Hi Guys. Just wanted to say I have read your replies so far with interest.This morning am a bit tied for time and want to give a reply to
Advantageous in what way?
Is this part of a move to closer alignment with EU wiring practice (similar to your T&E going for equal-size CPCs)?
Or any other specific reason(s) for the preference?
I am not aware of any moves to reduce use of rings in order to more closely harmonise with Europe (the increased size of the CPC in t&e was I understand). I think the appeal of the radial over the ring swung the balance. I personally find them simpler from an installation and testing point of view. The wiring saved in the omitted leg of the ring in many cases pays for the extra mcb. The customer now has 2 circuits of 20 amp rather than 1of 32. Radials not easily overloaded.
What's not to like?
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Ok now you've got my dander up! Ring circuits will probably disappear eventually. But the reason is not some technical reason it is because of the dumbing down of the population in general. As regards the origins of the ring circuit it was maybe ahead of it's time ecologically as it was to save copper, ergo the natural environment. As you know I am an advocate of the ring circuit as per the other thread you referred to. Perhaps you are an agent provocateur insidiously dripping non reasons for getting rid of the ring circuit? It seems you don't like them with a vengeance. Which is a bit strange not to be dispassionate about a bit of wire and solely concentrate on the science and reasoning of each circuit type. Both have their merits and application, you just jolly well leave our ring circuits alone chappy.
Interestingly I was on a forum here locally for Irish sparks (cost me 50 euro) and tried to start a debate on some areas of Irish work practices which I felt (still do) could be upgraded. I pointed to the UK and basically said "they are ahead of the curve here, could we learn from that?" The reactions?? Take a guess. I think it's understandable we all get a little protective about our own regs and work practices.
One post kindly suggested I move to the UK.
I think to move forward its important to stand back and look objectively at the accepted norms whatever in whatever environment we are in and ask "is this still acceptable".
Now the ring circuit is in fact a very innovative wiring system which cleverly made use of limited resources getting the maximum out of the minimum of copper. In my view it still has a role to play but in a limited role. By the way my use of the word" dinosaur " was disrespectful and I did, nt intend that.
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Does EU practice mandate that radial circuits run simply from point to point? If any branches are permitted then surely inspection and fault finding becomes less straightforward.
I ask this because I remember reading about some European countries where it was common to find radial circuits that branched off in many directions - sort of like a tree.
I have worked on radials in several countries and they all followed the same loop in, loop out system. To branch of off like a tree is not a system I have seen, but even if they did remember that a radial is never vulnerable to overloading in the way a ring is
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I support and endorse the ring final circuit.
That's fine Risteard. Do you also still "support and endorse" the installation of a 4ft earth rod (as we are both required to install under Irish regs) but as has been demonstrated here on this forum by multiple sparks in multiple posts is actually less than useless?
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As far as I know Spain is 220/230v @ 50htz.
The cotinent all tends to be somewhere between 220 and 240 at 50htz
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I stayed in a Spanish rental for 2 weeks on holiday.
All the lightning circuits were just a single run of live, looped round all the switches.
The switched lives went off to there respective light pendants and instead of running a neutral to the fittings, they just connected the neutral of the fitting to the nearest bit of structural metalwork
That really surprises me. I also stayed in one last year and like you can't resist having a good look at the electrics. I don't open anything up but it looked top notch. Rcbo, s on every circuit too.
Obviously the light switch and inevitable socket in the bathroom but quite honestly I think we here (British Isles) have a, thing or 2,to learn from them here. Now as Mike said "dive for cover"
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In line with EU practice, Dual pole MCB's and radial circuits will halve the time taken for inspections and fault finding.
Dives for cover.
You are spot on here in my view. Did you mean rcbo, s when you mentioned dual pole mcb, s?
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Does EU practice mandate that radial circuits run simply from point to point? If any branches are permitted then surely inspection and fault finding becomes less straightforward.
I ask this because I remember reading about some European countries where it was common to find radial circuits that branched off in many directions - sort of like a tree.
If this "branches of a tree" system interferes in any way with the standard wiring method for a radial circuit, then yes, that would complicate faultfinding. However, while circumstances, might occasionally require a JB to be I stalled between to sockets to branch off for a third, this would be an exception rather than the rule in my exp.
