Problems with a new solar install

[heliosfa]

Hi All,

I have just had a PV install done on my property this week and reading some of the posts here and the MCS guidlines, etc. I am now a little concerned that it hasn't been done properly so I was hoping I could get some opinions from the professionals who frequent these boards

The install was a 3.27KW array and consisted of 10x Sunpower 327W panels and a Samil(?) inverter. This was installed by two blokes (one roofer and one sparky) who turned up in a van with ladders (no scaffold). The sparky got on with the AC wiring/export meter install/inverter install while the roofer was up on the roof installing the brackets/panels. They arrived at about 10:30 and were done by 15:00.

I have already had them back once as they REALLY messed up the AC electrical work by sticking a Henley block in upside down, using 16mm^2 cable from the normal meter to the Henley block when the original cabling from meter to CU was 25mm^2 (100A CU and 100A service fuse) and by leaving ~5mm of exposed LIVE meter tail in the CU where it goes into the main breaker. When I called the companies technical line, their "projects manager" was very concerned and did get another electrician out to sort it this morning.


My current concerns are that:

• The DC cables under the panels seem to be dangling and sat on the roof. I have read in another thread that this does not meet the building regs/17th Edition - can anyone tell me exactly where this is specified in the 17th please?
• The DC cables were brought into the property by the roofer hitting the "felt" with what looked, from the inside, like a hammer and making a rather ragged hole in it (the electrician did seem to be trying to guide him to put them through the seam that was under a foot above). You can now see roof times through this hole which is about 2" in diameter for 4x DC cables.
• The DC cables appear to go under a normal tile.
• The panels don't all look level, some seem to be raised at their edges above the others
• No documentation/certification/handover pack has been left - the only thing that has been left says that I will get the MCS and proof of ownership when I pay the outstanding balance. What should have been left and what tests should have been done & documented?

I haven't checked DC cable size or bracket spacing yet, but I am sure I can do this if it is useful.

The brackets were installed by the roofer lifting some tiles and drilling/screwing into the rafters. I didn't see if he was doing any sort of weather proofing or sealing once the brackets were back on.


Just a bit of background on the company - I went with them as they seemed to get good reviews online and all of their registrations checked out. The person who came to do the initial quotation and "survey" (consisted of photos of roof, loft and meter area and guestimated measurements of roof space) was very knowledgeable and said that they had their own scafold, used their own installers, etc. THe people who turned up to do the install were wearing sweaters with a different company name on and came from about two to three hours away from me. Apparently they also had another install in the area booked for the same/next day.


Obviously there is something wrong with this install and I am unlikely to pick up on it all, as I am merely an Electronic Engineer and not an electrician/solar installer, so is it worth getting some one else in to have a look? how much is this likely to cost me?

Thanks in advance from a very concerned home-owner

 

[Earthstore]

I would suggest you post some pics if you can, you may have to get admin on here to approve them though as you are new here..

Hope this helps a little?

 

[Gavin A]

re the DC cables, it's not specific, but if I remember right, there are statements about ensuring cables are adequately fixed / protected from external influences / environmental factors.

Tiles... cables between tiles can be ok if they're protected - we usually run them clipped next to a bracket having ground out a slot for the bracket and cable, then protect them above and below with sections of ali flashing to stop them rubbing on the tiles. If they're not protected in any way, then I'd view this as a problem, especially if they're not cable tied to stop them from moving around and rubbing.

Check if the tiles are sticking up enough for rain to get driven in under them, if the bracket is 5mm or so off the tile below it to stop of banging on the tile, and potentially breaking it, and if there are any broken tiles.

When you say this was done off ladders, what height is the roof? I drove past an install today half way through on a 2 storey roof with no sign of scaffolding. It's really not worth the risk at that height, though I know a lot of roofers are used to just working off ladders and roof ladders for days on end, so some will think nothing of it. Others though know it's wrong, but just need the work I guess so won't complain about it. Companies who do it though are risking an HSE prosecution (as well as their staff's lives).

 

[heliosfa]

Thanks for the input guys - I will post some photos a little later, I won't be able to get photos of the DC cabling until Saturday morning though.

 

[SpitfireW'sale]

Interesting that the install was for the most expensive modules on the market with one of the cheapest recognised brand of inverter. Not that there is anything wrong with this as such, it is just unusual to combine premium products with budget ones! If your scaffold is still up any issues with cable / panel alignment are a pretty easy fix, but it will cost the install company in labour so they will likely be reluctant to do it.

 

[MCS Renewables]

There are two appalling companies from the North currently targeting Southampton, hopefully you did not choose one of those!

One is from Stoke and the other from Ormskirk near Preston, and the standard of their sub contractors work has to be seen to be believed.

They may be cheap but you get what you pay for in the end.

This is one of the reasons you should buy local and from a trades person. There are plenty of decent installers in and around Southampton.

Your best bet is to contact REAL / RECC and start the complaints procedure. How To Complain - Consumers - Renewable Energy Consumer Code (RECC)

Some of the installs we have seen are so bad, we started this last year Renewable Rescue - Repairing Solar PV & Thermal Installations . We get at least three enquiries a week .

 

[heliosfa]

Interesting that the install was for the most expensive modules on the market with one of the cheapest recognised brand of inverter.

i'll have to take a look at the initial paperwork again as I won't think it said they were putting in a samil inverter. I am only going from the box that i saw them bring it in and I don't know the exact model as I haven't had a proper look at the inverter and I have been left with no paperwork...

re. The scaffold, they didn't use any - the roofer used a single ladder.

There are two appalling companies from the North currently targeting Southampton, hopefully you did not choose one of those!

One is from Stoke and the other from Ormskirk near Preston, and the standard of their sub contractors work has to be seen to be believed.

these were from Burton-on-Trent

This is one of the reasons you should buy local and from a trades person. There are plenty of decent installers in and around Southampton.

When I was looking, these guys came up and I got the (obviously wrong) impression that they used local agents. I will admit that I probably didnt look hard enough for local installers when I was looking.

The problem in my experience with small and local is they do go out of business - my parents had a panel install done a few years ago by a local installer but his company went bust. Luckily the guy was brilliant and did an absolutely proper job on it and we have had no problems. We would have used him again for this job if he was still working

 

[heliosfa]

Some photos of the exterior install






And of what they did to the AC install, followed by after a "maintenance engineer" came back to fix it:



And how they originally left the live tail into the CU:


Photos of the DC entry, DC cabling and inverter to follow tomorrow when I go back down to Southampton.

 

[MCS Renewables]

The ones from "Burton on Trent" are the ones I miss-labelled "Stoke" .....sorry

Appalling "Project" !

They have a young lady sales rep called Sam , the company has had loads of name changes since MCS registration obviously dumping its liabilities every time.

I agree small and local tradesmen do go out of business, however generally they need to maintain their good name to ensure they get repeat business and they are also close by for any issues that arise.

You have to wonder what happens with these bad "Projects" once the subbies have legged it with the payment.
I expect after sales customer care is zero they just move onto the next victim.

 

[heliosfa]

The ones from "Burton on Trent" are the ones I miss-labelled "Stoke" .....sorry

Appalling "Project" !

They have a young lady sales rep called Sam , the company has had loads of name changes since MCS registration obviously dumping its liabilities every time.

oh dear... And a cursory Google came up with mostly-decent reviews...

so far, their after-sales have been ok and they came out quickly to sort the AC side.