Safety! Am I really that old???

[PEG]

definitely but they were idiots for moving it while extended.

i had got a banksman and the path was clear, i also didnt move it while it was extended so perfectly safe.

im about 65kg (10stone) so even fully extended it wont be a problem

Moving whilst extended,is normal practice. Most of the larger self-propelled booms and scissors have this as a function.

Some have limited speed or a cut-out height,but moving at working height,is normal.

What has occurred over the last 30 years,is an increasing reliance,on safety features such as envelope management systems,and fail-safe functions.

In an attempt to make plant "idiot-proof",they have,on occasion,allowed idiots,to be pilots.

The old-school methods,of bringing operators through the ranks,with sound experience,and time in the saddle,has gone.

The modern way,seems to be short intensive courses,followed by short supervised experience,then reliance on equipment safety features and peer involvement.

....But,if a hair-dresser can do a short course,and inject Botox in yer birds' forehead,i don't see why an arsey 22 year old,who can't speak properly,shouldn't pilot a £200,000 30 tonne machine....what can go wrong? :dizzy2:

 

[shanky887614]

When I think back, and remember using a chasing machine, without extraction, and with no mask or glasses, I can't actually believe it. Same as chasing sockets and breathing all of that in, and getting stones fly into your eyes. Madness really. I'm also convinced that fibreglass dust is far from safe, especially the old stuff.

chasing machine? you lucky sod i was cutting meter boxes out with a grinder, same with chasing indoors and was not issued any dustmasks in my first year

 

[shanky887614]

Moving whilst extended,is normal practice. Most of the larger self-propelled booms and scissors have this as a function.

Some have limited speed or a cut-out height,but moving at working height,is normal.

What has occurred over the last 30 years,is an increasing reliance,on safety features such as envelope management systems,and fail-safe functions.

In an attempt to make plant "idiot-proof",they have,on occasion,allowed idiots,to be pilots.

The old-school methods,of bringing operators through the ranks,with sound experience,and time in the saddle,has gone.

The modern way,seems to be short intensive courses,followed by short supervised experience,then reliance on equipment safety features and peer involvement.

....But,if a hair-dresser can do a short course,and inject Botox in yer birds' forehead,i don't see why an arsey 22 year old,who can't speak properly,shouldn't pilot a £200,000 30 tonne machine....what can go wrong? :dizzy2:

yes, the one i was using can move extended at a greatly reduced speed, while there fully extended they rock up and down a lot so i can easy see how people get thrown out if they hit a pothole etc

 

[derek]

chasing machine? you lucky sod i was cutting meter boxes out with a grinder, same with chasing indoors and was not issued any dustmasks in my first year

Got to wear a dust mask when chasing even if you don't have a hard hat or high viz.

 

[davesparks]

I get to see both extremes of the scale. when I venture onto big sites I get the full PPE just to step through the door. But at the other end of the scale you have the fireworks industry.
As most of you will know already I am one of the owners of a fireworks display company and so work in that industry quite a bit. There is absolutely no regulation of the display industry as far as health and safety goes! The storage and manufacturing of fireworks is heavily regulated, but actual setting up and firing is a bit of a free for all!
We, as a company, do our level best to keep everyone safe by operating what is now a very old fashioned system of common sense and constant training and improvement. Generally we pair the new/least experienced people with the most experienced supervisors and try to swap the crews around so that everybody works with everybody else and shares knowledge and ideas.
There is a lot of advise and guidance around which suggests various ideas about safety precautions, but a lot of it is just not practical or even helpful.
One of the classic ones is the recommendation for full fireproof overalls and a hard hat with full face visor if you are lighting fireworks by hand. It sounds like a great idea until you try to look up to see where a firework goes and the hard hat slips or a firework goes off low and you end up with a fast moving burning star or bombette getting behind the visor!
We take a different approach, we do hand firing in our training sessions but all displays are planned and sent out as electrically fired displays, this way the crew can be a safe distance away from everything. This means we have tens of thousands of pounds invested in electric firing systems compared to the few hundred it would cost to get a few years supply of matches and tapers, but for the sake of safeguarding our crew it's a worthy investment.

