Discuss Query regarding rules on certification in the Periodic Inspection Reporting & Certification area at ElectriciansForums.net

A

Aza

Hi

This is a bit long winded, but just to explain the full story.
The question is at the end :)

My ex has had no hot water and only temp heaters for four weeks due to a broken common biomass system that feeds 54 houses.
As a temporary solution they have installed a peak off peak immersion into the hot water side of the biomass manifold.
They installed it with 2.5mm cable into a 32a rcbo, with 25mm entry hole into pattress, wrong flex and no time clocks.

I started a row on the phone, so another company came and had a look and "made recommendations", a third company is testing and certifying it Monday.
All the sparks will tell me is all water heaters must be on an rcbo.
There's 3 spare ways on the rcd side. I said you wasted money on an rcbo when you could have spent four quid on an mcb and spent the rest on a proper clock.


So one company subbed it out to another who did all the bad work. The intial company "made recommendations" after rushing round after I phoned, and they carried out the recommendations.
So thats two companies doing the install.
A third company is coming out on Monday to test it all and issue certs....

After complaining about this, all I can get out of anyone is "You dont know what you're talking about, all immersion heaters must be on a dedicated rcbo"
I said its only supposed to be on its own circuit, it can be on a common rcd. He swerves the question about why is a third party company issuing an EIC for work they didn't do.

So basically I am wondering what are the rules regarding another company issuing a certificate for work they didn't do?
And what should I do about this?

Cheers
 
Although this hasn't yet got a practical working format. An EIC can't be issued by a third party, but an EICR can. Sounds like a right sham to me......
 
Well it seems fishy to me.
I was always under the impression that this was unacceptable.
Otherwise I could do any old **** work and pay someone to certify it for me.
Which appears to have happened here.
 
Does that mean she it paying extra to run the heater as it it normally a common charge?

Boydy

Hello chap. I asked a friend (the op) to ask the question as I wasn't a member here,so sorry for not doing an intro post if you need to. I just saw your question and thought I had better answer myself :)

Yes she normally pays a comunal charge for heating and hot water. The money she's spending at the moment on electric heating and hot water is very high and frankly unsustainable for her. All the private houses have had a bank of communal boilers boilers fitted as a temporary measure from what I understand but she's been told that she can't have any extra help because she's only a tenant in a housing association property. NHBC are involved and are insisting the biomass is completely replaced buf fhis is expected to take over six months.
 
Does that mean she it paying extra to run the heater as it it normally a common charge?

Boydy

Hello chap. I asked a friend (the op) to ask the question as I wasn't a member here,so sorry for not doing an intro post if you need to. I just saw your question and thought I had better answer myself :)

Yes she normally pays a comunal charge for heating and hot water. The money she's spending at the moment on electric heating and hot water is very high and frankly unsustainable for her. All the private houses have had a bank of communal boilers boilers fitted as a temporary measure from what I understand but she's been told that she can't have any extra help because she's only a tenant in a housing association property. NHBC are involved and are insisting the biomass is completely replaced buf fhis is expected to take over six months.
 
How can the off peak side of things work then?? You need an off peak timed metering arrangement for that set-up to work so-called efficiently!!
 
er... no, unless they have introduced the "rules" without publishing them!

Taken from part p document

Changes in the legal requirements

  • The range of electrical installation work that is notifiable (where there is a requirement to certifycompliance with the Building Regulations) has been reduced.
  • An installer who is not a registered competent person may use a registered third party to certifynotifiable electrical installation work as an alternative to using a building control body.
 

Taken from part p document

Changes in the legal requirements

  • The range of electrical installation work that is notifiable (where there is a requirement to certifycompliance with the Building Regulations) has been reduced.
  • An installer who is not a registered competent person may use a registered third party to certifynotifiable electrical installation work as an alternative to using a building control body.

So can you point me at the rules?
 
Don't think 3rd party cert active yet, still subject to the framework and paperwork being ratified.

They could however say that they designed it, monitored the work throughout and inspected it, which is a different scenario.
 
Read the thread up to the mention of NHBC....be assured that if they are steering the boat,dismay is guaranteed,they were the template for many a follow-on scheme scam...
 
surely this should be in the diy forum as the man has got his mate to ask the original question then when it gets a bit involved he comes into it as a non electrician
 
Yup. As I said can you point me at the rules? As far as I know this still hasn't been defined.

Thats my understanding as well Murdoch. The current EIC certification requires you to tick a number of boxes (such as routing of cables in zones) that you wouldn't actually know the answer to so I guess we're waiting for the correct 'new form' to be introduced for third parties to sign off. I wouldn't consider signing off anybody elses work until the 'new rules' are far more clear.

I'd be interested in the answer to the OP's other question as to whether an RCBO is required? Surely if its on its on MCB with RCD protection that is ok?
 

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