Perusing a career in Electrics

[LukeS3]

Hey guys,

I'm nearly 21, did a 3 day induction before I left school at my local construction college, loved it. Left school at 16, got pretty crappy grades, and so it all went to pot and I didn't return to college.

Only recently have I decided, yet again, that I really want to peruse this career.

3 weeks ago I started a 10-12 week course at a local training centre (Maths Level 1 & English Level 2) to try and get them up. I'm really not that great at either, but English is certainly the stronger out of the two.

If I get my certificates for both of these, would it be of any good use to me? or would I maybe need to get my Maths to Level 2 also?

The idea thus far is to eventually get an Apprenticeship, and do one day college, or as said many times on here, night college.

Just to mention: My dad is a chippy, owns his own business with his brother and they have a self employed sparky working for them, and has been for quite a few years. I'm hoping this could be a bit of an advantage too. My Dad and Unlce have already mentioned the opportunities there for me should I become qualified.

Any advice would be great!

 

[Essexboy7]

why dont you go to college and learn to be a chippy then you could work for your old man?

 

[LukeS3]

why dont you go to college and learn to be a chippy then you could work for your old man?

I can work for him, as sparky, I hope

 

[Martyc]

There's a lot of maths to learn with the science side. You'd need to be fairly proficient with a calculator, equasions and transposing formulas. And rumour has it the current qual (c&g 2365) has a lower exam success rate than the one it has just superseded. Unless my tutor is just scare-mongering us into studying harder of course....
I'm not trying to put you off, but it's not as easy as just connecting wires.

 

[rockman]

No way, you go for it kid, if this is realy what u want to do, you will oercome all hurdles that are placed in your way.
But I would recommend going for an upgrade on your maths qualifications to O level standard.

 

[rmc86uk]

Sounds like you really want to do this especially with brushing up on your Maths and English.

Is your plan to do an apprenticeship with this Electrician your Dad works with or hopefully get one with another company?

Have a look at www.jtltraining.com.

Your two options are to do an apprenticeship with someone like JTL or get a job with a company and go on day release/night college.

Good luck :thumbup:

 

[JoeDurky]

I did my apprenticeship with JTL great training providers and seemed to go the extra mile to help out and advise. I left school with decent grades, however there were lads on the course that didn't and they had to do key skills courses to apparently get similar grades to gcse's. I worked hard to get my grades to secure a place with JTL, for some reason the year we did exams I secured double C in IT. Got the certificate in the Jan, then they regraded the exam in July and dropped me to double D grades. To cut a long story short I had to do IT key skills to get the grade to a C. It was unreal multiple choice on a comp. 1st question was " what do you use with a computer A. a cat, B. a dog , C. a mouse or D. a rabbit. Unreal

Sorry off the subject abit but always stuck in my head

 

[LukeS3]

Sounds like you really want to do this especially with brushing up on your Maths and English.

Is your plan to do an apprenticeship with this Electrician your Dad works with or hopefully get one with another company?

Have a look at www.jtltraining.com.

Your two options are to do an apprenticeship with someone like JTL or get a job with a company and go on day release/night college.

Good luck :thumbup:

Thanks for all the replies guys.

My dad has said that an apprenticeship with Damien (the guy that he works with) is certainly an option, he's taken a few guys on before and I've been told he's very experienced.

I'm confident that I will pass my English exam which takes place in approximately 5-6 weeks if I work hard, and my English is pretty good anyway - that will give me a Level 2 certificate, which is an equivalent of A-C.

As for Maths, hopefully I will pass my Level 1 in 5 weeks time. Then if needed, I will do Maths Level 2 which is a 11 weeks course.

This would then give me an equivalent of A-C in both subjects which I already know is noticed in the electrical industry (correct me if I'm wrong), unlike Uni for example, which doesn't notice equivalents.

When I have a bit of spare time in a couple of hours, I'm going to do some research into JTL

 

[LukeS3]

JTL seems a pretty good choice.

 

[markc123]

Definitley go for the Maths level 2 - not sure where you would stand with this, you can just enquire and they'll let you know.

Electrical courses/apprenterships are very maths based - and they do get rather technical, id brush up on your maths more than your english to be honest.

Good luck.

