When to provide a certificate

[Mac65]

I'd like some advice please on when it is necessary to provide a certificate.

We have recently done some work for a property maintenance company, replacing faulty light fittings in several retail premises.

Part 6 of the regs says a certificate is necessary if a circuit has been installed, added to or altered.

Does replacing a faulty fitting one-for-one constitute an addition or an alteration? The number of fittings in the circuit is the same pre and post the work and a diagram of the circuit would be identical too.

It seems the regs are slightly vague in defining when a cert is required.

Rather than argue about the wording of the regs, I'd like to gauge opinion on what other people do, and establish what is general practice in this situation.

Any advice would be much appreciated.

 

[Farmelectrics]

minor works cert

 

[Joe_b87]

Minor works is the way to go, cover your a**e, if you were the last one to touch it, the fingers pointing at you if anything goes bang!

 

[Guitarist]

As you are working in the commercial sector I'm just wondering what you have done up until this point, or is this the first time you've replaced light fittings?
No certification necessary with like-for-like, but guidance is to complete an MWC if you feel that recording Zs/IR would cover your back to prove that testing was carried out.
Personally, I don't always issue an MWC for very small domestic jobs, but I do test for my own peace of mind even when changing a ceiling rose.

 

[Octopus]

As you are working in the commercial sector I'm just wondering what you have done up until this point, or is this the first time you've replaced light fittings?
No certification necessary with like-for-like, but guidance is to complete an MWC if you feel that recording Zs/IR would cover your back to prove that testing was carried out.
Personally, I don't always issue an MWC for very small domestic jobs, but I do test for my own peace of mind even when changing a ceiling rose.

I tend to check the Zs when changing fittings and note the reading on the invoice. T

here's too much paperwork as it is let alone an invoice AND a MWC for every job.

 

[Mac65]

Many thanks for all the advice above.
Most of our work is installations and periodic testing, where certification is always required.
Maintenance work is quite new to us, so feeling our way in terms of certification in this area. I agree that covering your back is probably the way to go, but the project described above involved changing up to 15-20 fittings per day. The amount of paperwork generated would have been considerable.

 

[Guitarist]

I tend to check the Zs when changing fittings and note the reading on the invoice. T

here's too much paperwork as it is let alone an invoice AND a MWC for every job.

Good idea just to pop the Zs reading on the invoice.

 

[Guitarist]

Many thanks for all the advice above.
Most of our work is installations and periodic testing, where certification is always required.
Maintenance work is quite new to us, so feeling our way in terms of certification in this area. I agree that covering your back is probably the way to go, but the project described above involved changing up to 15-20 fittings per day. The amount of paperwork generated would have been considerable.

As I'm sure you did take a Zs reading at each unit, maybe a good idea to write each one down as you changed it, then on the invoice have a line which reads something like "All fittings tested and maximum Zs recorded was x ohms"

Funny story from about 15 years ago when I worked in industry...
The Company paid for an outside contract firm to change out about 100 of our Thorn fluorescent units for a price. As you would expect, the guys worked really fast to get them done, finishing at lunchtime on a Friday.
The following morning 2 of us were in to carry out some maintenance on loadcells, and as we walked across the factory floor we could smell burning.... Being very concerned, we searched all over for the source, when suddenly one of the new units started billowing smoke. When we opened the unit up, the contractors had left the bag of fixings inside sitting on the ballast, which had subsequently burst into flames. Of course, we had to check all the 100 units after that and found another 3 bags inside.... Ended up being a long day.

 

[Mac65]

Interesting story, especially as testing wouldn't have picked up the problem!

 

[Guitarist]

Interesting story, especially as testing wouldn't have picked up the problem!

No, but good workmanship would have. Just made me remember it when you were saying how many you had to do each day.
Apologies for writing it, as it has nothing to do with your situation

 

[Mac65]

No need to apologise, point well taken. Price work like that always leads to the quality v profit conundrum.
In our situation, we did indeed test all the fittings and record the results. Thanks for your input, much appreciated.