test results question

[chrish_1977]

Morning guys, sorry if this is been answered before but I'm fuming (again).
I have again had my eicr questioned by our qs. This time in particular my test results. Basically every result I measure with my tester unless there is some reason I can't, obviously note it all on the schedule of test results.

No he is telling me that because when he calculates my results they are over the nic guidelines of 0.4 ohms either way,and he has amended the results so that they calculate rather than what I measured.

Of course if something looks way out of line I will check by calculating, but I was always taught that actual readings should be noted and not calculated unless there is a reason why you couldn't get a live result.

I have been testing for about 5 years and never had any issues before and now and this guy seems to have swallowed the nic book and forgotten real life

Thanks

 

[Plonker 3]

Ask the QS since when did the NICEIC write the regs?

There are no guidelines in regards to this in GN3. Tell the QS you will report him to the NICEIC for giving out fraudulsnt reports if he keeps tampering with the info you give him.

 

[andyb]

I'm not sure what this has to do with the Nic, if tested write down the test results, if calculated write down the calculated results.

Nothing to do with the Nic, but if asked then I'm sure they would say the same.

 

[ruston]

This is a genuine question. Who's name goes on the report? I would not stand for anyone altering my report in any event , but especially to make it comply.
As Dillb has alluded to this is fraud.

 

[Spoon]

Put a note on the report about the changes and take it back to the QS and get him to put his signature next to the results he has changed.
That's you covered. Job done.

 

[ian.settle1]

Tell him that if he doesn't stop it then you will not be signing anymore test sheets as if something goes wrong and a court case is the outcome it will be your ar$e on the line not his

 

[ian.settle1]

Ask the QS since when did the NICEIC write the regs?
There are no guidelines in regards to this in GN3. Tell the QS you will report him to the NICEIC for giving out fraudulsnt reports if he keeps tampering with the info you give him.

With all the BS that they come out with people think they do write them

 

[Pete999]

Ask the QS since when did the NICEIC write the regs?

There are no guidelines in regards to this in GN3. Tell the QS you will report him to the NICEIC for giving out fraudulsnt reports if he keeps tampering with the info you give him.

Beat me to it Dillb, to many people think these scams are the B all and end all

 

[cobrauk]

Can you tell us your results so we can see what he is correcting please?

Reason I ask is things like ring mains results can sometimes not work out correct because of radial spurs etc

 

[chrish_1977]

He has taken the cert I wrote out and rewrote it so I can't even put the results up, he can't explain all this to me, just says that that's what the nic want to see, but as he put the element of doubt in my head wanted to consult you guys first, I have told him I'm not doing any more if this is the way he wants it doing. His answer was that if the readings I get don't match what the calculated values are I should go to every socket and check the terminals for tightness and test both sides of the socket until I get the readings to what they "should" be, doesn't seem to want to listen to my experience only what the nic have told him

 

[chrish_1977]

All he says to me is that my results aren't right when he calculates them

 

[Plonker 3]

What the NIC want to see and what complies with GN3 and the BGB are two complety different things. Take him a copy of both and tell him to show you where in either of those 2 books it says this.

 

[cobrauk]

There is no point in you testing anything if he want perfect results ( Me i always suspect the sparky has calculated rather then tested if they come out perfect ) I bet it something like the ring main taken Zs from measured Zs not matching.

But end of day when testing I always do quick checks to see if the results are working out correctly if not try and find out why might be as simple as a radial socket ( this is not part of the ring as far as results go I maintain its a sub circuit off the ring and show it as such)

 

[Bobster]

I have never once seen a calculated value match a measured one! Yes it should be in the ball park, but there are just too many variables at the time of testing.

 

[chrish_1977]

Pretty much what I said

 

[chrish_1977]

If he persists in going down this road then I will ask to see this guidance he is preaching

 

[Deleted member 72666]

Beat me to it Dillb, to many people think these scams are the B all and end all

[h=2]

Re: Things that make your blood boil...[/h]

Bad Grammar / spelling / / text talk / punctuation. there meaning their's, no meaning I know how to do it, in general the very poor standard of basic English coming out of schools these days, I'm old school so that's my excuse.​

• Sorry Pete, couldn't resist!

 

[Pete999]

Re: Things that make your blood boil...

Bad Grammar / spelling / / text talk / punctuation. there meaning their's, no meaning I know how to do it, in general the very poor standard of basic English coming out of schools these days, I'm old school so that's my excuse.​

• Sorry Pete, couldn't resist!

Know wurries m8 I is gettin old, it's only one O, and I did it on purpose to see who was awake, and if you believe that you will believe anything.

 

[Richard Burns]

I would tend to put in the remarks on the test results sheet, "all recorded values are directly measured values".
The only calculation I can think that he could do is using Zs= Ze+ R1+R2 and this will never match the measured Zs as they are different measurements.
However if he wants this as a calculation then Zs=Ze+R1+R2 is the worst case scenario so you could just not record the measured Zs.
I cannot remember what NICEIC fabricated for their forms or what they specify in terms of results.