 

[Des 56]

If you want to be an electrician,then go for it and all the best,it will be hard graft, if you are serious with your effort you will get the reward of a brilliant way to earn a living,working with the tools of a subject that can be enjoyed as well as being just the crust earner

Mind you, the spark working for your dad may not be too inclined to train his own successor

 

[LukeS3]

If you want to be an electrician,then go for it and all the best,it will be hard graft, if you are serious with your effort you will get the reward of a brilliant way to earn a living,working with the tools of a subject that can be enjoyed as well as being just the crust earner

Mind you, the spark working for your dad may not be too inclined to train his own successor

My Dad and his brother do work for GAP all over the country and they only use the electrician for those jobs. Otherwise, he has his own small business working locally.

I am certainly concentrating on my maths more anyway, as I should have my English Level 2 in a month or so.

A few lads that I know had to get theirs maths or English up too, and they were advised not to retake GCSE's as they're a waste of time, rather more, do the 10-12 week Level 2 courses as they're far quicker.

 

[Tesla1980]

Dont bother trying to become electrician market is flooded with polish and eastern european cowboys get a job in tesco you will be paid the same or try and leave the country

 

[Rockstar94]

Good luck to you mate for wanting to do a proper apprenticeship. You will be a better sparks for it. Hope it all works out, you seem really driven

 

[LukeS3]

Dont bother trying to become electrician market is flooded with polish and eastern european cowboys get a job in tesco you will be paid the same or try and leave the country

Hmmm... that doesn't sound too good :/

 

[markc123]

Basically, the trade is full of every tom, dick & harry. You get the proper qualifications and understanding of the trade backed up with experience you can make a bob or 2 putting other peoples work right.

 

[alboh]

With an apprentiship these days you do a thing called key skills!! Maths, English etc so grades are not everything. I had crap grades and still got an apprentiship but did key skills also. Just enquire with your local college

 

[Tesla1980]

it's the truth though mate to many foreign workers here working for peanuts until we leave europe it wont get better good luck though

 

[LukeS3]

it's the truth though mate to many foreign workers here working for peanuts until we leave europe it wont get better good luck though

Thanks.

At this current moment in time, I'm out of work due to being laid off from my job of just over 2 years in retail which I friggin' hate with passion.

Therefore, I am now on JSA and although I know it's okay as I have reason to be claiming due to being laid off, but I feel like a useless so and so and boredom is slowly becoming a problem.

I am definitely set on training to be an electrician as in time when I become qualified, I will be working in the family business.

Another question;

What are some good routes to take considering I'm now on JSA?

I have been looking around and come across NCS. I requested their Electrician Information Pack and received it today through the post and it sounds pretty good and most of the reviews seem somewhat decent.

 

[Tesla1980]

Go do a one day a week proper course at college and get a job as a electricians mate now your signed on the learning support fund will pay 75% or more towards your course cost get your wiring regs done too now your signed on 17th edition (BS7671) and CSCS or ECS card if you can as a electrical labourer.

The books are expensive be warned but you can get help from college with funds

Now your puuting the biro on the giro is a perfect time to enrol for september do not what so ever get on one of these courses that promise the earth for thousands of £££££££££ not worth it mate normal college will be far better let these words sink in slow and steady it will take years to get fully qualified not 6 months.

you can do 16hrs a week at college and still get JSA while your looking for work you can't do anymore you will lose benefit entitelement.

And regarding maths and english you do a exam to get into college to see where your at and they can help you with these subjects if they need improving. Your maths needs to be good as there is alot of it in the theory so maybe a eveing course at college or a tutor for a couple of hours a week not as expensive as you might think or re sit your maths gcse ?

I hope this helps you.

ps : get a college prospectus ASAP go talk to some tutors and get your foot in the door for september.

 

[LukeS3]

I actually contacted my local college today (Milton Keynes College).

Spoke to a lady for about 15 minutes, very friendly and she explained what the college can offer me.

She linked me to this: Milton Keynes College Online Enrolment & Applications

... and gave me a rough outline of the details in the above link, and basically said that this is the only route that I can take in MK College, and that I would then need to find an apprenticeship myself. She said the college do not offer help searching for an apprenticeship.

Either I'm lost, or this lady doesn't know what the F**K she's talking about. :laugh3:

So...

After my own little search, I find;

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Keywords: Electrical Installation

Description:

Certificate in Electrotechnical Technology C&G2330 Level 3
Level 2 Diploma in Electrical Installations
C&G 2365 Diploma in Electrical Installations Level 2
C&G 2382 BS7671 Certificate in the Requirements for Electrical Installations (17th Edition Update)
C&G 2382 BS7671 Certificate in the Requirements for Electrical Installations (17th Edition Update)
C&G 2394 Award in the Initial Verification and Certification of Electrical Installations
C&G 2395 Award in the Periodic Inspection, Testing and Certification of Electrical Installations
C&G 2396 Level 4 Award in the Design and Verification of Electrical Installations
C&G 2396 Level 4 Award in the Design and Verification of Electrical Installations
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

But I was told that the C&G2330 Level 3 course was the 'ONLY' route to take.

