Timer for outdoor lights not working

[Jackall]

Hello.



[FONT=&amp]Any ideas as to why the following timer doesn't work - the dial doesn't turn at all. There is an electricity supply going into the box because the last switch is for the boiler which works. The first switch is labelled 'General'; the next switch and the timer are labelled 'Outdoor lights'; and the last switch is labelled 'Boiler', which definitely works. All the wiring is attached and not loose at all.

[/FONT]

 

[Plonker 3]

Have checked there is voltage going to the time clock with a approved voltage tester to GS38?

 

[Bobster]

Coils burnt out in the time clock would be my guess.

For anyone to reply, what skill base do you have? DIY, Trainee, Apprentice?

I'm asking as a qualified electrician would have solved this in minuets.

 

[Jackall]

I have a City Guilds Cert in Basic Electrics, as part of a combined skills course which also included Carpentry and Plumbing, but I didn't take the Part P - although I did practice with all the testing, etc.
I don't have any of the testing equipment, which is why I am asking for ideas for solving this. If the coils are burnt out, I could presumably replace the timer? Or does the burning of the coils suggest a more serious problem which would have to be remedied first?

 

[Anthony S]

Handyman

 

[Jackall]

I don't have a voltage tester, so I would have to bring in a fully trained electrician if that is the problem. I am hoping that the problem is a simple one which would simply mean replacing the timer unit.

 

[Plonker 3]

You need test equipment to find the problem not just swap parts until it works again. Call out a electrician who will be able to find the fault and advise on what needs to be done and costs.

 

[ImpededLoop]

I have a City Guilds Cert in Basic Electrics, as part of a combined skills course which also included Carpentry and Plumbing, but I didn't take the Part P - although I did practice with all the testing, etc.
I don't have any of the testing equipment, which is why I am asking for ideas for solving this. If the coils are burnt out, I could presumably replace the timer? Or does the burning of the coils suggest a more serious problem which would have to be remedied first?

If you don't have test equipment, you can't safely diagnose the cause of the fault. You might get lucky by replacing parts until the problem is resolved, or you may be unlucky and the new parts get damaged as well.

If you're unsure its best to get an electrician in.

 

[Jackall]

Handyman

"Please be reminded that if your reply can't help the original poster, it may be seen as pointless and taking the thread off topic. Please make sure what you are about to post is in-keeping with the forum rules, specifically the "be nice" rule. Just be nice and helpful (even to new members) or don't reply at all please."

 

[Anthony S]

"Please be reminded that if your reply can't help the original poster, it may be seen as pointless and taking the thread off topic. Please make sure what you are about to post is in-keeping with the forum rules, specifically the "be nice" rule. Just be nice and helpful (even to new members) or don't reply at all please."

Rob in post 3 asked about your your skill base so I read your profile and answered it for you.

 

[Jackall]

If no-one here says, say, that they had a similar problem and were able to solve it in a simpler way than testing, etc. (because they had the same problem themselves or have heard of things that could be done to check to see if the problem could be resolved simply) then, fair enough, I will have to get someone in. But I wanted to ask and find out, that's all.

 

[Plonker 3]

Every fault is unique, you never know what will be wrong when getting called to a fault.

Only onsite experience helps with that, a photo in this instance is of no use what so ever.

 

[Spoon]

Hi jackall. As mentioned above, its hard to sort out the problem without some form of test gear.
Also maybe better if you get the post shifted to the DIY section, you may get less stick.

 

[Jackall]

If I've put this in the wrong place, I'll remove it, but what I read for this forum also says:

"General electrical information and advice."

Is it only for electricians working in the UK and giving information and advice to each other?

 

[Leesparkykent]

If no-one here says, say, that they had a similar problem and were able to solve it in a simpler way than testing, etc. (because they had the same problem themselves or have heard of things that could be done to check to see if the problem could be resolved simply) then, fair enough, I will have to get someone in. But I wanted to ask and find out, that's all.

what could be simpler for a qualified electrician to do other than test it to see if it works or not?