 

[Leesparkykent]

Time to find another job I think, the QS sounds like a complete prat. You will probably never see eye to eye with some who clearly shows complete incompetence.

 

[Pete999]

Time to find another job I think, the QS sounds like a complete prat. You will probably never see eye to eye with some who clearly shows complete incompetence.

He sounds like a right jobsworth.

 

[Leesparkykent]

He sounds like a right jobsworth.

For sure. Crap situation though for the OP.

 

[Pete999]

For sure. Crap situation though for the OP.

Yep not a pleasant situation for him, maybe the QS is covering his behind, mustn't upset the NIC must we? after all they are the regulators!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[SirKit Breaker]

All he says to me is that my results aren't right when he calculates them

They wont be, he is obviously a numpty. Measured test results will always be a tad lower than calculated due to parallel paths, and in some cases they will be a lot lower.

Tell him to leave it to someone who knows what they are doing.....YOU, and advise him that he needs to do the Insp and test courses.

Cheers..............Howard

 

[chrish_1977]

He said to me that maybe I should read the osg to refresh my memory on testing, and I corrected him by saying "don't you mean gn3?" He didn't even know what a mantell unit was either

 

[chrish_1977]

Needless to say I have been stopped from testing because im such a headache for him

 

[Pete999]

Needless to say I have been stopped from testing because im such a headache for him

Deffo a bit of a twot isn't he? who stopped you testing? your boss I bet he's a twot as well then.

 

[chrish_1977]

No the qs basically took all th testing and gave it to another guy to do, to be honest I'm not that bothered he can have all the grief about it as I'm not listened too and talked to like I'm fresh out of my apprenticeship

 

[Plonker 3]

He said to me that maybe I should read the osg to refresh my memory on testing, and I corrected him by saying "don't you mean gn3?" He didn't even know what a mantell unit was either

Maybe you should ask him whereabouts in the OSG these "rules" he keeps talking about are.

 

[Pete999]

No the qs basically took all th testing and gave it to another guy to do, to be honest I'm not that bothered he can have all the grief about it as I'm not listened too and talked to like I'm fresh out of my apprenticeship

I have a good mate probably just like you, a QS good and conscientious, no one listened to him so eventually he left the company got binned by the NIC, because of all the crap they did, now there's a first.

 

[chrish_1977]

I feel like the good ones mostly get looked over and the bad ones go on to get the authority

 

[Pete999]

I feel like the good ones mostly get looked over and the bad ones go on to get the authority

Cosy up to the NIC job done

 

[chrish_1977]

Nic lapdog

 

[tigerpaul]

Without knowing what test results your on about, it sounds like the QS is fudging the results to ensure Zs values are within limits? Is that right?
Maybe he thinks Zs = Ze + r1+r2 is the be all and end all??
In that case why would we bother doing loop impedance tests at all?

 

[tigerpaul]

Sounds like the QS has got someone else to sign his made up test sheets now and not you. Oh well more fool him!

 

[chrish_1977]

Very much so, he does keep telling me how to test, like I've never done it before and how I should be getting my results, glad I've been doing it wrong these past 6 years

 

[CockneyReject]

They wont be, he is obviously a numpty. Measured test results will always be a tad lower than calculated due to parallel paths, and in some cases they will be a lot lower.

Tell him to leave it to someone who knows what they are doing.....YOU, and advise him that he needs to do the Insp and test courses.

Cheers..............Howard

I thought you had to have your 2391 or 2394/95 to be able to be a QS? I had to provide proof of them in order to become QS at my current company


fair to say Chris your QS is a total bellend and he's done you a favour, I've never had the NIC bloke come and demand that all the results must be bang on calculated values, so ontop of the bellend QS there's a bellend NIC bloke (surprise surprise) I'd crack on with the install work n leave him to it cause sooner or later he'll fudge some results that'll land him and the muppet that's happy to test for him up in court

 

[chrish_1977]

Thanks for all the replies, feel better that I had what I have been doing questioned for no other reason

 

[Brightspark2]

Has no one thought that the QS is just making the NIC bit up to back his argument. I have never been told that results must match calculated from the NIC and it seems other people above haven't either.

Might just be what the QS wants but mentions the NIC just to give him a bit more weight.

 

[SirKit Breaker]

I thought you had to have your 2391 or 2394/95 to be able to be a QS? I had to provide proof of them in order to become QS at my current company


fair to say Chris your QS is a total bellend and he's done you a favour, I've never had the NIC bloke come and demand that all the results must be bang on calculated values, so ontop of the bellend QS there's a bellend NIC bloke (surprise surprise) I'd crack on with the install work n leave him to it cause sooner or later he'll fudge some results that'll land him and the muppet that's happy to test for him up in court

Depending on how long he's been in the job, he may not have needed anything, although 2391 would have been a good start.

There is now a NVQ3 for the job, called Qualified Supervisor.

Cheers.............Howard

 

[chrish_1977]

It was more I wanted a bit of clarification before I call his bluff and be a true thorn in his side