I told her to begin with that I know next to nothing about what courses I need to take and in which order I should take them.

So I'm no better off than before I picked up the phone and rang the college.

:banghead:

 

[Martyc]

Could be wrong but 2330 has now been superseded by the 2365, which you'll need to start at level 2 to get a good basis on the science-y stuff before progressing to level 3.
That's the way it was explained to me anyway.

 

[Skimpy Wan]

Hello mate,

Try calling, and speaking to, Brian Scadden
on 023 9225 5936. Not only has he been in the industry for years, written numerous books on electrics, designed some of the testing procedures etc, but he also runs a training centre / business - http://www.brianscaddan.co.uk.

I've always found him useful for advice on the current qualifications required and the best route to take to becoming a sparky.

 

[LukeS3]

Hello mate,

Try calling, and speaking to, Brian Scadden
on 023 9225 5936. Not only has he been in the industry for years, written numerous books on electrics, designed some of the testing procedures etc, but he also runs a training centre / business - http://www.brianscaddan.co.uk.

I've always found him useful for advice on the current qualifications required and the best route to take to becoming a sparky.

Thanks mate.

I think you'll agree that the above information I was given, was pretty much useless?

I will let you know how it goes.

 

[ian.settle1]

Dont bother trying to become electrician market is flooded with polish and eastern european cowboys get a job in tesco you will be paid the same or try and leave the country

Better to be qualified and have a trade before he leaves the country gives him a better chance than being unqualified

 

[Tesla1980]

Better to be qualified and have a trade before he leaves the country gives him a better chance than being unqualified

The polish manage ok :wink_smile:

 

[LukeS3]

It's amazing how my college offer C&G 2365 Level 2 from the 17/09/2013 until 30/06/2015

That's something like 1 year 8 months off the top of my head, yet so many other companies, tradeskills4u for example; offer it over 16 weeks. In some cases it's understandable if it was a fast track course that was a couple of months faster or something, but this, wow, that is a huge difference!

How can the C&G 2365 Level 2 course offered by my college be the same as C&G Level 2 offered by the likes of tradeskills4u?

Surely not...?

 

[Martyc]

I'm doing it in one academic year at my local college, but it is 3 nights a week to fit it all in which is a huge commitment with work family etc

 

[LukeS3]

I'm doing it in one academic year at my local college, but it is 3 nights a week to fit it all in which is a huge commitment with work family etc

I dropped by into college today and got allot better advice.

I have decided that I will try and get an apprenticeship and do day release, in which case - I can apply as soon as I have an employer under my belt.

Otherwise, I'll either do C&G 2365 evening studying over the course of 2 years (18:00-21:00 on Tue/Wed) or full time over the course of 1 year.

 

[markc123]

It's amazing how my college offer C&G 2365 Level 2 from the 17/09/2013 until 30/06/2015

That's something like 1 year 8 months off the top of my head, yet so many other companies, tradeskills4u for example; offer it over 16 weeks. In some cases it's understandable if it was a fast track course that was a couple of months faster or something, but this, wow, that is a huge difference!

How can the C&G 2365 Level 2 course offered by my college be the same as C&G Level 2 offered by the likes of tradeskills4u?

Surely not...?

Keep asking yourself them questions mate - because every electrician is asking the same. How?

Trust me, the information you learn on the college courses cannot be taught in weeks no matter how clever you are. It is not possible. You'll also find they charge you an even bigger amount than the college. It's all about money, they don't care about you as a person, nor do they care about your future prospects in the trade.

Go down the proper route, because one day (hopefully) the trade will get properly sorted out, and all these short courses will be a thing of the past.

 

[LukeS3]

Keep asking yourself them questions mate - because every electrician is asking the same. How?

Trust me, the information you learn on the college courses cannot be taught in weeks no matter how clever you are. It is not possible. You'll also find they charge you an even bigger amount than the college. It's all about money, they don't care about you as a person, nor do they care about your future prospects in the trade.

Go down the proper route, because one day (hopefully) the trade will get properly sorted out, and all these short courses will be a thing of the past.

