no earths at lights and switches and bonding 6mm rather than 10mm

[jamesb1]

what the general take on this if say you where changing a db and and there was bonding present but not the right size but it satifys test limts ? and also say are changingthe db and some switches dont have a earth but are plastic ? and the same with a light fitting a all plastic fitting ?

 

[IQ Electrical]

I should work for the ESC

This is a good guide on the subject, page 4 deals with your bonding question:

http://www.esc.org.uk/pdfs/business-and-community/electrical-industry/BPG1v2_web.pdf

 

[Paul.M]

Regarding the plastic fittings, cpc must be present long its full length and at the switches and light fitting it needs to be there incase the house holder changes them to metal.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

I would list the lack of CPC as a defect, protect the relavent circuits with RCDs and place a notice on the CU.
I believe the ESC have guidance on this in their best practice guide for changing CUs where the lighting has no CPC.

 

[IQ Electrical]

The guidance is for an all-insulated Class II system and a label stating this at the consumer unit.
Personally I wouldn't entertain it, too messy and bad practice in my opinion but ultimately the installers decision influenced by the clients budget!

 

[SimpleSimon]

With regards to bonding remember it can either be given by selection or calculation using the adiabatic equation. If this is satisfied than u should be satisfied. Minimum half that of the incoming neutral.

 

[IQ Electrical]

With regards to bonding remember it can either be given by selection or calculation using the adiabatic equation. If this is satisfied than u should be satisfied. Minimum half that of the incoming neutral.

I think the OP should state the earthing system before we dish out bonding sizing advice.

 

[SimpleSimon]

Fair point.

 

[ian]

I think its ok as far as the ECS guidance is concerned, however, I personally I would not get involved in changing a CU without the earths. Just my preference.

Ian

 

[robsparky1975]

I have seen had this problem before when changing consumer unit,and when explained to the clients about no cpcs,and what the implications in the future could be,they agreed to upgrade,anyone that refused,then i would think 99% of sparks would not want to take it on,myself included

 

[sparks1234]

There is a duty of care involved in our job, I would point out the potential hazard, ensure all fittings are plastic, fit new board. If the client cannot have the lighting circuit changed for T & E for whatever reason, an RCD protected circuit is going to give them more protection than an old consumer unit.

 

[Bigboy247]

Read the best practice guides or print one off and give it the customer.It says the consumer unit should not be changed if no cpc`s are not there. I have had this before and it can cause lots of fault when testing so do the correct thing and replace the cpc/ cable. Its only in the interest of the customers safety.

 

[IQ Electrical]

Read the best practice guides or print one off and give it the customer.It says the consumer unit should not be changed if no cpc`s are not there. I have had this before and it can cause lots of fault when testing so do the correct thing and replace the cpc/ cable. Its only in the interest of the customers safety.

I'll post the link again for you Bigboy247, maybe you haven't read it

http://www.esc.org.uk/pdfs/business-and-community/electrical-industry/BPG1v2_web.pdf

 

[Bigboy247]

yes I have read it recently as was asked the question buy a customer as I carried out a pir. Thank you for the link anyway IQ electrical.

 

[IQ Electrical]

I'm just trying to stick to the facts, regardless of opinion, the guide does not say 'you can't change the consumer unit if there are no cpc's' does it?

Also, how does it 'cause lots of faults'?

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Best practice is to rewire the lighting circuits..........But if this is not going to happen I have on occasion changed the CU as long as all accessories and luminaires on the affected circuit are class 11. A label is provided at the DB, suitable manufactured labels are available from wholesalers.
This approach is fully in accordance with ESC guidelines, the safety of the installation is improved and as long as the correct cert is provided with all the info there can be no comeback if someone in the future fits a class 1 fitting or switch.

 

[ezzzekiel]

With regards to bonding remember it can either be given by selection or calculation using the adiabatic equation.

adiabatic shall not be used to size main bonding conductors.