3rd party testing + New scheme registration

[Des 56]

Here is an e mail off the ESC

Part P - third party certification schemes

The analysis of responses to the Part P consultation is now complete and the revised Part P Regulations will be laid before Parliament on 10th December, coming into force on 6th April 2013. Our understanding of the situation is that the changes to Part P will be similar to those proposed in the consultation document, including a reduction in the scope of notifiable work and the introduction of third party inspection and testing. There may be a list of work that is notifiable, rather than non-notifiable (as at present). The phrasing of the legislation has yet to be decided with details still to be worked out. For legal reasons, the government needs to set up new third party certification schemes, under which inspectors will need to be registered. Those wishing to operate inspection schemes will need to apply to DCLG for authorisation once a framework is in place early next year, with the schemes expected to come into effect in the autumn. Members of third party inspection schemes will need to demonstrate competence in inspection and testing, and membership will not just be open to Part P scheme registrants. DCLG will be looking to industry to help develop competence requirements for assessment purposes. The ESC is likely to be invited to join a working party, along with some of the Part P scheme operators. Electrical installers (DIY or trade) using a third party inspector will not need to notify a building control body before carrying out work or pay building control body fees. The third party inspector will, if satisfied with the work, notify compliance with Building Regulations. Inspectors will need to ‘take all reasonable steps’ to determine whether or not work complies with the Building Regulations – the same requirement as currently applies to building control bodies. Professional Indemnity insurance will be a requirement. The liability for defective work will lie with the installer, not the inspector (unless negligent). We expect the analysis to be published after the party conferences and will continue to work to raise awareness of the importance of Part P among householders.

 

[ipf]

Sounds like anyone qualified to 17th (no matter how) could be an inspector.

 

[DurhamSparky]

nail, head ..... good night......... legally allowed to change your own B&Q consumer unit if joe down the pub who works for council will now sign it off for a tenna!!

 

[1shortcircuit]

and will continue to work to raise awareness of the importance of Part P among householders.

Bullstick Mr Hangman!!!

I suggest a start would be appropriate!

 

[Octopus]

The devill will be in the detail...

Having said that Part P isn't policed in anyway, the scams don't take anything seriously except misuse of their logo's

Joe Public will carry on doing DIY, Joe Builder will still cut corners, Joe man down the Pub will still do cash jobs without LABC etc, sparkies with employment will still do private jobs ignoring the rules.

Can't see much changing myself!

 

[malcolmsanford]

ohhhhhhhhhhh ...........................could mean I can come home soon and start up as an inspector ...........

 

[oldtimer]

ohhhhhhhhhhh ...........................could mean I can come home soon and start up as an inspector ...........

Yep but here is the catch the government want to encourage building works reference the planning laws that are being scrapped now I could be wrong here but I read this as Joe Public or DIY Johnie as we call him or builder Sam ,Kitchen Joiner Jack,or plumber Pete will do the install and want you as the inspector to sign it off and theres the catch you get to put your name to the job by signing it off but dont get to do the actual job.

And as they would say in the old western series Smith & Jones "And thats a good deal !!!! " more like a cop out like the HSE PAT testing review.

 

[i=p/u]

hse pat review???

il sign anything for cash too.. cause no1 cares as long as it works. and people who know electricians , will use them... its just you wont get as many phonecalls from marketing, as everyone knows a spark

 

[i=p/u]

contacts is the word here, dont expect the phone call

 

[oldtimer]

hse pat review???

il sign anything for cash too.. cause no1 cares as long as it works. and people who know electricians , will use them... its just you wont get as many phonecalls from marketing, as everyone knows a spark

Your beginning to worry me I thought you were NIs top PAT guy but anyway let me explain a government minister said that there is too much of H&S that is holding business back and that some things needed relaxed he was referring to PAT testing so HSE announced that they would do an enquiry as they felt they did not need PAT on certain items of equipment so they did their study and people thought well we will get a definitive instruction to say for example test HMOs every 18 months instead of 12 months but no they just said it was up to the inspector to use their judgment so thats as clear as mud to me.

