Shop front fluorescent fittings

[vini]

The fittings operate from a time clock, some work some don't. Am I correct in thinking that these fittings don't have a starter nor a ballast? Does the time clock provide ballast in the circuit?

Does anyone have any experience with these sorts of fittings?
There is 240v going into the fittings and other than the end caps not making a good connection, I can't see why those that aren't working, aren't working. Any thoughts or experience would be appreciated.

 

[Sparky2391]

The fittings operate from a time clock, some work some don't. Am I correct in thinking that these fittings don't have a starter nor a ballast? Does the time clock provide ballast in the circuit?

Does anyone have any experience with these sorts of fittings?
There is 240v going into the fittings and other than the end caps not making a good connection, I can't see why those that aren't working, aren't working. Any thoughts or experience would be appreciated.

I assume the Fluorescent Tubes are not in a fitting and are secured someway? If that is the case the choke/ballast will be mounted away somewhere (with easy access of course!!!) The time clock only acts as a switching device for energising the circuit(s).

As for some working/not working.... No doubts its a choke/ballast issue!

Happy Hunting!

 

[Dizzy_Maskell]

Get a spark have a look at it

 

[Darkwood]

A practicing sparkie since 1985 TBH you surprise me that your unaware of basic fluorescent tube striking options.

That aside the 3 main starting methods are:-
-your common plug in starter this is usually located for easy change on the side of the fitting although some fittings have them internal.
-a transtar which looks like a longer version of a laminated ballast but incorporates striking kit so no separate starter.
-electronic ballast, like a transtar but with electronics and again no separate starter.

Your time clock will merely be switching the supply to the fitting nothing more and maybe via a separate contactor if the load overrates the relay terminals of the time clock.

TBH their are umpteen reasons fittings fail and if a new tube and starter don't correct it check for a internal fuse and also you have a supply if so then really don't faf about just replace the fitting.

 

[Darkwood]

PS just re-read your post .... you seem to think your fittings have no control gear... this wont be the case i assume you just have the end-caps in view with a remote control gear kit maybe above a false ceiling in a shop counter etc etc ... do some searching ...

 

[itselectric]

If op means shop sign then it is usually control gear in the actual box with singles going from them to the end caps. Ones I have done in the past have had normal ballast and starter or transtar type units but both had single internal wiring and end caps.

 

[Brightspark2]

Yes as above the control gear is usually inside the sign its self...

 

[ChrisElectrical88]

Ahh yes, this must be the fluorescent fittings that start up off oxygen. I've heard of these....... Never.

 

[Marvo]

.... you seem to think your fittings have no control gear... this wont be the case....

It might be the case if they're fitted with these or these....

 

[Darkwood]

It might be the case if they're fitted with these or these....

Nice try Marvo lol but OP used the generic Term fluorescent which is synonymous with gas filled tube, im sure he would have noticed if it was an LED retro fit tube.

 

[Marvo]

God loves a tryer

Note to self, must disguise bait better when trying to get a reaction from DW

 

[vini]

There's no messing with you boys. I think it's better to ask a question when stumped than just shrug and wander away.

The fittings have 240v going to the end caps although I can find no control gear of any kind. The owner had already swapped over any tubes before I arrived. Since there is 240v I would say that the control must be sound where ever it is, if it exists. The led tubes is a good shout except that some fluorescent tubes are working. There is no switch gear in the sign the tubes are not in the sign but in a fitting over hanging the sign.

If I was doing the job I would house the switch gear either close to the fitting but inside the premises or next the to the time clock. Either way in some accessible place.

It is great to know that there are sparks who have never been stumped on a job. I have to salute you, it must be great.

 

[itselectric]

Do I detect a touch of Glasgow sarcasm there. :yes:
Can you not see where the cables feeding the end caps are entering the fitting, then take it from there

 

[Deleted member 72666]

Swap the working tubes into the ones that don't then you'll know what issues you have!

 

[vini]

Do I detect a touch of Glasgow sarcasm there. :yes:
Can you not see where the cables feeding the end caps are entering the fitting, then take it from there

Aye just a bit. It's one of those jobs, I'm back tomorrow so will post something on the results tomorrow.

 

[Darkwood]

Wasn't slating you Vini was just surprised at the question considering you experience and yes we all get stumped from time to time, as for your situe' if they are standard fluorescent tubes this will require control gear regardless of how it may seem as i said before get searching high and low...

Ive seen them in false ceilings, cellars in counters etc etc all remote to the end caps.. check if their are any screwed access panels that may have been painted or even papered over the years.

 

[itselectric]

I'll just add one more thought. Way back when we used to do private rewires now and then there would be a 5 foot fluorescent in a kitchen which didn't have any control gear, not sure how it worked but I suspect it was through capacitors, not the can type, but small electronic type.
I've never seen one for years and I 'm almost certain they were cheapos.
It could be possible that these are a similar idea, but I've never seen them used commercially

 

[Marvo]

Anything's possible, you can actually ballast a fluorescent tube using a filament lamp. It's rarely done in practice because the losses are high.