strict sites

[Dean Williams]

has anyone worked on really strict sites

im currently testing on the largest site ive ever worked on in Runcorn, where 'whistleblowers' are rewarded with offers of flat screen tellies, meal vouchers etc. There's been 2 strikes so far...

 

[shanky887614]

has anyone worked on really strict sites

im currently testing on the largest site ive ever worked on in Runcorn, where 'whistleblowers' are rewarded with offers of flat screen tellies, meal vouchers etc. There's been 2 strikes so far...

depends on what you mean by really strict sites.

im guessing the usual, gloves,glasses,hardhat etc.

no steps,ladders etc and permits for everything inc going for a $hit

 

[ipf]

Plenty in years gone by. One in scouseland.....that strict half me scaffold went missing....:hump: strict on everything bar thieves.

 

[Diddy]

I worked on the Channel tunnel and that was strict in the H&S manner that shanky above reflects on. You could/would be faced with instant dismissal for not wearing glasses ect. There was also £1000+ rewards on offer for information leading to the sacking of personell who were found to be indulging in sabotage.....which was quite rife for a time down there due to the wages being good and nobody wanting it to end lol. Personally I just kept my nose clean glasses on and head down and got on with my job...let the managers manage.

 

[Dean Williams]

thats it, hard hat gloves and glasses. permits for everything, rams, 4 hour induction, spot checks every day, no stanley knives, no steps-podiums only, no radios, no food or drink, long-sleeved clothing at all times, no jewellery.
the job itself is brilliant, i love it. the rules are a bit crazy though!

 

[shanky887614]

thats it, hard hat gloves and glasses. permits for everything, rams, 4 hour induction, spot checks every day, no stanley knives, no steps-podiums only, no radios, no food or drink, long-sleeved clothing at all times, no jewellery.
the job itself is brilliant, i love it. the rules are a bit crazy though!

no problem for me, i dont use any stanley tools XD

surely an electricians knife is more dangerous?

it has only taken me 5-10mins to sharpen a folding knife through

dmt,1k,4k then 8k 8k= razor sharp e.g. i would shave with it

 

[Guest55]

thats it, hard hat gloves and glasses. permits for everything, rams, 4 hour induction, spot checks every day, no stanley knives, no steps-podiums only, no radios, no food or drink, long-sleeved clothing at all times, no jewellery.
the job itself is brilliant, i love it. the rules are a bit crazy though!

no way would i tolerate miserable & inflexible working conditions such as these for 5 seconds , the moneys irrelevent.

Thats what happens when the bigger contractors of the UK embrace the over zealous H&S mantra.

in fact i've quit jobs with a more relaxed atmosphere than that.

 

[Dean Williams]

also no phones on site. no exceptions
and as of next week when im live testing, its rubber mat, permist to test live, insulated gauntlets, safe isolation supervised by H&S, barriers, no lone working. im a bag of nerves! then there's the red card system: yellow card = warning, another yellow card= 3 month site ban, red card= permanent ban. and a few have been banned already!

 

[Guest55]

also no phones on site. no exceptions
and as of next week when im live testing, its rubber mat, permist to test live, insulated gauntlets, safe isolation supervised by H&S, barriers, no lone working. im a bag of nerves! then there's the red card system: yellow card = warning, another yellow card= 3 month site ban, red card= permanent ban. and a few have been banned already!

in other words , 2 hours of prep for a 10 second earth loop test........

the worlds gone f******* mad lol

 

[shanky887614]

also no phones on site. no exceptions
and as of next week when im live testing, its rubber mat, permist to test live, insulated gauntlets, safe isolation supervised by H&S, barriers, no lone working. im a bag of nerves! then there's the red card system: yellow card = warning, another yellow card= 3 month site ban, red card= permanent ban. and a few have been banned already!

i wouldnt work there.

why do you need insulated gauntlets to test?

we had that but because of where it was fed from we enjoyed telling them we would have to isolate the whole site XD.

one of the jobs we are working on will be a right laugh soon.

ok old system ripped out and new installed off new bms panel, patients transfered to the finished isolation rooms, phase 2 rip out old and then install into running bms panel with patients in isolation ward fed from panel.


how do you test and commision the system?

we are not allowed in the wards till patients have been removed and the rooms have been sterilised with hydrogen peroxcide etc

 

[Engineer54]

And the REAL cost of all these draconian rules?? (and in many cases unofficial ones at that) ...Probably 3 times that of a standard H&S ruled project. Someone, somewhere, somehow is making a wedge, ...of that i am certain!! lol!!