This must have a huge impact on the industry. Course durations being that different and having the same outcome is ridiculous - all about money if you ask me.

It has actually been confirmed to me today by my local college that I will be fully funded for the C&G 2365 course, but would have to pay my way for Level 3.

 

[Tesla1980]

Go for it mate stay away from training providers they are scum. See if you can do college in evenings and work as a mate as well do cscs and ecs i'm not sure if the DWP will pay for ECS card.

The ideal route is a apprenticship but you will be very lucky to get one, so the next best route is to work in the trade as a electricians mate go to college and ask lots of questions with the tradesmen you work with and expect to get crap jobs everyone starts at the bottom.

And as my dad says 50+ years as a industrial eletrician retired now '' Watch And Learn''

What is Skill

''Skill is the ability to perform a task to a predefined standard of competence, but to many the word also connotes a dimension of increasing ability (i.e. a hierarchy of skill). Thus while skill is synonymous with competence, it also evokes images of expertise, mastery and excellence. Skill is by definition acquired through formal and/or informal learning and through practice.''

 

[LukeS3]

I'm getting there. Learned allot just in this topic.

I'm currently contacting electricians/companies/literally everything and anything I can within my area to get some experience.

Many thanks to all that have contributed in this topic!

 

[Spark92]

JTL SUCK!@#! They talk to school leavers like crap. Unless it just my area lol. As i am from chatham

 

[LukeS3]

Today my teacher offered me a Construction Level 1 course and a CSCS course combined in, which will take about 13-15 weeks - All of which would be completed before September.

I asked him if that would be of any credit to my electrician course, and he said the college will like that fact that I've done a Level 1 in construction.

Do you guys agree? Sounds good to me.

 

[markc123]

Today my teacher offered me a Construction Level 1 course and a CSCS course combined in, which will take about 13-15 weeks - All of which would be completed before September.

I asked him if that would be of any credit to my electrician course, and he said the college will like that fact that I've done a Level 1 in construction.

Do you guys agree? Sounds good to me.

This is through your own admission buddy that you're qualifications in maths/english wern't up to scratch...and it's probably the reason you've been put on the level 1 course to start with - but there is no shame in that. Does it cost you anything?

13/15week sounds about right for it.

I can also see where they're coming from as regards to the fact that the college will like it - course they will, shows you are enthusiastic. But because it's a level 1 course, you may get some kids just out of school who are on it because they've got nothing else better to do and don't give a flying F about the trade - just don't let them distract you. Crack on with the level 1 untill september, and then hopefully get put on to the 2357 electrical course.

Best of luck.

 

[LukeS3]

This is through your own admission buddy that you're qualifications in maths/english wern't up to scratch...and it's probably the reason you've been put on the level 1 course to start with - but there is no shame in that. Does it cost you anything?

13/15week sounds about right for it.

I can also see where they're coming from as regards to the fact that the college will like it - course they will, shows you are enthusiastic. But because it's a level 1 course, you may get some kids just out of school who are on it because they've got nothing else better to do and don't give a flying F about the trade - just don't let them distract you. Crack on with the level 1 untill september, and then hopefully get put on to the 2357 electrical course.

Best of luck.

2357 Course? 2365 is what I'm going for mate.

Also, no, I don't have to pay for it, they just offered it to me alongside a CSCS course to get the certificate and have something on record and to show for.

Remember, the courses I'm talking about here is nothing to do with college. I'm getting my Maths & English up with a training centre called InTraining which also offer other little courses too, which include Construction Level 1 & CSCS.

All of what I'm doing now is like pre college things/courses/and whatever else, so that when it comes to actually trying to get into the college course, I can show that I have done these short courses; (with InTraining)

English Level 2
Maths Level 2
Construction Level 1
CSCS training

I just don't want to apply for a college course with nothing to show... yeah, people still get on courses that way, but my idea of thinking is why not do the above things up until September whilst I'm not doing anything then publish them when it comes to the time. Maybe my chances of getting into college stay the same even after completing these courses? I dunno...

 

[Tesla1980]

Go pay £17.50 and do the CSCS health and safety rubbish then pay £30 and send off for the card CSCS - Construction Skills Certification Scheme | Official Site get some site work as a labourer then see if you can get some work as a electricians mate.

your thoughts

 

[Tradeskills4u]

Keep asking yourself them questions mate - because every electrician is asking the same. How?

