One ring main for whole house

[richo106]

I have just bought a relatively new house (15 years old) and didn't expect to do any major electrical work only moving the odd socket. however i went to isolate a socket and realised the whole house was fed off a single ring on 32amp.(still cant believe it was wired like that!)

I'm will be having a complete new kitchen fitted so i want to install a new ring main for the kitchen then have the rest of the house (3 bed) on the original ring. Ive never really done any work in domestic properties as ive always been on the industrial side, so i was thinking of finding the first and last socket in the kitchen and putting a link between them to complete the ring and then install a new ring for kitchen, there are plenty of spare ways in the CU.

I was just after some advice if this would be the best way to do it and if there is anything i should look out while attempting this.

Thanks

 

[Paul.M]

Before replying, just remember the OP is an Industrial spark, not a DIYer. Give help to a fellow Sparky (play nicely )

 

[Spoon]

You could do with seeing how the sockets wire to the ring. Draw a diagram of the ring circuit. The kitchen sockets may be the end of the ring so you could just connect to the socket before the kitchen sockets.
Does the CU have an RCD? Isn't this work notifiable, as it's a new circuit? (I may be incorrect)

 

[Simonslimline]

You could do with seeing how the sockets wire to the ring. Draw a diagram of the ring circuit. The kitchen sockets may be the end of the ring so you could just connect to the socket before the kitchen sockets.
Does the CU have an RCD? Isn't this work notifiable, as it's a new circuit? (I may be incorrect)

Yes it is notifiable work.

If it was my house i would not be worrying about that if i am honest. As long as it complies to 7671 and is tested and safe.

 

[Midwest]

Only issue with having one ring for whole house, is complying with reg 314 (division of installation). App 15 recommends a maximum of 100 sqm for 1 x RFC. Converting your existing RFC with your kitchen refurbishment would be an idea. You could consider a radial as well as a RFC.


PS: Beaten to it. Must type quicker.

 

[Bobster]

Could always split the ring at the kitchen and convert to 2 x 20A radials.

Then install a ring for the kitchen as necessary?

 

[richo106]

Haha thanks Paul. Yes the circuit is on the RCD side of the CU. So would you recommend leaving as it is or install a new ring for kitchen sockets?

 

[7029 dave]

Is the CU rcd split board?, as you are going to put in a new ring main, it needs to be or rcbo's. Check earth bonding gas and water, Its is notifiable, but as you are in the trade, your own home I would not sweat it, test "n" sheet filled out job done.

 

[Octopus]

On the basis the op has test equipment this should be a walk in the park!

 

[davesparks]

Yes you're on the right track, just remove the sockets you don't want and close up the ring. You can quite often re-route the existing cables so that you don't have to have a joint under the floor.

 

[Midwest]

OP, only prob with existing refurbished kitchens, is the fitters have had a field day with strip connectors and burying existing sockets in plaster, which does test your detective skills. Is the kitchen ceiling manky or covered in artex and need of skim of plaster?

 

[telectrix]

Yes you're on the right track, just remove the sockets you don't want and close up the ring. You can quite often re-route the existing cables so that you don't have to have a joint under the floor.

gor blimey. me 13stone. just imagining trying to squezze under the floor and then roll a joint.

 

[richo106]

The kitchen/diner will be skimmed walls and ceiling as there was artex on the ceiling and I will be installing downlights. With reference to splitting the ring so could I split the ring so the downstairs sockets are one and upstairs are on the other both on 20a breakers (RCD side) and then install a ring main for the kitchen. Also the people I bought it off have been there since the house was built and said they have not changed a thing (I believe them) so pretty sure there are no hidden joints etc...

 

[jackhammerJIM]

gor blimey. me 13stone. just imagining trying to squezze under the floor and then roll a joint.

Roll it before you go under Tel

 

[Midwest]

The kitchen/diner will be skimmed walls and ceiling as there was artex on the ceiling and I will be installing downlights. With reference to splitting the ring so could I split the ring so the downstairs sockets are one and upstairs are on the other both on 20a breakers (RCD side) and then install a ring main for the kitchen. Also the people I bought it off have been there since the house was built and said they have not changed a thing (I believe them) so pretty sure there are no hidden joints etc...

Personally, if your going to do a separate rfc/radial for the kitchen, I would leave the rest of the house on the existing rfc, unless you've got a massive pad. The reason I asked about the ceiling, was have you laid new flooring upstairs, perhaps preventing you from lifting floorboards/chipboard? Easier to have the old kitchen ceiling down & re-board, to rewire kitchen rfc etc?

 

[Geordie Spark]

gor blimey. me 13stone. just imagining trying to squezze under the floor and then roll a joint.

Ye roll it BEFORE ye squeeze yersel under the floor ye big daft Scouse muppett!! :sifone:

And stop derailing the poor lad's thread - he's one of "us" - not some numpty DIYer.

 

[telectrix]

youse only jealouscoz' you didn't derail the tread first, ya soft scottish that coulna climb a wall. :wazzzup:

 

[Lucien Nunes]

Before you change anything, do the full set of RFC tests to make sure it really is a ring. It might have ended up as one circuit because the cables got muddled / wrongly run and it's actually a figure 8 or something, which might decide the best break-in point. I wouldn't be keen on separating the kitchen and making the two bits left behind into 20A radials unless the kitchen is very close to the middle load-wise. Else you might end up with much of the house on one 20A which could actually be a retrograde step.

 

[richo106]

Yes that's what I was thinking Midwest, ideally I didn't want to touch the floorboards upstairs. I also have another question how do people generally run the cables around the kitchen behind the units. I'm going to have a couple of sockets above worktop and a couple of sockets in adjacent cupboards for integrated appliances. Chase it out at low level in the safe zone or just clip direct and then chase out for the sockets above the worktop. If I clipped direct would I have to wait until it's been plastered. I would like to get as much done as I can now as the plasterer isn't available for a couple of weeks.

all help appreciated as you can this is first proper domestic installation

thanks all

 

[sparksburnout]

Before replying, just remember the OP is an Industrial spark, not a DIYer. Give help to a fellow Sparky (play nicely )

Something a bit odd here then. I can remember loads of threads on here criticising "Electrical Trainee" and "Domestic Installers", along the lines of "a spark is a spark, there are no different disciplines and a proper spark should be able to tackle anything. Now, I am not sticking up for the former at all, but does the same thing not work in reverse? Should an industrial spark no be able to sort this out without recourse to asking on a forum? Just saying, its not rocket science.