 

[haptism]

Them sites not for everyone, myself included

 

[telectrix]

only strict site i been on involved smart young ladies in basques, bradishing whips.

 

[trev]

PPE is supposed to be a last resort to be taken when hazards cannot be removed. Instead, it's used stupidly. Baileys a few years back had a policy that gloves were to be worn at all times but because it's tricky to terminate cables with gloves on we could cut the fingers out of them.
So what the hell was the point of the gloves?

 

[Dean Williams]

the gloves we have to wear have the thumb tip and first 2 fingertips missing

 

[shanky887614]

the gloves we have to wear have the thumb tip and first 2 fingertips missing

you should see mine, my snickers gloves are completely shreded, ive got strands of cable holding them together lol

i wear them so all is good in there eyes lol

 

[telectrix]

old school sparks didn't need this sort of shyte. you knew the hazards and dealt with them accordingly, not blindly following the rules laid down by some suit/jobsworth who knew less about electrical installations than my dog.

 

[Diddy]

H & S has its place in big building sites. We are all so anti-rules and sit back and mutter the worlds gone mad ect BUT why are we (construction) still the biggest killer from accidents at work ? Because H & S is not being implemented properly. It's put there to try to ensure you go home at night. Too many "in the good old days" types forget that deaths on construction sites were much higher than before H & S became involved. I have walked off site where I felt H & S is not up to scratch and too my liking.
Yes there are little Hitler's about....but they are not all H & S inspectors lol some are managers and owners/clients. We/you are there to do a job. If a 10 min job takes you 2 hours due to extra safety measures required by the site then do it....It's not your cash. The job will have been priced accordingly.
I am no company hero lol. It wont say on my headstone "Ol dave went that extra mile...." Balls to that.
As an aside the Glasses at the Channel Tunnel were like Michael Kane specs...to stop the sand getting in your eyes due to sudden gusts from the coast blowing sand into people on sites eyes. Apparently quite a few people had gotten eye problems due to this and the H & S response was permanent wearing of these plastic specs.....You know what ? It bloody worked too. They also had the safety record board at main entrance to boast about how many days since last death ect.....As annoying as it was I think overall it was pretty effective down there for its time.

 

[Diddy]

Apart from rubber mat I don't see too much wrong with the rules for Op's site tbh.

 

[trev]

Diddy, I don't think anyone really objects to sensible, properly applied H&S rules but it has become an industry in it's own right. Populated usually, by people who have never done any construction work but who get the right to dictate working practices to people who have often got decades of experience.
I've been on many sites where the wearing of a hi viz vest has been mandatory, it is on most now as I understand things, but what is the point of wearing one indoors?
Similarly with hard hats, what is the point of wearing one indoors? If the building collapses then those few millimetres of plastic balanced on your head is not going to save your life.

 

[telectrix]

was on a site a few tears ago. red hot august. roofers were ordered to put their hard hats on. perhaps a jumbo jet was going to drop frozen turds on them. they all walked off site. main contractor got them back only after binning the h&s hitler.

 

[dingledong]

old school sparks didn't need this sort of shyte. you knew the hazards and dealt with them accordingly, not blindly following the rules laid down by some suit/jobsworth who knew less about electrical installations than my dog.

