Discuss They want to install a smart meter... but won't fit an isolator... which my old meter has built-in... in the UK Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

happysteve

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An interesting phone conversation with my own electricity supplier (Good Energy) which was very disappointing, and made me sigh (professionally) :(

They phoned out of the blue to ask if they could book a date to replace my gas and electricity meters with smart versions. I said I'd probably be up for it, but wanted to ask a technical questioned before I agreed. They said ok.

"My current electricity meter has a built-in isolator, which an electrician can use to isolate the supply if they need to change my fuse board, or perhaps install an EV charger. Smart meters don't come with built-in isolators. So I'll only agree for you to swap it, if at the same time you can install a double-pole isolator, so I'm in no worse position than I am now. Can you do that?"

After much to-ing and fro-ing with their supervisor, the answer was a resounding "no."

I said, "But if I wasn't aware of this potential issue, in doing this work you would have put me in a worse position than I am now. In order to update my board, I'd have to call you up to install an isolator, which would have delayed the job by weeks, and you'd have no doubt charged me for it."

It's just so, so disappointing. I don't know about the rest of the country, but around here the little Seimens meters with the built-in isolator under the flap on the bottom right are very common, and it's a joy when I come across one on a job that needs a new board.

I can't believe they're not just installing an isolator where the old meter has one built-in as a matter of course. But the fact that whoever they're getting to subcontract the works to can't even cope with it when it's a request... and that as a company they're not even aware that this is an issue... it's awful.

Of course, I could go ahead and fit my own isolator before they change the meter, but that's not the point! There can't be many people who they phone up to get this done are aware of the implications if they go ahead. WPD (my local DNO) charge £231.42 to install a 2-pole isolator, and more for a 4-pole, and elctrical supply companies generally charge £50-100, and it usually takes weeks but can take months.

It's just really, really disappointing. I made my views known. They promised to "make a note and feed it back."
 
They're obviously not desperate enough to fill their "Smart" meter install quota, yet.

My mate, who changes his supplier more often than his undercrackers, has had 2 Gen 1 "Smart" meters, and is now about to get a Gen 2 fitted by Shell his latest supplier.

His next door neighbour had a Gen 2 meter fitted recently, the houses are all electric with storage heaters.
Her meter fitter took one look at the existing 5 wire meter said he couldn't change it, then changed it anyway, probably due to quotas, and left the heating disconnected for a couple of days untill their "specialist " came and sorted it out.
That was when we had all those cold nights.
 
Just be happy that WPD will fit an isolator (eventually). They never used to, the reason they gave me once was because it was on the consumer side of the installation it technically came under Part P - and they weren't Part P registered!!
 
Just be happy that WPD will fit an isolator (eventually). They never used to, the reason they gave me once was because it was on the consumer side of the installation it technically came under Part P - and they weren't Part P registered!!
Did you ever raise a formal complaint with any relevant body, or make a RIDDOR report, to do with the fact that WPD had told you that they were unable to make reasonable provision for safety when installing meter tails? ?
 
They're obviously not desperate enough to fill their "Smart" meter install quota, yet.

My mate, who changes his supplier more often than his undercrackers, has had 2 Gen 1 "Smart" meters, and is now about to get a Gen 2 fitted by Shell his latest supplier.

His next door neighbour had a Gen 2 meter fitted recently, the houses are all electric with storage heaters.
Her meter fitter took one look at the existing 5 wire meter said he couldn't change it, then changed it anyway, probably due to quotas, and left the heating disconnected for a couple of days untill their "specialist " came and sorted it out.
That was when we had all those cold nights.
I've had this twice now where there's an off peak meter being changed . Customer rings me and says all heaters have stopped working - on both occasions the 'not very smart' meter fitter has parked the off peak tails in SP 100a blocks...... How much training have these people had ? Scary really.
 
At least you've got the option to get a smart meter fitted, as I keep getting emails (over the last 3 years) recommending I move to a smart meter - which I'm happy to do. However ever time I enquire I get this back.

BTW for folks that have been lucky enough get a smart meter fitted by SSE, then no isolator has been installed :(
1618776609294.png
 
I think that part of the problem is that they are trained to do a specific job and only that job. In the van will be all that is needed to do that job, and nothing more. So asking to have an isolator fitted is not part of the job that they are set up to do.

I had a similar situation with a Sky installer a while ago... we were agreeing on the cabling route, when he told me that he only has 1 drill... and it's 10mm and 450mm long. Nothing else at all. We ended up using my drill and my ladders...
 
I had a similar situation with a Sky installer a while ago... we were agreeing on the cabling route, when he told me that he only has 1 drill... and it's 10mm and 450mm long. Nothing else at all. We ended up using my drill and my ladders...
Coach screws for everything and 10mm wall plugs. ?
 
I think that part of the problem is that they are trained to do a specific job and only that job. In the van will be all that is needed to do that job, and nothing more. So asking to have an isolator fitted is not part of the job that they are set up to do.

I had a similar situation with a Sky installer a while ago... we were agreeing on the cabling route, when he told me that he only has 1 drill... and it's 10mm and 450mm long. Nothing else at all. We ended up using my drill and my ladders...
A well-thought-out reply, you make a very good point.

I guess my issue isn't really with the sub-contractors tasked to do the work, and I take your implied point that dealing with anything non-standard will slow them down/require them to be trained to a higher level etc.

I guess I'm just disappointed that at a company level, it's not something they recognise or have even registered. Anyone whose meter (with a built-in isolator) they replace, in the event of needing works doing in the future that requires isolation, the customer will be worse off to the tune of:

  • £50-100 to fit an isolator (or more if the DNO has to do it)
  • up to an hour on the phone trying to sort that out
  • having to wait anything from a week to 4 months for someone to sort it

The people they're persuading to get smart meters are not in a position to know they've been done out of the above when they give their consent, and they're unlikely to be able to prove they've been diddled, unless they have a photo of their old meter.

On a separate note, I'd hate to be in the position of the Sky installer you mentioned... over the years I've accumulated a vast number of tools and random spare bits and bobs that I probably won't need for any particular job, but if I didn't have it I'd be embarrassed when I occasionally do need them. I'd find it mentally very challenging to only come equipped with the bare minimum, and risk not being able to do a proper job if the situation on site is not quite as expected.
 
It's not a PEN conductor.
I did originally think that was his point, but I defer to believing he was referring to the 2nd clause:

In TN-C-S and TN-S systems, isolation or switching of the neutral conductor is not required if protective equipotential bonding is installed and either: • the neutral conductor is reliably connected to earth by a low resistance to meet the disconnection times of the protective devices according to the requirements of Chapter 41 or • the distribution network operator (DNO) declares that either the PEN or the N conductor of the supply is reliably connected to earth by a low resistance to meet the disconnection times of the protective devices according to the requirements in Chapter 41
 
And I've not been paying attention.

Possibly (he says, hopefully), because I was only talking about the technicality which is that you are working with a live conductor when you put that N tail into the isolator switch, or Henley, or whatever. But then technically does even the meter switch in the line comply with the standards for an isolator?
 

Reply to They want to install a smart meter... but won't fit an isolator... which my old meter has built-in... in the UK Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

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