 

[Jackall]

Hi jackall. As mentioned above, its hard to sort out the problem without some form of test gear.
Also maybe better if you get the post shifted to the DIY section, you may get less stick.

OK, I'll try to do it now...

 

[Spoon]

OK, I'll try to do it now...

The Mods will have to move it. (We are the mods, we are the mods, we are, we are, we are the mods!)...

 

[Jackall]

The Mods will have to move it. (We are the mods, we are the mods, we are, we are, we are the mods!)...

OK, mods - Who are you? Lambretta move this...

 

[ian.settle1]

Their at Vespa's at the moments

 

[Bobster]

As has already been stated above, without having your own test gear it will be cheaper to give a local electrician a ring.

Far more cost effective and safer to boot.

 

[Silly Sausage]

Their at Vespa's at the moments

You got me hungry now, I could do with a Beef Chow Mein!

 

[Geordie Spark]

Am I dreaming or have I really just read about a time clock operating a boiler AND an outside light??!! :dizzy2:

 

[baldsparkies]

Their at Vespa's at the moments

That IS a Lambretta.

A pregnant one :icon12:

 

[baldsparkies]

Hello.



[FONT=&amp]Any ideas as to why the following timer doesn't work - the dial doesn't turn at all. There is an electricity supply going into the box because the last switch is for the boiler which works. The first switch is labelled 'General'; the next switch and the timer are labelled 'Outdoor lights'; and the last switch is labelled 'Boiler', which definitely works. All the wiring is attached and not loose at all.

[/FONT]

Looking at the time clock there is a small round plastic lever at the 7 o clock position.
Move it downwards from position 11 to position 1.
This should bring on the contacts manually.
If it works the time clocks motor either has no power or is **removed**.
If not you have a connection or power supply problem.
That means contact a qualified electrician :icon12:

 

[Plonker 3]

What of there are two feed to the time clock? One for the time clock and one for the lights? How would that be diagnosed by your description?

 

[Anthony S]

What of there are two feed to the time clock? One for the time clock and one for the lights? How would that be diagnosed by your description?

There's one feed, the link is for the volt free switch.

 

[Plonker 3]

How can anyone tell from that photo how many feed there are in that enclosure?

 

[baldsparkies]

Looking at the photo there is a main feed to the DP 10A mcb in red.
There are three outgoing feeds in black, 1 to each switch and the time clock motor.
The left hand switch feeds volt free contact 1 with a brown cable.
Contact 2 is designated 11 and the manual over ride switch at the bottom of the time clock face (7 o clock position) is set to 11 which is not used, ie terminal 2.
Contact 3 is designated 1 and there is a black outgoing feed from this terminal.
With the left hand switch ON and the over ride switch in position 1 a supply should feed terminal 3.
If not its back to (Consult a qualified electrician)

 

[GB.Kayak]

How can anyone tell from that photo how many feed there are in that enclosure?

Looking closely at the photograph ... I see 11 wires entering from above and 6 from below.


From above, LtoR:
- Brown
- 2 x Grey
- 1 x Blue
- 1 x Orangey Red: Line Feed to Top of MCB
- 1 x Black
- 2 x White: Straight Through Box?
- 2 x Blue: Front, Neutral, Wire Feed to Top of MCB; Rear, Neutral, Straight Through Box
- 1 x Green and Yellow - CPC?


From below, LtoR at cable tie:
- 1 x White: Straight Through Box?
- 1 x Black: Switched Line From MCB
- 1 x Green and Yellow: Straight Through Box - CPC?
- 1 x Blue: Switched Neutral From MCB
- 1 x White: Straight Through Box?
- 1 x Blue: Smaller, Neutral, Straight Through Box

Does RH switch do anything? Switch, MCB switched line or one of white wires?

 

[baldsparkies]

Looking closely at the photograph ... I see 11 wires entering from above and 6 from below.


