or something else?

My lame sense of humor, meaning the tool for the job is a phone to call in someone to deal with the cupboards.

 

[Mattja]

Am I reading this correctly - you mean literally just cut it short and cement over it? Tell me I've misunderstood - surely you would disconnect it from wherever it is fed from???? If not then I would suggest you need more training before working in anyone's property. And it wouldn't matter whether it was unwanted pyro, T&E or whatever - the principle is the same regarding this issue. Daz

Ok what I meant in full, thought this much was apparent sorry: pull out the fuse for the circuit it's connected to, cut through the pyro close to the wall, (and here's the bit I needed to know about dealing with pyro for) put a new cap/gland or whatever pyro uses on the end of it and put a suitable box or something over the end of it so it's not going to short circuit or connect to anything etc, expand the hole in the wall so it can be pushed in there, push it far enough back that the end can be cemented over (it goes into the cavity), and then cement over it.

Not for a second (again I thought this was clear sorry) did I intend to just snip and shove. That's why I was looking for advice on how to do that with pyro.

But having taken advise from the first reply here I should have help on the way in a few days so I can get access to the junction box at the supply end and disconnect it there.

 

[7029 dave]

Call in an Electrician. To isolate the Micc for you.

 

[telectrix]

you can't just bury a live cable. nobody will know it's there unles there's an accessory or a blanked box to indicate the presence of cable.

 

[DPG]

Ok what I meant in full, thought this much was apparent sorry: pull out the fuse for the circuit it's connected to, cut through the pyro close to the wall, (and here's the bit I needed to know about dealing with pyro for) put a new cap/gland or whatever pyro uses on the end of it and put a suitable box or something over the end of it so it's not going to short circuit or connect to anything etc, expand the hole in the wall so it can be pushed in there, push it far enough back that the end can be cemented over (it goes into the cavity), and then cement over it.

Not for a second (again I thought this was clear sorry) did I intend to just snip and shove. That's why I was looking for advice on how to do that with pyro.
.

No, you intended leaving it live and just hiding it, you clearly stated this in your original post:

The obvious thing to do seems to be to cut the cable just after it leaves the outside house, fix the end in such a way that it's not going to short the circuit or make live anything it comes into contact with, and shove it back into the wall

 

[westward10]

MICC, brings em out it a sweat don't it.

 

[freddo]

tie it in a knot. solder a lamp on it. make a art deco feature.

Well I'm sort of half way there.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

you can't just bury a live cable. nobody will know it's there unles there's an accessory or a blanked box to indicate the presence of cable.

According to the Regs you can.

 

[Deleted member 93172]

I think I'm getting too old for this game, just a cut a micc and seal it, what with candle wax and tape ffs and they say us oldies are dinosaurs and move over and make way for the new generation, frightening very very frightening.

 

[Pete999]

Apply to someone to start a course on how to deal with MICC

 

[cashnotakite]

to be honest OP just cut it,tape it over and tuck it away. It's perfectly fine that way. The way people go OTT about safe isolation is quite frankly ridiculous

 

[DPG]

to be honest OP just cut it,tape it over and tuck it away. It's perfectly fine that way. The way people go OTT about safe isolation is quite frankly ridiculous

Really? Just leave a live cable hidden away where nobody knows where it is? And charge the customer? Daz

 

[Pete999]

to be honest OP just cut it,tape it over and tuck it away. It's perfectly fine that way. The way people go OTT about safe isolation is quite frankly ridiculous

Are you having a laugh?

 

[Lucien Nunes]

Since this thread has gone off course a bit:
OP: An MI seal is not for 'sealing off' the end of a disused cable, it is for preventing moisture getting into the end of a completed termination. Sealing an end leaves the bare conductors poking out ready for sleeving and connecting up. The only reason you would want to seal a disused cable would be to prevent moisture ingress in case it was to be used again in the future - in any case it should be disconnected at source.

 

[cashnotakite]

Are you having a laugh?[/QU

 

[cashnotakite]

Are you having a laugh?

No,no definitely not gramps. By the time you've shelled out for glands, pots,seals,neoprene,stripper and a crimper because only old geezers like you still own them its not worth it. I mean, dont get me wrong, as an old soldier who's spent years grumbling in the game like you knows full well you still charge him full expenses. I'm sure you've pulled more than a trick or twenty like that over the years

cliff notes: rinse him and move on

 

[westward10]

No,no definitely not gramps. By the time you've shelled out for glands, pots,seals,neoprene,stripper and a crimper because only old geezers like you still own them its not worth it. I mean, dont get me wrong, as an old soldier who's spent years grumbling in the game like you knows full well you still charge him full expenses. I'm sure you've pulled more than a trick or twenty like that over the years

cliff notes: rinse him and move on

Skilled electricians carry gear for making off MIÇC cables, your comments are offensive and are of no value what so ever.

 

[freddo]

Indeed! I have a full kit of MI tools for all sizes of pots including imperial, not to mention a small oxygen/gas torch for drying/annealing/silver soldering as needed, various roller straightners, blocks of wood with grooves cut in them, rubber mallets, bending levers...
I'm 28

 

[DPG]

Cashnotakite carries a roll of tape and hammer from what I can tell. Daz.