 

[shanky887614]

I get to see both extremes of the scale. when I venture onto big sites I get the full PPE just to step through the door. But at the other end of the scale you have the fireworks industry.
As most of you will know already I am one of the owners of a fireworks display company and so work in that industry quite a bit. There is absolutely no regulation of the display industry as far as health and safety goes! The storage and manufacturing of fireworks is heavily regulated, but actual setting up and firing is a bit of a free for all!
We, as a company, do our level best to keep everyone safe by operating what is now a very old fashioned system of common sense and constant training and improvement. Generally we pair the new/least experienced people with the most experienced supervisors and try to swap the crews around so that everybody works with everybody else and shares knowledge and ideas.
There is a lot of advise and guidance around which suggests various ideas about safety precautions, but a lot of it is just not practical or even helpful.
One of the classic ones is the recommendation for full fireproof overalls and a hard hat with full face visor if you are lighting fireworks by hand. It sounds like a great idea until you try to look up to see where a firework goes and the hard hat slips or a firework goes off low and you end up with a fast moving burning star or bombette getting behind the visor!
We take a different approach, we do hand firing in our training sessions but all displays are planned and sent out as electrically fired displays, this way the crew can be a safe distance away from everything. This means we have tens of thousands of pounds invested in electric firing systems compared to the few hundred it would cost to get a few years supply of matches and tapers, but for the sake of safeguarding our crew it's a worthy investment.

im disapointed i had an image of you in my head of you lighting it with a match then ducking low to the ground, tongue out with fingers in your ears XD.

 

[davesparks]

im disapointed i had an image of you in my head of you lighting it with a match then ducking low to the ground, tongue out with fingers in your ears XD.

Don't worry, if it's just me and the other owner of the company working, or even one of us taking a show out solo then we do occasionally go for the manual option.

Plus of course the fireworks I had in the garden at home on New Years even were somewhat large for a small garden!

 

[malcolmsanford]

I can remember when working on Spec build (CAVE bashing) we used to make ladders out of 4"x2" saw benches for step ups out of T&G flooring, no hand rails above empty stair wells, burning bits of wood in a oil drum and toasting our sarnies,you youngsters have it easy now, soft that's what you are sof. All mollycoddled up lol, tin hat, steelies, ear defenders on ready for the comments I'm going to get. :wheelchair::hanged::nopity:

Just edited that for you there Pete

 

[Midwest]

I was about 15 when I first learnt to make a 'hop up' from 4x2 and I still make one now whenever doing a new build. Specific to the height of the ceilings there is no better...

Arrghhh, when I was 17 I used one of those p*****g things. Pulled me back 'hopping up' onto the damn thing. All these years later, still suffer, more so now I'm an old git. I'd only use them as firewood.

 

[ruston]

Moving whilst extended,is normal practice. Most of the larger self-propelled booms and scissors have this as a function.

Some have limited speed or a cut-out height,but moving at working height,is normal.

What has occurred over the last 30 years,is an increasing reliance,on safety features such as envelope management systems,and fail-safe functions.

In an attempt to make plant "idiot-proof",they have,on occasion,allowed idiots,to be pilots.

The old-school methods,of bringing operators through the ranks,with sound experience,and time in the saddle,has gone.

The modern way,seems to be short intensive courses,followed by short supervised experience,then reliance on equipment safety features and peer involvement.

....But,if a hair-dresser can do a short course,and inject Botox in yer birds' forehead,i don't see why an arsey 22 year old,who can't speak properly,shouldn't pilot a £200,000 30 tonne machine....what can go wrong? :dizzy2:

The saddle , or seat , is an expression I have not heard for a long time.
The 'banksman' and 'tipman' was another selection process that was used. They would work from , or around the machines and would know the process and operation of the machine before they were allowed anywhere near the 'handles' or 'seat'.
The 'experienced' applicants' would jump on a machine and be scrutinised by the wily old plant foreman, who would know in a crack if his backside had ever been in one before.
Mind you all this was when Adam was a boy.