Remember in this current environment we are not going to get more regulation we are going to get more FUDGE in a word because can you imagine the government banning the sale of electrical equipment to Joe Public or come to think of it anybody with the cash in their hand me thinks the big sheds would have a say.

Now saying that you now know who runs this country and it aint Democracy

 

[Mark_Burgess]

So, £450 to join a scam, another big hit to be third party inspector and compulsory PI insurance to be an inspector.

I will pass thanks and carry on as I am.
The ESC and local authority can get screwed if they think they can take me hard earned off me.

Who was it that thought of starting up an Elec Forms Comp Persons scheme, how can we get the ball rolling on it?

 

[Octopus]

As a competent sparky the last thing I want to be doing is inspecting the work of bodgers and builders alike - especially then having to tell them that its not good enough and failing the install.

No thanks.

 

[oldtimer]

Common sense would have said lets sort this out but reality is we have hit hard times and the people who run this ie the Schemies will not let go of the power they wield so when the government says things need to change they fudge it only problem is that they end up screwing the very people they are meant to protect ie us the electrician although I think it undermines their own case that they are the guardians of the electrical industry so if they will not respond to people complaining about their members they will not police the system but they will try and sell you courses or take you to court if you use their logo so to sum it up you are paying them to screw you and then add insult to injury giving any Tom Dick or Harry the green light to do electrics because of the ultimate RCD protection. Then they will leave it for 10 years until we get out of this economical hole and the try to start their nonsense all over again

 

[thekingiam]

it looks like they want all domestics done by big national companies who can write off these expenses easily,end of the road for sole traders. with every tom dick and harry doing there own electrics then signed off by a guy that signs off as many as he can a day for just above minimum wage.once again they haven't listened to all the electricians asking for more policing of part p and instead have conspired to try and get more monney from the strugling domestic installer.
as i have just payed elecsa for registration then will continue until next year but if they want more monney they can rewire the house wile they inspect my work.i can see me getting my cowboy boots out of the cupboard.anyone got the address for becoming a part p body, just for a laugh i want to apply and see what they say,if you can't beat them join them.if they let me in who checks my work then?if everyone on this forum applies i wonder what they would think?
if they let me in i will post on ebay certification for all for a tenner no need to look at your work.

 

[oldtimer]

Just to add your right this will wipe out the sole trader because he has to sign it so it will go the same way as PAT testing where a Ltd company will do drive by certificates and when things go wrong they will fold and start up again because the company gets the blame not the individual the funny thing is these companies will cut prices and hire Electrical Trainee on basic wages so the worse thing that could happen is that they go bust and the individual will get his card (if he has one taken off him) and the Schemie who registered them will crawl back into their hole until it all clears up

 

[ipf]

New thread. Who can fail most jobs in a week.

Can see contractors jumping ship, just like the lecturers with the Electrical Trainee's.

 

[oldtimer]

New thread. Who can fail most jobs in a week.

Can see contractors jumping ship, just like the lecturers with the Electrical Trainee's.

Yea but heres the catch the more you fail the more you get a name for it remember Bodget Joe wants it signed off and he dont care then the council does not either so these drive by,s will flourish

 

[amo]

Makes part p even more useless, people with hardly any knowledge can sign off work that they themselves are not 100% and still signing it off. It will just increase the number of unsatisfactory/ poor workmanship jobs that are just signed off and may not be safe. Also the competent schemes will make even more ££££

 

[Octopus]

A reality check here. Those breaking the "rules" are doing so already. I've seen more than my fair share of certificates that are for work that have clearly not been tested.

I reackon I get about 1 call every other month asking me to sign off others work and I always decline it.

 

[oldtimer]

Yes me too and for a time it was our Eastern European cousins who were wanting their worked signed off.

Also had a customer who was going with a letting agent but got me to do some work because I was cheaper so she asked for a EICR but I said forget it get the LAs company who did it before because they will be cheaper she asked how can that be and I said if I did it then they would slag me off on cost . So later she asked how can they do it and I asked were you there when they did it she said no but did not think they stayed long well no I said because they copied and pasted the last one they did