 

[westward10]

Cashnotakite carries a roll of tape and hammer from what I can tell. Daz.[/QUOTE

The tape for his fingers after squashing them with the hammer?

 

[7029 dave]

Sad really, how such an every day task, for any sparkie worth his salt. side of the times.!

 

[flyingsparky]

Whoever you call will need the tools to terminate the cable and probably an imperial gland, pot and seal to make off the end correctly. You cannot just cut the end and whack it in a junction box. It's a very temperamental cable if not treated well, not unlike my wife!!

 

[flyingsparky]

Whoever you call will need the tools to terminate the cable and probably an imperial gland, pot and seal to make off the end correctly. You cannot just cut the end and whack it in a junction box. It's a very temperamental cable if not treated well, not unlike my wife!!

 

[Pete999]

No,no definitely not gramps. By the time you've shelled out for glands, pots,seals,neoprene,stripper and a crimper because only old geezers like you still own them its not worth it. I mean, dont get me wrong, as an old soldier who's spent years grumbling in the game like you knows full well you still charge him full expenses. I'm sure you've pulled more than a trick or twenty like that over the years

cliff notes: rinse him and move on

Cheeky young git

 

[john4703]

I must be getting old, I just can't believe that anyone working as a spark does not know how to terminate Pyro. I love pyro, easy to use, looks neat, lasts forever (well near enough as no plastic to deteriorate.
Do they not teach this nowadays?

 

[Gnasher]

Are you. Saying that there is a single pyro cable leaving the house spurred off the ring?
If this is the case can you not re terminate the pyro into a suitable IP rated box fixed to the building terminating the conductors inside.

Not used pyro for some time it is a bit of a black art now and would think that not many sparkies would be able to do it nowadays.

Might be worth carrying out an IR test on the circuit prior to carrying out any work on pyro. Should last for ever if not disturbed but worth checking to confirm condition and if your work has caused any issues.

Would be interesting to understand your competencies, qualifications, and experiences following your initial comments and suggestions.

 

[flyingsparky]

Pyro is a great cable, we will soon be starting a big lighting contract in a very old church and all the cabling will be bare pyro. If it's installed correctly and dressed right it just disappears after a while. I think I'm right in saying that most, if not all older churches must still be wired using it.

 

[freddo]

I wish it wasn't so expensive to buy, I could use it much more then!
The 25mm 2core here is around £65 a meter.

 

[Pete999]

Are you. Saying that there is a single pyro cable leaving the house spurred off the ring?
If this is the case can you not re terminate the pyro into a suitable IP rated box fixed to the building terminating the conductors inside.

Not used pyro for some time it is a bit of a black art now and would think that not many sparkies would be able to do it nowadays.

Might be worth carrying out an IR test on the circuit prior to carrying out any work on pyro. Should last for ever if not disturbed but worth checking to confirm condition and if your work has caused any issues.

Would be interesting to understand your competencies, qualifications, and experiences following your initial comments and suggestions.

MICC Simples, no way is it a black art, honestly. Lost art maybe.

 

[Leesparkykent]

I brought 30 meters of 2l1.5 this week from CEF..Took them 4 days to get it in though as apparently had to come from Wales £75 +VAT.

 

[holychihuahua]

you can't just bury a live cable. nobody will know it's there unles there's an accessory or a blanked box to indicate the presence of cable.

 

[Pete999]

Some will start saying FP200 is difficult to work with next

 

[holychihuahua]

Situation is there's some 53 year old pyro cable that I need to either remove, or make dead, or cut short and push back into the wall having ensured that the still-live end cannot short out the circuit or come into contact with anything.

No hope of fully removing it, as it goes up the cavity and I don't even know the route it takes.
Chances of finding the junction box that connects it to the downstairs power ring are remote, I suspect it connects at a junction box fixed into the wall behind fixed cupboards, next to pipes, in a kitchen, and below the bath (bathroom above the kitchen), however I cannot be sure. I also am not sure I can take the cupboards down without damaging them (I'm no carpenter/kitchen fitter).

SKIP TO THE POINT:

The obvious thing to do seems to be to cut the cable just after it leaves the outside house, fix the end in such a way that it's not going to short the circuit or make live anything it comes into contact with, and shove it back into the wall (then cement over it). I've not had to deal with pyro before, how would you recommend going about this?

 

[Pete999]

I can just imagine at one of the Electricians training centres, "what about Pyro the Mate" ""oh don't concern yourself with that, you wont find any of that stuff in a domestic situation"" "you will never need to know how to work with it, just concentrate on the cubicle for your practical test"

 

[Gnasher]

MICC Simples, no way is it a black art, honestly. Lost art maybe.

OK I will give you that, but I would be interested how many electricians can terminate an end correctly with confidence.

 

[Leesparkykent]

terminating micc - Bing video - https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=terminating+micc&&view=detail&mid=6F2D4C7309D2A79AB99A6F2D4C7309D2A79AB99A&FORM=VRDGAR

 

[freddo]

I love those videos! A good drinking game would be take a drink every time she says
Pyrotenax or how easy it is to install!