How to keep an 24 way 3 phase DB neat, when fully loaded with RCBO's

[Guest 004]

Currently doing an install, with an 24 way 3 phase DB, and it is fully loaded with RCBO's, and it is getting very messy with the 'coil' of neutral off the RCBO to the neutral bar, and even some of the 'fly' earths are too short.

Also what are peoples opinions on ty-rapping loomed cables inside a DB?

So any recommendations of how to keep this neat?, and what to do with the earth (can only think of crimping it)

 

[Knobhead]

Don’t like the idea of ty-wrapping cores just in case a terminal does burn and damages others. But there again it’s only the same risk as any other type of panel.
Looks like crimping the earths is your only way out unless you can fit supplementary earth bars.

Sorry for not being much help, but you’ve seen the board, I haven’t.

 

[nickblake]

if you have coiled neutrals try gently streaching them this will straighten them run all the lives to gether then all the neutrals together and all the earths get some cable tie self adhesive bases and cable tie them to the back i hate curley neutrals they are the pants

 

[ian.settle1]

Don't like cables being ty-wrapped either as you can't get the heat disappated away from the cables in the centre if all are ty-wrapped together also it is a B****** to remove cables from DB at a later date.

Why do you want to crimp the earths together?

 

[Guest 004]

The fly leads off the RCBO'S near the bottom of the board are not long enough to reach the earth bar at the top

 

[Guest 004]

Here is the current picture

 

[roukel01]

Not a lot else you can do with that bud

 

[Guest 004]

Yeah and that is just a quarter of it!

 

[Knobhead]

I don’t know about the rest of you but as an apprentice I was taught not to curl cables because of inductance. Here we have manufacturers doing it for you! Under a heavy fault those curly tails will bounce like Zebedee.

I know Mr Enigma it’s not your fault, but to me that looks a mess.

 

[Guest 004]

That's why I am asking the question

 

[Knobhead]

That's why I am asking the question

Then go with your original thoughts and loom the singles straight as best you can. You were right in the first place

 

[Guest 004]

I was always going to loom the final circuits, then cut the ty raps after, but what am I supposed to do with the neutral coils off the RCBO'S

 

[Knobhead]

Sorry I didn’t make my self clear, if you can pull the coils straight then loom them. If possible use something to stiffen the loom. I once used a plastic knitting needle down the centre of a loom to keep it straight. The loom looked good, the wife had a face like thunder!

 

[Deleted member 9648]

had to replace an rcbo in a 20 module crabtree loadstar DB last week....18 RCBO's in a single phase CU..!!......took me 10 minutes to find the neutral bar... .......:speechless:

 

[Dcf]

Is it just me but the rise of rcbos make it difficult to get a neat board anymore?

 

[Gravid]

I agree, RCBO's make a right rats nest, got some B type Hager 16A RCBO's the other day and neither the earth fly lead or neutral could reach the bars at the bottom of the dis brd....crap. Something to look out for.

Just add this was on a Hager brd as well!

 

[NICK C SPARKS]

I had a 36w once 32 w used, what a nightmere should be a better design rcbo,s stiffer cable for a start this was a sq d i went tie bases earths to outside lives middle n to inside but ask for the coils just tried to push them out of way at the bottom after pulling them tight and straight

 

[NICK C SPARKS]

Hager do 2 types of rcbo a domestic with short leads and industrial with long leads from what i am lead to beleive

 

[Gravid]

Hager do 2 types of rcbo a domestic with short leads and industrial with long leads from what i am lead to beleive

Haha bloody hell ! That explains it then, apologies to Hager for all the names i called them the other day then, cheers.

 

[Dcf]

here is a thought.why do manufacturers space the pan assembly about 50mm off the enclosure so you could get all the cables down the back in a neat way.
without having to bundle them altogether with cable ties (which i dont like btw)
or possibly have an earth and neutral busbar connection which would fit direct onto the rcbo.something like the merlin gerin isobar thing would stop you blowing up the db when you try to retrofit an rcbo.

 

[Engineer54]

Agreed ...straighten those coiled neutral leads, and cut to the length required. Not sure what others do, but i always like to see the earth fly leads connected into the same earth bar terminal with the associated circuit CPC... Dis-like looms in DB panels, dressing cables might take longer, but more practical for heat dissipation and cable tracing in thee future!!

Yes thru crimp any of those RCBO fly leads earth or neutrals, many times the off-cuts from the shorter neutral lead requirement, can be used for extending those needing longer leads ....

 

[mogga]

M.G. DBs have changed design so many bloody times and all are getting worse specialy when doing PIRs tracing n checking those curly neutrals is an absolute MARE specialy when theres full db n everything running down the sides covers earthbar n Iv got chubby fat fingers
When I come across these curlys I TRY to straighten them and cut so theres not to much excess as this can be a right royal pain to get rid of as for the earths Iv seen flys all connected to ends of bars solong as circuit earths are in correct terminals although bot best practice this may solve your problem

 

[pennywise]

I use the cable tie sticky pads, then make a loop with a tie and just don't tighten it up, then it just guides the cables rather than making them into one solid mass that could heat up.

 

[Guest 004]

Sorry I didn’t make my self clear, if you can pull the coils straight then loom them. If possible use something to stiffen the loom. I once used a plastic knitting needle down the centre of a loom to keep it straight. The loom looked good, the wife had a face like thunder!

Good idea Tony

 

[pennywise]

If you wanted to keep things very tidy you could use some Panduit cable guides, I haven't used them yet but the next big board I get there going in :drool5:

http://www.cablectrix.co.uk/downloads/panduit/harnes-board-accessories.pdf

 

[sparc]

Unfortunately the design of the basic box isn't much beyond the 70s, and hasn't kept pace with huge forward leaps in technologies - like RCBO (ahem!)

And why for God's sake do the manufacturers insist on making them smaller and smaller - as if the customer gives a fig if it's 2cm thinner? I want those 2cm please!

 

[mayfair]

Yep thats the way i do it too...........Great minds think alike

I use the cable tie sticky pads, then make a loop with a tie and just don't tighten it up, then it just guides the cables rather than making them into one solid mass that could heat up.

 

[Guest 004]

Done

 

[Knobhead]

Well done! It looks good :artist:

 

[Spudnik]

Hager do indeed supply 2 types of RCBO as NICK said above.

The only difference?

The fly leads are longer on the commercial ones, which of course means they are double the price.