fuseboard change

[Des 56]

Perhaps we should give the man a bit of lee-way fellas

I know of many installers who wouldn't know the difference between a test instrument and a Gameboy

There are countless (mainly Niceic) firms who do rewires, where the job is done practically with the installers,who have no function other than a bang test at the end of the day

They may or may not know how to test,its not required of them
Someone comes along at a later date and tests the installations of many gangs of installers
This is not untrue,I have done so many hundreds of times personally, on a sub contract basis

The post may have many years experience and does a fine installation
He is unfamiliar with testing and certification perhaps,but, he is one of countless numbers doing domestic installation who never get an opportunity to do so, even if they wanted

We know its wrong,but it goes on at the majority of large contracted council type jobs

Where he seems to have attracted the wrath of the forum.is by being truthfull and looking to find out procedures on a non contracted job
There is advise available for Diyers on suspect forums,but the guy is working in the industry and seeking advise on an electricians forum

 

[Sintra]

I bet these installations are energised long before the tester comes on the scene. Not the fault of the guys doing the install but their employers for not having the testing done at the correct stages of the installation.

 

[telectrix]

Some very good points there, Des. original post should have said he was experienced in installing, but not testing.still,don't think he had too rough a ride.

 

[WayneL]

I bet these installations are energised long before the tester comes on the scene. Not the fault of the guys doing the install but their employers for not having the testing done at the correct stages of the installation.

I agree.
This is in line with the point I was making.

I wasn't disrespecting gregorabbott, he's doing a job, it's the firms that operate in this fashion that I was having a go at., and the 'scheme' loopholes that allow this to happen.

 

[gregorabbott]

thank you des 56! just to let everyone know the testers do actually perform a proper test. they do disconnect the ring main to perform continuity tests and so on! if there are any faults the testers identify what/where the fault is and we go back and fix those faults otherwise the test sheets dont get complete and the houses arent passed then the job would get stopped! p.s. i dont think it would be in the best interest of the testers to make the results up and facing losing there jobs!!

 

[dynamite2000]

hi david any chance of telling me how i post message on this site am not that pc literate

 

[Des 56]

I also agree with the attitude of the forum members and was not critisising those posts
No incompetent should be doing the sort of work outlined

We sometimes though, get ingrained into expecting correct procedures, that we hopefully abide by, and sometimes forget that the Niceic sytem is out there operating in its full criminal glory

It is not permitted,but it goes on to an enourmous scale and the Niceic will do nothing to rectify it
They would have to admit they have a less than satisfactory system and they would never do that

 

[WayneL]

hi david any chance of telling me how i post message on this site am not that pc literate

Is this a trick question?? - as you've just posted this message

 

[Spudnik]

hi david any chance of telling me how i post message on this site am not that pc literate

Pick a forum from the home page relevant to your question.

Once in the forum click on "New Thread' top left and fire away.

 

[Amp David]

hi david any chance of telling me how i post message on this site am not that pc literate

MMM let me think.Maybe you already have another user name on the forum and feel i've given you a little stick for showing a little incompetance? I don't know, just guessing.

As for your question, no I don't know how to post, sorry I can't help you

 

[Sintra]

I work for a NICEIC firm and am a QS although i do disagree with the whole QS thing. We also have install guys who 1st and 2nd fix and then the job gets tested. We work on a system were the tester will visit site at different stages of the installation and do the appropriate tests at the correct time. Another measure that we have enforced is that the install guys do not get supplied with any main switches for the DB's so in theory these installations can not be energised. The guy testing the installation brings and fits the main switch, connects tails and energises once all the dead testing is completed. This seems to work ok for us but probably costs a few quid to enforce. Just another point we only permit a person with QS status to carry out the testing no matter how small a job it is even minor works.

 

[Amp David]

Fair enough

 

[m25maintenance]

mate never quote over the phone. always insist on doing a quick survey b4 cu change, the reason is to find hidden faults that will show up after u done the job, ex borrowed neutrals, rcd will trip. can be a long process finding. so step 1 go to the property, 2 do a bit of investigation. step 3 quote. if ur new go on a few jobs with another spark for free and learn hands on. it will pay in the long term. rome wasn't built in a day

 

[electricAl]

just to clarify on here that i am an electrician. i change fuseboards almost every day at work. i work in rewire squads. the way we work is that the rewire squads go in and rewire/upgrade the house then the testers come in and do the required testing. the reason i posted this question is that i am not 100 percent certain on the certification side of things as i do not have my inspection and testing certificate. surely its better to ask this question on a forum rather than just go do a job if i am not 100 percent certain? after all it is a forum......

So to summarise your previous posts...

a) You fit `fuseboards` on a daily basis, but others do the testing
b) You`ve no Inspection & Testing qualifications, & not familiar with certification
c) You`ve passed a 17th Edition exam, which would have included the requirement to I & T all installation work
d) You`re wanting to install Consumer Units for Joe Public (as foreigners?)
e) You want to be more competitive by ommitting testing & certificates if the customer doesn`t request them

That a fair summary?

 

[Amp David]

If you give advice on the forum, I think you get a cut of the cost for doing the swap

 

[dynamite2000]

sound thanx for tht pal i didn,t no if you had to join a group or not . while i,m here have you done 2391 yet are or you upto testing standards yet cheers mate..if yes or no , my question is can you do a R1 + R2 test while the board is live at the board itself. ??

 

[malcolmsanford]

Your R1 + R2 is a dead test. If your installing a new circuit to an existing board I would do the test before I connected up.

If you doing a R1+R2 on a PIR then you need to disconnect the LINE from the protection device and croc clip that and the earh bar. Then do your test at each point.

Bottom line is that doing a dead test on a live CU is not allowed in the EAWR or the ESQCR and is advised against in most Electrical safety literature. Of course all us experienced sparks never work live!!

 

[dynamite2000]

i agree totally its just the firm i am working for the QS said i can do mr R1 + R2 at the board i didnt question him as i had only just started nd i didnt no if he didn,t no his job or he was just trying to catch me out. ?????, cheers all the same pal. one last question.in the niceic test sheets its says in column circuit impedences. at least one of these must be completed. well how can that be possible if the circuits can,t be isolted when i am in a shopping outlet.

 

[IQ Electrical]

I think you mean the R1+R2 column and the R2 column, really, if you're actually testing now, and competent to do so, you should know the answer to your question.

You can agree limitations with your client on circuits that cannot be isolated etc.
The more limitations, the less value the report has.

You need to obtain Guidance Note 3 and have a good read, this is basic testing theory.

 

[gregorabbott]

didnt want to ommit anything. thats why i came on here first. to seek advice. personally i wouldnt take the chance of cutting corners to be more competative. you are correct on a, b, c and d. but i wont be carrying out d until i have my inspection and testing so i know how to fill out test sheets correctly.