Tel what does your dog charge for a coupl e of days work as a mate

 

[trev]

Late afternoon we were asked to stack light fittings upstairs in a building we were second fixing so we daisy chained a few lads and were passing them between us. I was on a half landing about a metre above floor level.
H&S ---- ordered me to put a harness on, gave me the choice between getting one on or being kicked off site.
How I laughed a few days later when I saw him wandering about the site with his hard hat on back to front.

 

[Diddy]

Trev - I agree with you but I also disagree lol. For a start H & S has to look after the lowest common denominator (People). There are plenty of unskilled people working on building sites. Some of them are bloody dangerous to be around. Then the flip side is when an accident happens it follows on that the injured is poss going to need treatment/cash they may have a case that they were "forced" to work in less than ideal conditions...some people need saving from themselves.
True story - I was subbying on a site for Romec in dover. Easy job easy cash good hours ect. Anyway about 3 weeks before handover 1 of my fellow sparks falls off a pair of steps...prat was working from top rung. This accident turned into big deal because the bloke landed freakishly on his arm.....which had to be amputated.
When I heard him scream I rushed into the room and straight to his aid....an old hand beside me said ffs Dave where's his hat.....we quickly threw one beside him..job done he got his compo and whatever else he was entitled to. The moral here is if he was found not to have been wearing ppe he would not have got anything and may even have been fined.....Arse covering all round im afraid.

 

[trev]

I guess we'll all have stories about H&S gone mad but some of it is good because it has cut the number of deaths and injuries

 

[telectrix]

if e was standing on the top of steps, he should not have go any compo. hard hat, my arse. any fool knows that balancing on the top step of ladders is stupid. i've walked off 2 sites where i was asked to do this and received pay for the dead time.

 

[Diddy]

if e was standing on the top of steps, he should not have go any compo. hard hat, my arse. any fool knows that balancing on the top step of ladders is stupid. i've walked off 2 sites where i was asked to do this and received pay for the dead time.

He blamed the steps but one of the other lads had noticed what he had been doing.....hard hat ect all true honest. The lads closed together and all backed the bloke up. The HH was put in place before site agent ect turned up at scene....it was one of the 1st things he/they asked. Poor condition steps supplied by the client were to blame in the end.....

 

[Dean Williams]

i worked at a site for a household kitchen appliance manufacturer near me where a worker was crushed by a scissor lift, the guy had a broken arm. the company gave him a load of money and told him to come to work every day but do no work....just so they could keep their 'accident free record' intact!!

 

[Dcf]

Like the electrical police scams ,the h&s scam has been thrust upon us over the years.
its another industry piggybacked on the top of ours that has to somehow justify its existence.
ive never fallen off a pair of steps in 27 years ....I'm not going to start now am I?
the no step rule is a great example.
no steps at all until the doors go on and you can't get a podium through.
can I levitate? Not unless I'm david Blaine.
ill get a pair of steps then.
ok.
every big site I've been on some donut has fallen down the lift shaft from varying heights regardless of the barriers/permits to work put in place.
as tel says old school sparks did not need this ****e in place for you to work safely.
its too risky , beat it gaffer / do it yourself would be the answer.
common sense is where it should be at.

 

[trev]

Don't get me wrong, I've refused to carry out work because proper access equipment hasn't been provided. I've also walked off sites if I've been asked to work in an unsafe manner BUT we all carry out our own risk assessments whether we're aware of it or not. Just the majority of times they don't get recorded.

 

[Adam W]

My last site was one of these 'strict sites'. 3 of us started on the same day, finished the 4 hour induction and went up to the site. It was baking hot and we were just second fixing in a room with a finished ceiling so we took our hard hats off. The H&S guy caught us and told us to go back down for re-induction. One guy walked.
The official stance was non-retractable knives were 'banned'; the electrical contractor's stance was 'don't get caught using one'.

On the plus side these sites usually have better welfare facilities.

 

[telectrix]

unfortunately, common sense has gone out thew window and it's now 1 cap fits all. legislate for the dumbos who, should, by all rights, die in accordance with the darwin theory, and leave the intelligent ones to determine how to work safely without having to allow for mongs.

