Full rewire - Avg terrace

Roadhousezamora · Dec 22, 2021

Morning everyone, I've posted a few times but I'm new here and thought I'd see if there's any interest in me doing this...

I've recently purchased a property (Avg terrace) and I'm looking to do a full rewire on it. Ive done the domestic qualifications and have completed rewires in the past with another spark but this will be my first go at doing this alone.

I will be approaching building control to have my work checked and will be getting an isolator fitted to the below setup before I disconnect everything and fit a temporary board.

Is there any interest from perhaps more inexperienced forum members in me documenting this as a thread over the coming couple of months?

It's worth noting I won't be living there so this process won't be the quickest as I will be taking on plenty of other aspects of the renovation alongside the electrical work.

Anyways if there isn't a lot of interest I will be more than happy to pull the thread but I just thought I would test the water and see.

Cheers everyone...

Oh here's a pic of my starting point...

^

ferg · Dec 22, 2021

If you have thick enough skin to be posting pictures of your work on the open forum then go for it.
You will certainly get feedback!
Probably not a bad thing. It will either boost your confidence due to the collective awe at your perfection or more likely identify areas where you might be able to improve.

It's worth noting that it is extremely rare for pictures of work to be posted without getting some form of..... constructive criticism.

Roadhousezamora · Dec 22, 2021

I admit to being inexperienced and would hope that given my work is going to be checked by building control it'll need to be up to scratch or it won't be passed.

As long as feedback is constructive then a mistake is a mistake and will need correcting so I'm happy to give it a shot (as I say if ppl feel there's an interest in it).

As I was once told mistakes are the best way to learn.

timhoward · Dec 22, 2021

Go for it. I think you've set the tone well.
It would be interesting to know how many circuits are in use between those three CU's, as it all looks a little bit OTT for a terrace!

(I'd probably just take the long tails from the Wylex and use them to feed the Proteus as a temporary supply as it looks as though there's an RCD main switch - it has test sticker at least!).

Roadhousezamora · Dec 22, 2021

Thanks Tim, it'll be sporadic when I post to the thread given everything else but I'd like to see how it goes.

Agreed it is overkill and next time I'm there I will open all the boards and show what's going on.

The Rcd you mentioned is actually an RCBO which has been added for the electric shower upstairs.

I intended to build a small temporary board with an A3 radial on from a new garage CU and a 20A RCBO. Hopefully I can remove this and transfer this between houses if needed in the future.

timhoward · Dec 22, 2021

Roadhousezamora said:
I intended to build a small temporary board with an A3 radial on from a new garage CU and a 20A RCBO. Hopefully I can remove this and transfer this between houses if needed in the future.

Very good idea. I did similar years ago and it's been invaluable countless times.
One approach that has worked really well for me is to connect a breaker on the garage CU to a 16amp female socket. Then use standard (caravan) 16A leads to get power to where you need it; these can be daisy chained too.
Finally if you get a metalclad socket, some flex, some stuffing glands, and put a 16A male and female socket on either side of it you can then have power wherever you want it and daisy chain on to somewhere else. This makes a modular system that can grow easily.

Roadhousezamora · Dec 22, 2021

I will look into this Tim instead of running 30m extension leads everywhere. Thanks for the idea. I will put some pics up when I've built these.

Dustydazzler · Dec 22, 2021

Yes , document your progress through the 1st and 2nd fox stages of your re-wire, add lots of pictures of your work in progress. pictures are quite handy reminders of where you ran cables especially when it comes to putting up shelves and picture hooks in the future...

don't forget lots of pictures of your consumer unit as well, everyone loves evaluating a consumer unit for neatness

good luck with the rewire , take your time and it will be fine

Roadhousezamora · Dec 30, 2021

So along with stripping wallpaper and removing baths and finding the stopcock, I've been building myself a temporary board to replace the consumer unit(s) that are at the property and that can be moved with me to any others in the future. Below are some pictures of how it's turned out.

I've fitted two circuits for now, a 20a radial with 3 double 13a plug top outlets and a 16a radial with one 13a plug top outlet and both 16a commando sockets.