Trust me, the information you learn on the college courses cannot be taught in weeks no matter how clever you are. It is not possible. You'll also find they charge you an even bigger amount than the college. It's all about money, they don't care about you as a person, nor do they care about your future prospects in the trade.

Go down the proper route, because one day (hopefully) the trade will get properly sorted out, and all these short courses will be a thing of the past.

Hi Markc123 - I wanted to answer your question "How?" as it's really just a case of simple maths. We can offer this course in a shorter space of time because it is full time training Monday to Friday each week rather than 1 day a week. We also don't go on holiday for 20 weeks of the year like many colleges. We offer the training for the 2365 2 weeks on 2 weeks off which also allows candidates enough time to complete any homework or projects they are tasked between lessons. What's key is that all City & Guilds Qualifications have guided learning hours and we have to stick to those as does a college. So the total time spent learning is exactly the same. In fact quite often you find with College courses there is a lot of time wasted re-capping from previous sessions which are further apart where as with us you don't really get that as much.

We are a specialist electrical trainer. It's pretty much all we do and as such we know these courses in side out and the best way to deliver them. Many employers simply don't want someone learning key subjects over a period of weeks which can be taught in days.

With regards to us not caring about our students I won't actually answer that but will leave you with a quote from one of our customers on a very similar course:

"We have recently had an apprentice at your Crawley site pass his 2357 accelerated course and he is currently developing his practical skills out in the real world under the guidance of John Avenell from JTL.

We have been so impressed with JTL and Tradeskills4U we felt it only apt to comment. I made my initial enquiries with Tradeskills4U, Crawley after coming across your company details following a Google search. From my initial contact to now we have been fully supported and guided through the apprenticeship process. The union between JTL and Tradeskills4U is seamless and it is a credit to both bodies that their accessibility, help and guidance provided surpassed our expectations. Donna Latimer should be commended for her ongoing support, advice and guidance provided to Will and ourselves. Mark Syrett and John Avenell from JTL have also been immeasurably helpful and supportive.

Most importantly Will has described his time at Tradeskills4U as the best learning experience of his life. His tutor was James Deans. Will credits James with being enthusiastic, motivational and positive. He, along with Donna, helped Will to feel positive about his abilities to succeed which, ultimately, he did.

We would, without hesitation, use your services again and have been actively recommending your company to other businesses.

Once again, thank you for a very positive experience and for providing Will an environment in which he achieved.

Kind Regards

Elaine Stanley"

Needless to say random comments about a training centre you have no experience of are almost libellous and we do take exception at anyone suggesting we do not care about our students. Yes there are some training companies out there that are unscrupulous, take peoples money and don't deliver but we are definitely not one of them. Read comments about us on this forum and you will see we have a pretty solid reputation and this has been built on a record of delivering for our students.

 

[chcnorris29]

As an apprentice my self (have been since September last year) with a company via JTL I would say go for it.

I enjoy the work and I go to college 1 day a week.
The days you do college may change over the course of the 4 year apprenticeship and it may be that for some of the time you are on block release meaning you go to college every day for a few weeks a year and work all week the rest of the year.


Be prepared to work what can be some long hours and be prepared to work hard.

In my company we a re-wire in a day every day so it is hard work most of the time. But the harder you work the earlier you finish when doing work like that.

Thanks.

 

[chcnorris29]

As people are saying:
How can you be qualified in short 16 week (or whatever time) courses when it takes 4 years via correct routes?

Answer: you can NOT.

The courses say you become qualified an yes you may get some qualification like some testing course or something but it is not the full qualifications needed. And the full qualifications is what you want.

Personally I hope that companies will (eventually) realise this and only employ those who did the full qualifications, the correct way.
That way those who worked for the qualifications will get good work and those who where stupid enough to think it can be done in a few weeks will not be working in the trade.

Thanks.

 

[Mr Curnow]

Whatever is quick and easy will not pay off in the long run, 16 week courses are obviously going to cram the information in, you'll forget and by the time you are qualified you won't feel confident in doing the job. I hear so many negative people on this forum saying stuff like "blame the polish, don't become an electrician you won't get a job", ignore them, you'll only feel depressed listening to these kind of people.

 

[Konrad]

The polish manage ok :wink_smile:

Polish, not polish - and **** off from me ****ing racist. You can carry my screw driver at max if I will let you do it - before you will nick it and sell it for a pint. Vote ukip you racist ----- so we can ban your immigrants from spain seal our borders and tell you to **** off. We naturaly sell you our goods - after all of factories will be transferred to continent and of course you can afford to pay.