Live Working

[brookster]

Quick fire question.

I was always told that you cannot do live working unless the customer cannot shut X appliance down for what ever reason, a risk assessment is in place with a proper live working procedure/LOA.
Granted you cannot do live work in a hazardous area, but AP on site claims you will never do live work under X name.

Testing is live work right................. putting your fluke on live terminals is live work so I was always led to believe, you cannot always guarantee that you have isolated correctly.

Anything where you may come into contact with live exposed conductive parts is live working or is testing not part of this - I was always led to believe it was, as it meets the above.

 

[44ALLAN]

What was the question?

 

[Geordie Spark]

Was that a question or a statement?

I'm confused.com

 

[brookster]

does testing fall under live work? putting your fluke on live terminals is live work? i would say it was.

 

[telectrix]

wel, i'm live when i'm working irrespective of whether or not the installation is live. is that also classed as live working. personally, the term live working is a term conjured up by wusses for wusses. sometimes you need to work live. no big deal as long as you know what you're doi.........arrggggh. live pc.

 

[brookster]

The AP claims his company never work live and I got the question wrong because I wrote the above.

Clearly myself and the AP have different opinions of what live working actually is.

I would deem it as any where that you may come into contact with live exposed conductive parts - it happens all the time.

Not grabbing a bus bar but even proving a 240V is still live working right.......

 

[telectrix]

i consider putting test probes onto live terminals to be testing. using a tool on those terminals as live working. it's more a matter of personal preference what you call it. even pulling a fuse to isolate a circuit/installation is technically live working.

 

[brookster]

i consider putting test probes onto live terminals to be testing. using a tool on those terminals as live working. it's more a matter of personal preference what you call it. even pulling a fuse to isolate a circuit/installation is technically live working.

This is my point for him to say that nobody under this rather large company does live work is a totally absurd comment.
I'm going to have to tow the line to get my CP card, ok for HV but for LV that comment is a grey area nonsense.

in bold - exactly you expose live conductive parts.

 

[brookster]

Are people in agreement with me or the AP on this one..
Even extending to HV there is still one instance live working will be carried out and that is Live Phasing.

 

[Engineer54]

As an apprentice we were trained for live working. I wonder how many here, have drilled live LV bus bars on a 800A sub switchboard, to accommodate wiring to a new externally mounted Breaker?? How times change!!! ....lol!!

 

[telectrix]

if we're not supposed to work live, then why pay the extra for insulated tools?

 

[MDJ]

sometimes you need to work live. no big deal as long as you know what you're doi....

Haha, I was thinking of saying that but thought I would be run off the site

 

[brookster]

It's more the fact that you will always be near or around live exposed conductive parts for - testing and maintenance.

I know the answer I gave was 100% solid, I feel like making a --- out of the guy but will refrain. (i probably will not be able to refrain when I meet him)

There are exceptions to every rule - I also gave the guy the lowdown on how to handle such situations...........

 

[Engineer54]

Are people in agreement with me or the AP on this one..
Even extending to HV there is still one instance live working will be carried out and that is Live Phasing.

That's what MV/HV phasing/voltage sticks are made for!!
And this is what they look like...

HV detectors & Potential Indicators for 3kV - 400kV electrical systems

 

[Geordie Spark]

Haha, I was thinking of saying that but thought I would be run off the site

There's no chance of Tel being run off the site - or running anywhere with that Zimmerframe.

 

[telectrix]

hahaha, ****

 

[Geordie Spark]

hahaha, ****

:love:

 

[Adam W]

unless the customer cannot shut X appliance down for what ever reason

If a customer can't/won't shut down an appliance because it's inconvenient to lose power to it as a planned outage, can they afford to lose power to it as an unplanned outage as a result of you working live? By 'working live' I mean relying on your basic 1000v insulated tools to undo a terminal, pull a live wire out and screw it in somewhere else (still live), and not live testing (eg putting GS38 probes on a live terminal).

Saying that I seem to remember a thread a while ago where some H&S jobsworth had got wind of this idea of 'not working live' and forbidden any live testing, which I think would make the installation less safe.

 

[Adam W]

if we're not supposed to work live, then why pay the extra for insulated tools?

There was some old spark I worked with who used to say standard insulated tools should all be banned and we should use the kind of screwdrivers chippies use, to encourage you to pay more attention to what you're doing.
Uninsulated snips as well...

 

[telectrix]

There was some old spark I worked with who used to say standard insulated tools should all be banned and we should use the kind of screwdrivers chippies use, to encourage you to pay more attention to what you're doing.
Uninsulated snips as well...

these should be used only by plumbers as a means of testing for live.