Sockets on a lighting circuit - C3 or C2?

[7029 dave]

Yes we do, we commonly have smoke alarms on lighting circuits.

I dont call that a 13A socket which a 2/3KW appliance can be plugged in potentially. lol
Come on Daz

 

[DPG]

I dont call that a 13A socket which a 2/3KW appliance can be plugged in potentially. lol
Come on Daz

True, but I was replying to your comment about how we shouldn't mix power and lighting on one circuit.

 

[westward10]

My in-laws have a fan heater in their bathroom running off a 3036 5A lighting circuit turned down internally for 1kw instead of 2kw.

 

[7029 dave]

My in-laws have a fan heater in their bathroom running off a 3036 5A lighting circuit turned down internally for 1kw instead of 2kw.

We did think is was 1kw or 500W

 

[littlespark]

looking at the pic in the OP, the socket in question is in the back of a kitchen wall unit.
Not very handy to plug in a heater, iron or kettle..

“Generally” we wouldn’t put a 13A socket on a lighting circuit, but if needed… for examples already given on the thread… I don’t see the problem when there can’t be a possibility of something too high a load being plugged in.

 

[UNG]

TUT TUT , well its not just about BS7671 is it, come on people remember your days at the local tech college, its about adhering to the electrical craft principles we were all taught.
My tutors would be have a fit if they heard some of the comments going on here.
Practically IMO its not good for a circuit to be running over its CCC even if it only for a few seconds with big loads being plugged in untill its goes pop.
Then you could argue that being plunged in total darkness could warrant a C2 for safety reasons in some certain circumstances.
It would be a C3 for me all day long. We dont mix power with lighting circuits.

Power and lighting has been mixed for many years as far back as the 2A, 5A and 15A round pin sockets

A lot of the problem as previously mentioned lies with the lighting manufacturers who insist on supplying lighting kits for under cupboard or plinth lighting with 13A plug in adaptors, personally I would rather they supplied their kits with boxed transformers or drivers with a short flylead that could be terminated into a flex outlet plate or FCU but until that happens I feel we are stuck with what we have

 

[westward10]

I think the main reason for keeping them separate in the past was mixed disconnection times, 5 sec for the lighting and 0.4 sec for the socket outlets.

 

[littlespark]

Makes it easy to do ELI and RCD testing on a lighting circuit if there’s a handy socket

 

[UNG]

Makes it easy to do ELI and RCD testing on a lighting circuit if there’s a handy socket

Maybe that will be in the next amendment that a socket outlet must be fitted next to the last fitting on the circuit

 

[7029 dave]

Makes it easy to do ELI and RCD testing on a lighting circuit if there’s a handy socket

It would with my old Robin KMP 5404 tester

 

[littlespark]

I know, you can get adaptors for various light sockets... ES, BC, GU10 etc.... but my old Ethos test kit came with either a 13A lead, or 3 separate prongs (although got an official 16A lead when i was on the caravan park for testing the hook ups..)

 

[nicebutdim]

My in-laws have a fan heater in their bathroom running off a 3036 5A lighting circuit turned down internally for 1kw instead of 2kw.

It's not that many decades back that bathrooms were commonly fitted with combined light/heater contraptions.

 

[7029 dave]

Power and lighting has been mixed for many years as far back as the 2A, 5A and 15A round pin sockets

A lot of the problem as previously mentioned lies with the lighting manufacturers who insist on supplying lighting kits for under cupboard or plinth lighting with 13A plug in adaptors, personally I would rather they supplied their kits with boxed transformers or drivers with a short flylead that could be terminated into a flex outlet plate or FCU but until that happens I feel we are stuck with what we have

I consider these lighting, have wired many these switched at the door entrance for table lamps on lighting circuits or spured down with a FCU.

 

[timhoward]

I know, you can get adaptors for various light sockets... ES, BC, GU10 etc....

I always carry those. Misusing one once got me out of a very difficult situation!

 

[westward10]

It's not that many decades back that bathrooms were commonly fitted with combined light/heater contraptions.

My mother still has one although the heater is duff. My father linked out the general pull switch and you controlled it from the pull cord at the light. Can't remember the pull sequence but maybe one pull heater, two pulls heater and light and three pulls just the light.

 

[mainline]

Yes we do, we commonly have smoke alarms on lighting circuits.

We also see cooker hoods with moulded plugs into single sockets fed off the lighting circuit

I see a C3 much like advisories on vehicle MOTs nobody wants them, especially unwarranted ones.

 

[nicebutdim]

My mother still has one although the heater is duff. My father linked out the general pull switch and you controlled it from the pull cord at the light. Can't remember the pull sequence but maybe one pull heater, two pulls heater and light and three pulls just the light.

My parents had one until my father was tasked with redecorating the bathroom, a number of years back, and he 'upgraded' to a batten fitting. Never realised it was gone until I rewired the place and was sad it wasn't there to salvage, although don't remember the heater working after I was about 5 or 6 years old.

 

[Taylortwocities]

Only a few years ago this was the way we did things.
Surely a properly fused plug and socket isn’t a life-threatening device?!

 

[mainline]

Only a few years ago this was the way we did things.
Surely a properly fused plug and socket isn’t a life-threatening device?!
View attachment 100939View attachment 100939
View attachment 100940

What I want to know is where did you get that picture of my wife.
That's the first time I've ever seen her with an iron in her hand.

 

[Pretty Mouth]

My mother still has one although the heater is duff. My father linked out the general pull switch and you controlled it from the pull cord at the light. Can't remember the pull sequence but maybe one pull heater, two pulls heater and light and three pulls just the light.

Ah, I found one of these in the bathroom of an elderly lady a couple of months back, when T'ing and I'ing for a board change. BC lampholder in the middle, and a circular element around it.

I didn't realise what it was initially, so gave the pull cord a few yanks and the light went off and on. Then after a while a strong smell of burning. The heater hadn't been used for yonks but still worked, and had collected a thick layer of dust on top of the reflector.

 

[UNG]

I consider these lighting, have wired many these switched at the door entrance for table lamps on lighting circuits or spured down with a FCU.

I've wired them in some places and taken them out in others the 2A was mainly lighting the 5A and 15A I have seen on power and lighting circuits so I don't believe there has ever been a hard line between using sockets on lighting and power circuits

 

[westward10]

At some point, I am leaning toward the 16th Ed but could be the 17th BS1363 socket outlets were removed as a means of a suitable luminaire coupler but it was quickly reinstated.