From above, LtoR:
- Brown
- 2 x Grey
- 1 x Blue
- 1 x Orangey Red
- 1 x Black
- 2 x White
- 2 x Blue
- 1 x Green and Yellow - CPC?


From below, LtoR:
- 1 x White
- 1 x Black
- 1 x Green and Yellow - CPC?
- 1 x Blue
- 1 x White
- 1 x Blue

Sorry son I'm from the *removed* 50s.
Everything was black and white in my days. :wheelchair:

 

[Spoon]

**quoted post removed**

Why don't you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don't you dig how beautiful it is out here? Why don't you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?

 

[Octopus]

"Please be reminded that if your reply can't help the original poster, it may be seen as pointless and taking the thread off topic. Please make sure what you are about to post is in-keeping with the forum rules, specifically the "be nice" rule. Just be nice and helpful (even to new members) or don't reply at all please."

you make a point, but ignoring constructive input from other responders, like you have done, makes you as bad IMHO

 

[Spoon]

Haha better.

 

[R G]

To the OP , its a responsibility to leave the installation safe as much as it is to get it working , and as already said the only way you're going to do this is with test equipment and the knowledge to use it , so get an Electrician to sort it....

 

[Lucien Nunes]

On a different note, I'm curous as to which country this is in. The wiring isn't typical of UK practice but I didn't see any reference to that from the OP

 

[HandySparks]

On a different note, I'm curous as to which country this is in. The wiring isn't typical of UK practice but I didn't see any reference to that from the OP

Yes, does have a bit of the 'continental' about it.

 

[ian.settle1]

On a different note, I'm curous as to which country this is in. The wiring isn't typical of UK practice but I didn't see any reference to that from the OP

Reading

 

[Jackall]

yes, this is in Italy. Impressive that some noticed.

 

[Marvo]

I've cleaned up this thread and reopened it. If you've nothing constructive to say then walk away instead of posting derogatory comments. There won't be any more warnings about this.

If there's something illegal or something that's likely to cause injury use the report button for staff to intervene.

 

[Lucien Nunes]

If there is a feed across the right-hand two timer terminals (motor) but the dial doesn't turn, the timer is almost certainly U/S, unless you can spot something obvious like a jammed segment that's preventing it turning.

Interesting that the outside light and boiler share an MCB - I would call that poor design as a fault in the light (which is quite common) or isolating it for re-lamping could prevent the boiler being used.

 

[GB.Kayak]

UPDATED POST ... didn't edit last entry before thread closed ... trapped foot in door! ;-))

Looking closely at the photograph ... I see 11 wires entering from above and 6 from below.

From above, LtoR at exit from conduit:
- 1 x Brown: Feed to bottom of LH switch; brown from top of LH switch feeds common terminal of timeclock
- 2 x Grey
- 1 x Blue
- 1 x Red (orange tinge): Line feed to top of MCB
- 1 x Black
- 2 x White: Straight through box?
- 2 x Blue: Front, neutral, wire feed to top of MCB; rear, neutral, goes straight through box
- 1 x Green and Yellow - CPC?

From below, LtoR at cable tie:
- 1 x White: Straight through box?
- 1 x Black: Switched line from MCB
- 1 x Green and Yellow: Straight through box - CPC?
- 1 x Blue: Switched neutral from MCB
- 1 x White: Straight through box?
- 1 x Blue: Smaller, neutral, straight through box

Does RH switch do anything? Switch MCB switched line or one of white wires?

Melee of black, line or switched line wires, above the timeclock prevents identification of whence they came or go to; further details of 'live' side of circuit need to be identified.

Likewise blue, neutral wires; source or destination of each is required, of particular interest is the loop of blue wire below the LH switch and LH side of the timeclock.

 

[Jackall]

Just in case anyone is interested, I will investigate this further to provide more information (just in case there is still a straightforward solution) but it seems as if it might need the services of a fully-trained electrician, if only to advise further on-site. Thanks for all the helful info so far.