Memera 2000 mounted to water cylinder

InfiniteElec · Apr 30, 2021

Hi all,

Hopefully picked the right place to post about this..!

I've just completed an EICR and there was a second board mounted to the water cylinder which does both the hot water and heating.

It's in an apartment (I'm assuming every flat will be the same).

I've told the landlord that I need to come back to test this board and that it's probably not going to be good news for them.

Has anyone come across something like this before? I just can't see how it was ever acceptable the way it's been mounted! I haven't properly gotten to the board yet as it has shelving built infront which needs removing.

The contactor inside has a couple of brittle/burnt cables so some investigation work is going to be required.

Some info on the board:
16mm 3 core SWA supply fed from 63A MCB
1361 fuses supplying immersion, pumps and valves
Contactor inside
Water pipe directly above

I've scrubbed the company name off one of the images so I don't drop anyone in hot water ahem.

I'm finding myself coming across loads of bizarre installation methods recently and it's driving me mad so any advice on where to go with it moving forwards would be appreciated!

Thanks.

littlespark · Apr 30, 2021

It looks as though only the heating/ hot water comes off this board.... it wouldn’t be a factory built standard control box for the system, would it?

It also appears to have been tested jan 2020.... have you seen a copy of the test, and was it deemed satisfactory at that time?

How is it fixed? Glued to the tank??

mattg4321 · Apr 30, 2021

Would be helpful if you could make that file a bit bigger!!!

How on earth did they fix that?!

InfiniteElec · Apr 30, 2021

littlespark said:
It looks as though only the heating/ hot water comes off this board.... it wouldn’t be a factory built standard control box for the system, would it?

It also appears to have been tested jan 2020.... have you seen a copy of the test, and was it deemed satisfactory at that time?

How is it fixed? Glued to the tank??

I’m doing this for an estate agent I work with, they used a different company last year who tested, failed and quoted. A year has passed and the landlord wanted a second opinion. They failed the main board and quoted to replace, following the inspection we’ve completed we’ve found that not necessary.
They only failed this particular board on the fact there are taped up redundant cables inside and the contractor is showing signs of thermal damage.
They did zero testing on the main board as the tenant had apparently requested the power wasn’t switched off - sounds like they went in, took a few pictures and filled the rest out in the van to be honest and then quoted just over £1000+vat to put right..!

No idea how it’s fixed yet, I’ve asked the tenant to empty the cupboard so we can remove the shelves when we go back to test it.

timhoward · Apr 30, 2021

InfiniteElec said:
No idea how it’s fixed yet

When you return let's have a slightly different camera angle!
I'm also intrigued how it's attached. Surely it can't be riveted?
Short self tappers into the insulation?
Certainly an interesting one.

GBDamo · Apr 30, 2021

Does this fall under an EICR?

I installed a 9kw electric boiler recently with its own controls mounted on the side. If I were to EICR that property I'd stop at the isolator.

No harm in having a look, and probably for the best you did, but is it a requirement?

snowhead · Apr 30, 2021

My guess is it's a factory built unit and will be fixed to a bracket brazed onto the cylinder.
There's a clue on the right hand side on the C.U.

brianmoooore · Apr 30, 2021

Sparky for 50 years and plumber for best part of 40, and I've never seen anything like that, but it's definitely a factory built unit, so it's debatable whether it's covered by an EICR at all, as long as IR is good at the isolator. The CU and trunking must be fitted to brackets brazed to the copper of the cylinder before the insulation was applied. Insulation is far too soft to fix anything to.

littlespark · Apr 30, 2021

I’m going with really long self tappers into the copper tank wall and a lot of luck.
?

mattg4321 · Apr 30, 2021

littlespark said:
I’m going with really long self tappers into the copper tank wall and a lot of luck.
?

No chance. It must’ve been factory fitted as above

InfiniteElec · May 1, 2021

So would it be fair to say they should get a heating engineer in to check that board over? Otherwise it’s going to fall onto me to sort and to be quite honest, I’d rather not touch it!

InfiniteElec · May 1, 2021

brianmoooore said:
Sparky for 50 years and plumber for best part of 40, and I've never seen anything like that, but it's definitely a factory built unit, so it's debatable whether it's covered by an EICR at all, as long as IR is good at the isolator. The CU and trunking must be fitted to brackets brazed to the copper of the cylinder before the insulation was applied. Insulation is far too soft to fix anything to.

Should I suggest they get a heating engineer in to service the board then?

SJD · May 1, 2021

My suggestion is perhaps to test the supply to the board, and visually check this board & other components for things like exposed basic insulation, IP ratings etc, then include in the EICR Limitations that the "heating controls" are excluded from testing - just as you might not test operation of a controller, stats etc for a conventional boiler system. Either an agreed limitation or an operational one.

Timbo · May 1, 2021

I would class that as a heating control panel as it has relays/contactors inside, serial number and build label inside and model number label on the front.

brianmoooore · May 1, 2021

This discussion has only arisen because the 'control panel' for this water heater looks like something we recognise as CU.
If it was completely a custom design, this thread wouldn't exist.

snowhead · May 1, 2021

Wot he said ^^^.
Plus it was built from a C.U as that was the cheapest / simplest option back when it was built.
If it was done now, or replaced now, it would be a custom panel.
It was either custom built for the whole block of flats or a panel used in many other blocks.

It looks like the panel was designed for 12kw (4 x3kw) hence Model 12 and there must be a timer / controller elsewhere.
Thermtec, now part of Heatrod, the immersion manufacturer may have built the panel or know who did or who could built a replacement if a dispute arrises over it appearing to be a C.U and having a plastic front cover.

Memera 2000 mounted to water cylinder

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