 

[Adam W]

we all carry out our own risk assessments whether we're aware of it or not. Just the majority of times they don't get recorded.

Like I say - you carry out a quick unwritten risk assessment every time you cross the road.
I think we'll all be in trouble if people lose the ability to do that for them selves.

 

[trev]

Had an hour long site induction from the electrical contractor once. When it was finished we were herded into another room to get the Bomer & Kirkland hour long site induction which was pretty much word for word what the previous guy had told us.
We were moved to another site after a few weeks where we faced the same. I suggested getting the B&K guy in and they could each cover what the other missed thus saving time (and obviously money)
I was viewed as a radical.

 

[telectrix]

Tel what does your dog charge for a coupl e of days work as a mate

she's not ready yet. being trained to run under floors and in confined spaces with a draw cord attached to her collar. when trained up, she's for hire at £100/day + treats.

 

[shanky887614]

Like the electrical police scams ,the h&s scam has been thrust upon us over the years.
its another industry piggybacked on the top of ours that has to somehow justify its existence.
ive never fallen off a pair of steps in 27 years ....I'm not going to start now am I?
the no step rule is a great example.
no steps at all until the doors go on and you can't get a podium through.
can I levitate? Not unless I'm david Blaine.
ill get a pair of steps then.
ok.
every big site I've been on some donut has fallen down the lift shaft from varying heights regardless of the barriers/permits to work put in place.
as tel says old school sparks did not need this ****e in place for you to work safely.
its too risky , beat it gaffer / do it yourself would be the answer.
common sense is where it should be at.

been on a site before, no steps.

the ceilings went up and couldnt get podiums through the doors let alone stand them up.

every doorframe and most walls have marks on them where they have been bashed by podiums.

i have not known anyone to fall off a pair of steps, because you get people to hold them if they need steadying.

i have crawled/walked along cable trays before now and nothing wrong with it, no way to fall because your surrounded by pipes

 

[shanky887614]

Don't get me wrong, I've refused to carry out work because proper access equipment hasn't been provided. I've also walked off sites if I've been asked to work in an unsafe manner BUT we all carry out our own risk assessments whether we're aware of it or not. Just the majority of times they don't get recorded.

im sure we have all told our boss etc "no im not doing that, do it yourself" lol

 

[trev]

Like I say - you carry out a quick unwritten risk assessment every time you cross the road.
I think we'll all be in trouble if people lose the ability to do that for them selves.

It astonishes me that people have to be told that doing something is a bad idea. On the local news the other week there was a thing on about York university students being told that it isn't clever to walk along the river bank while rat arsed on cheap spirits.

 

[telectrix]

can't do it now, old bones and all, but in the past, i have climbed gantrys with a SWA tied round my neck, walked across girders and steel roof trusses, swam across canals, too old now for that. let the young 'uns try it with the h&s suits breathing down their necks.

 

[Adam W]

It astonishes me that people have to be told that doing something is a bad idea. On the local news the other week there was a thing on about York university students being told that it isn't clever to walk along the river bank while rat arsed on cheap spirits.

I don't think people have got 'stupider', but the emphasis has shifted from 'you should have seen it was dangerous and gone a different way' to 'the council should have put up a barrier and a sign', which discourages people from thinking for them selves - why bother taking responsibility for your own actions when 'nanny state' will do it for you?
You see it with kids straight out of school - give them a bit of responsibility and they're completely lost.

 

[trev]

Well my kids never needed to be supervised by the nanny state and neither will my grandson or any that come along in the future mate.

 

[Rockingit]

Thing is, Health and Safety used to be something that people did for themselves and their mates because everyone wanted to go home in one piece. Then someone decided to turn it into a career path for others to do unto them. Big mistake.

 

[trev]

The bloke who invented all these cards and coursesmust be laughing his balls off. £40 for a test a monkey could pass then an extra £25 for a card with your photo on. Some sites insist on that CSCS crap even if you're holding an ECS.
Ladder use
Working at heights
Confined spaces. WT actual F!
Manual handling
Money for old rope and someone is making a bloody fortune.
I'm bloody glad I'm self employed.

