Experience vs Training/Qualifications

[rustynails]

Today I went back to college to start the 2392 course. The trainer was very adamant that gaining the certificate meant nothing. So, if your a self employed person wanting to complete electrical testing/inspection/certification in my opinion it is still very beneficial to be taught and assesed how to perform the testing. I appreciate that experience counts, 40 yrs in the trade means you have lots of time spent with an electrical installation tester. However, If you have very little testing experience but are completing the qualifications then how are you ever supposed to gain that experience without learning how to get that experience the correct way. Plus, in my oppinion, without a proper qualification doesnt that mean you have never been assessed by an assessing body such as city and guilds, under exam conditions. Ideally, In my oppinion, someone with 40 yrs in the trade and all the relevant up to date qualifications is the ideal scenario. This way the end user would be assured that they take pride in there chosen profession by wanting to put themselves through the best qualifications available. Unfortunately, it works the other way as well when you are faced with someone who would be as confident to go out and test without experience or quals after reading a book.

 

[Engineer54]

Experience and qualifications go hand in hand, To be be fully competent you need Both....

 

[maffa ent]

i have had lads come to me with all relevant qualifications, up to date, but i wouldn't let them near my customers!

and i have lads who have nothing on paper, but have experience, pride in their work and understand that this sparkin lark ain't money for old rope, so know how to graft.

i'll take the latter please!

 

[trev]

There's guys that I know who are well qualified on paper but that I wouldn't trust to switch a light on, one of whom I'm related to.

 

[Engineer54]

i have had lads come to me with all relevant qualifications, up to date, but i wouldn't let them near my customers!

and i have lads who have nothing on paper, but have experience, pride in their work and understand that this sparkin lark ain't money for old rope, so know how to graft.

i'll take the latter please!

Then more fool you, if and when something nasty goes wrong!!! In this modern world of law suites for the smallest of reasons etc, you had better be well covered.

To be honest, if these lads have, as you put it ''pride in their work and understand that this sparkin lark ain't money for old rope'', that pride doesn't seem to extend to gaining the necessary qualifications to become a real electrician. Experience is a very important factor, on that i whole heartedly agree. But without a core qualification providing and proving sound technical knowledge to apply that experience, then something is very wrong!!

How do these guy's even manage to get employment as an electrician these days anyway??

 

[pjcomp]

I agree that willing and able are prime qualities on the job, but knowing WHAT to do and WHY you do it are two different things. Someone who knows what they're doing is fine as long as things go well. With baackground training telling you why you're doing it, you're in a better position to sort things out when they go wrong, which I reckon is the more important skill.

PJ

 

[grantr37]

cleared that up.................................

 

[silverfox1]

Its been said before on this forum and in this day and age seems to have more credence than ever " Its not what you know but who you know"

 

[Dooby]

Except the one thing I never see mentioned on this site which annoys the hell out of me is there ARE people out there with qualifications and little experience but who are highly intelligent and honest whom I would MUCH rather let into my home rather than some cocky unpleasant old man with 40 years experience who may know fine well he's doing a sh*t job then ****es off never to answer his phone again. Between my friends and I we've known countless blokes like this.

Now THAT's the motivating factor a lot of us have had to enter the business.

 

[Philpot]

It was said to me( not about me) that it takes little knowledge to make electrical systems work....but a lot of knowledge to make them SAFE. Knowledge and experience are both very important but as we get older there is often a need for a little of humility. In this job no one knows it all no matter how long in the tooth they are.

Old guy Phil

 

[Engineer54]

Except the one thing I never see mentioned on this site which annoys the hell out of me is there ARE people out there with qualifications and little experience but who are highly intelligent and honest whom I would MUCH rather let into my home rather than some cocky unpleasant old man with 40 years experience who may know fine well he's doing a sh*t job then ****es off never to answer his phone again. Between my friends and I we've known countless blokes like this.

Now THAT's the motivating factor a lot of us have had to enter the business.

I would say you have that, the wrong way round!!! It's normally those younger sparks that are the cocky one's, and normally those that know very little... Those older sparks have no need to be cocky, they got over that phase of their lives years ago. Some may well be unpleasant mind, but then who can blame them, seeing their industry undermined by the deluge of Electrical Trainee's and now 17 day Wizz kids....

As for those older sparks that do **** job's, well that always been a problem, and i'll be the first to agree with you. But there not just on the electrical side, but among the ALL trades, ...You'll always get rouges!!! But as you say, at least they will Know they are doing a crap job, unlike can be said for the new fast track wanna-be sparks...

Now THAT's the motivating factor a lot of us have had to enter the business.

Noooo, it was the thought/belief of earning 50K a year with just a few weeks of training to become a ''fully qualified electrician'' that motivated most of these guy's to enter the electrical business.... And now you know, ...both were just pipe dreams!!!

 

[ian.settle1]

Today I went back to college to start the 2392 course. The trainer was very adamant that gaining the certificate meant nothing. So, if your a self employed person wanting to complete electrical testing/inspection/certification in my opinion it is still very beneficial to be taught and assesed how to perform the testing. I appreciate that experience counts, 40 yrs in the trade means you have lots of time spent with an electrical installation tester. However, If you have very little testing experience but are completing the qualifications then how are you ever supposed to gain that experience without learning how to get that experience the correct way. Plus, in my oppinion, without a proper qualification doesnt that mean you have never been assessed by an assessing body such as city and guilds, under exam conditions. Ideally, In my oppinion, someone with 40 yrs in the trade and all the relevant up to date qualifications is the ideal scenario. This way the end user would be assured that they take pride in there chosen profession by wanting to put themselves through the best qualifications available. Unfortunately, it works the other way as well when you are faced with someone who would be as confident to go out and test without experience or quals after reading a book.

Sounds like this idiot is talking himself out of a job.

 

[Dooby]

Noooo, it was the thought/belief of earning 50K a year with just a few weeks of training to become a ''fully qualified electrician'' that motivated most of these guy's to enter the electrical business.... And now you know, ...both were just pipe dreams!!!

But you (and so many here) seem to be assuming anyone older coming new into this is some gormless charlatan? I've come into it with a faaairly good understanding of what to expect, though there's new horrors every day. My motivations are no more suspect than someone with decades experience, I've never met a sparks working full time for free. I get tired of this same record played on this site. I mean admittedly there were blokes on my course way more confident than me in their work who I was amazed could actually manage to dress themselves in the mornings. But that's not everyone, and I've found PLENTY botch jobs by experienced sparks. But I actually put that down to the lack of skill/intelligence/care of the individual, not the training process they went through.

I'm continually offered work that I'm turning down because I don't feel competent enough to do a lot of it yet, though on paper I could. But people want ME to do the work, not someone massively experienced they'd rather not let in their home, or feel wouldn't understand their business. Problem I've got now is I don't know enough experienced sparks I trust to pass it all on to. I work on a building site where the full time guys there don't want extra work, and the only time I meet yer jobbing sparks is on this site, and I keep running into this attitude that because I haven't done a traditional apprenticeship, myself and those like me are ignorant scum that need slapping down. So far, so conforming to the stereotype of the tradesmen myself and those I know are trying to get away from.