I bought a relatively big BG unit considering what I was doing but felt it would allow me to extend in the future if I needed to and it also didn't break the bank. I've used RCBOs as the breakers but have yet to shorten and properly terminate the neutral fly leads with ferrules... I also need some more blanks for the spare ways in the board.

This is my first go, be gentle lol.

pc1966 · Dec 30, 2021

Looks like you are making a decent start.

If you can, I would post your analysis of what is currently in use and what you propose to replace it with. That way any obvious oddities can be commented on. I'm thinking here of your original photo as it appears to have some heavy T&E going up the way, are there other CU in the property? If not what is it for, a very big shower, etc?

In most cases the IET On-Site Guide is your best starting point as it gives typical "standard circuits" with acceptable installation methods (i.e. thermal insulation) and maximum lengths so you quickly check if it is good to go for most cases.

Roadhousezamora · Dec 30, 2021

Yeah the t+e running up is attached to a 40a RCBO and is running the upstairs shower.

The pics I've posted are just to supply temporary power whilst I complete the rewire. As the property will be unoccupied I'm just going to remove the three boards and fit this until I'm ready to energise the new permanent board. I'll then take this one I've built with me and reuse it on the next property.

From what I can gather of the boards that are currently there, everytime something has been added it's been put in via a new board instead of paying to redo it as one board.

pc1966 · Dec 30, 2021

Roadhousezamora said:
Yeah the t+e running up is attached to a 40a RCBO and is running the upstairs shower.

OK, that makes sense.

Roadhousezamora said:
From what I can gather of the boards that are currently there, everytime something has been added it's been put in via a new board instead of paying to redo it as one board.

Not uncommon. Sometimes because the old board has no space, sometimes because of a big gap in time and you can't get compatible parts for the old board so easier/cheaper to put a new one in, etc.

Always have some space for expansion! The cost for a bigger CU is usually trivial, as it is the RCBOs, etc, that add more cost (but even then, probably less than cost of testing, etc).

timhoward · Dec 30, 2021

Forgive me asking a side question about your board. Is that a 16A male and 16A female socket both connected to a circuit from the CU? I fear you slightly misinterpreted something I said....

If so, you need to lose the male, as you can't have 3 live pins just sitting there.

You can use that arrangement with a socket on it's own, so the male is where the power comes in, and the female is where you can daisy chain to another board.
You can also use that arrangement as the incomer to a whole board, again the male is where the power comes in so is never live unless being used.
But you can't have a male socket live just sitting there.

Sorry if I'm wrong.

Roadhousezamora · Dec 31, 2021

Thanks Tim, it would appear I have misinterpreted, I do get what you're saying. The 16a male socket could be used as an incommer socket for a new board in a different location and shouldn't be wired as an outlet as I have done here.

I will grab some more 13a outlets and fit them to a new board with the 16a male as the incommer and run a 16a male to female extension to it from the outlet on the board pictured here. That second board would then provide power upstairs during the work. I assume as you said originally I could continue this process on to a third board by fitting an outgoing 16a female socket? I guess this is what you were meaning in the first place... I'll get my coat

I will remove the male socket and shove a blank grommet into the hole.

It's these sort of things I definitely need to be told, you definitely don't need to apologise.

timhoward · Dec 31, 2021

Roadhousezamora said:
Thanks Tim, it would appear I have misinterpreted, I do get what you're saying. The 16a male socket could be used as an incommer socket for a new board in a different location and shouldn't be wired as an outlet as I have done here.

I will grab some more 13a outlets and fit them to a new board with the 16a male as the incommer and run a 16a male to female extension to it from the outlet on the board pictured here. That second board would then provide power upstairs during the work. I assume as you said originally I could continue this process on to a third board by fitting an outgoing 16a female socket? I guess this is what you were meaning in the first place... I'll get my coat

I will remove the male socket and shove a blank grommet into the hole.

It's these sort of things I definitely need to be told, you definitely don't need to apologise.