 

[Guest55]

the idiots guide to pointless site safety training...............

confined spaces - i can sit in a hole without panicking - check
ladder awareness - i can stand 3 feet off the ground without breaking my neck - check
asbestos awareness - yes i am aware its unpleasant stuff - check
manual handling - dont bother , get the forklift / JCB / burly labourer to shift it - check

;-D

 

[Adam W]

Slightly off at a tangent I found this blog the other day.

Under 'things we never had and didn't miss' there was:

"3. Blame and claim culture

Did you chip a fingernail at work? Or did you sit down on the loo at work and momentarily experience discomfort because the loo seat was a bit cold? Even worse, did someone wilfully injure your feelings by calling you a 'div' at work? Sue those buggers! Phone our hotline now, and we'll get you millions of pounds!

Disclaimer – we will not get you millions of pounds. We will get you up to and including five hundred new pounds, of which we will take up to a hundred percent.

Everyone everywhere is scared of everything. Even I have days where I don't want to leave the house in case a meteor falls on my head, or in case a terrorist comes up and tries to do terror at me.

But when I was growing up, getting injured was not a career. It was a vocation, at best. We did not expect to have our clumsiness rewarded with money. That's what clowns and Eddie The Eagle were for.

Now, if you're short of money and don't want to ring WONGACASHNOW4U, you can simply claim you were tripped over by a member of Al Qaeda, or that someone looked at you funny, and all your financial problems will disappear!

Our equivalent – looking where you were going -
​

You know what used to happen if you fell over in the street? Everyone would laugh at you. Certainly they wouldn't offer you money.

Of course, work accidents did happen, and they were generally quite serious, but back then people tried to avoid getting injured. They didn't like being injured, what with the pain and all. Getting injured was seen as a bad thing, not as an equivalent to winning the lottery.

When I was growing up, if you tripped over in the street you were unlucky, or a div. If you broke a nail or had your 'feelings injured' while at work, then you were a crybaby, and didn't deserve the job in the first place.

By the way, I wrote these last paragraphs on the toilet. Just thought you'd like to know."

 

[telectrix]

it's so bloody stupid. when i was a kid, we'd climb trees. we fell, got scrapes. end of. now we could sue the council for letting that tree grow there. the world has gone stupid.

 

[Knobhead]

The OP is testing on a plant he knows bugger all about and has the gall to complain about safety measures. If it’s the plant I’m thinking of their safety policy was based on the DuPont model.

 

[rompling]

H&S rules really get my bollo***
Only Ever became a must on site after ( I think ) the Hatfield rail disaster when directors of companies were Threatened with unlimited fines and prison
And lots of no win lawyers sucking the life out of the country
Looking after my interests yeh right ....
On the flip side there has been improvements but to me the best way is to implement your on H&S and then to sign a disclaimer
I have had to wear a hard hat when I have been the only person in a room working above 6ft and the people below have been ducking to miss my hard hat which kept falling off
Some many foreign " trades " on site nowdays you would have to shout fire in 7 languages !!

 

[rapparee]

There was a new fella in the factory one time, he forgot to wear his earplugs and he spied the hr officer walking up the floor towards him, he turned his back to the hr officer but alas it was too late he was spotted. The hr officer said "excuse me you're not wearing your earplugs, i need you to come to my office" the new fella weighed up his options, he didn't respond. The hr officer once again requested the new fella to come to her office, he stood on with his back to her not acknowleding her. The third time she was starting to get cross and tugged on his sleeve and shouted at him. He spun round to face her and then proceeded to mimick a deaf persons accent and tell her he couldnt hear what she was saying and make up a false hand gestures imitating sign language. The hr officer recoiled in horror apologised and fled back to her office, the rest of the boys fell about the place laughing and called the new fella a bad bas..... etc etc

 

[Dean Williams]

the site i know bugger all about is Runcorn TPS and its my first experience of such measures!