Yes that is exactly right.
The 2nd board doesn’t need a CU on it just a socket in, 13a socket and socket out.
(It also doesn’t need a board, you can use a short length of flex rated for 16A and trailing plugs each side, male and female.)
It’s looking good though, very neat!

suffolkspark · Dec 31, 2021

I'm not sure but those old mem boards could be the type with the asbestos arc pad in the holder, the fuse itself looks familiar... maybe somebody can confirm, maybe just hold your breath when removing

Roadhousezamora · Dec 31, 2021

suffolkspark said:
I'm not sure but those old mem boards could be the type with the asbestos arc pad in the holder, the fuse itself looks familiar... maybe somebody can confirm, maybe just hold your breath when removing

I hadn't considered that and you're right, it could well have, I will see if any others advise. I think the mem board you mention is board mounted so will try to just remove the board from the wall if possible.

Roadhousezamora · Dec 31, 2021

timhoward said:
Yes that is exactly right.
The 2nd board doesn’t need a CU on it just a socket in, 13a socket and socket out.
(It also doesn’t need a board, you can use a short length of flex rated for 16A and trailing plugs each side, male and female.)
It’s looking good though, very neat!

Cheers, I see how in the future I could add further 16a RCBOs and female outlets to run other satellite boards around any future properties.

westward10 · Dec 31, 2021

suffolkspark said:
I'm not sure but those old mem boards could be the type with the asbestos arc pad in the holder, the fuse itself looks familiar... maybe somebody can confirm, maybe just hold your breath when removing

If the fuse carrier sitting on top of the consumer unit is the same as the fitted carriers then they have BS1361 fuses fitted so no asbestos. These are Memcert fuses and the way to tell without removing them is the hole through the carrier body, this indicates BS1361. No hole will almost certainly indicate BS3036 and the likely presence of asbestos.

timhoward · Dec 31, 2021

Just for academic interest this style has the asbestos in the fuse carriers:

Roadhousezamora · Dec 31, 2021

timhoward said:
Just for academic interest this style has the asbestos in the fuse carriers:

There is one already out at the moment, when I'm back on site I will compare it.

Midwest · Jan 1, 2022

Roadhousezamora said:
I will be approaching building control to have my work checked and will be getting an isolator fitted to the below setup before I disconnect everything and fit a temporary board.

Have you actually discussed this with your BC?

In my experience with my BC, they weren't interested in certification themselves and finding someone certified as third party was just as impracticable.

Roadhousezamora · Jan 1, 2022

Midwest said:
Have you actually discussed this with your BC?

In my experience with my BC, they weren't interested in certification themselves and finding someone certified as third party was just as impracticable.

Not yet no, sounds like a call to them just to confirm everything may be a job for me first thing Monday. I should really stop assuming things will go the way I expect them to with out checking... Thanks for the advice.

timhoward · Jan 1, 2022

It can unfortunately vary by council / area. Some will do it but charge quite a lot for the service. Others simply don't engage.

If you end up in that camp the other possibility is doing a search on Napit's website for someone offering third party certification (TPC) in the hope there's someone local who is willing to discuss plans, inspect first fix, 2nd fix and do the required paperwork.
A quick glance suggests there are a few signed up to do TPC in your area. But you may find that not everyone ~~conned into buying~~ signed up to do TPC is actually willing to do it.

UNG · Jan 1, 2022

Roadhousezamora said:
Not yet no, sounds like a call to them just to confirm everything may be a job for me first thing ~~Monday~~ Tuesday. I should really stop assuming things will go the way I expect them to with out checking... Thanks for the advice.

Corrected that for you

Roadhousezamora · Jan 1, 2022

timhoward said:
It can unfortunately vary by council / area. Some will do it but charge quite a lot for the service. Others simply don't engage.

If you end up in that camp the other possibility is doing a search on Napit's website for someone offering third party certification (TPC) in the hope there's someone local who is willing to discuss plans, inspect first fix, 2nd fix and do the required paperwork.
A quick glance suggests there are a few signed up to do TPC in your area. But you may find that not everyone ~~conned into buying~~ signed up to do TPC is actually willing to do it.

I will chase it up and see, I do have someone I could approach who wasn't registered to sign off third party work last I spoke to him but he may have taken that on since. Hopefully BC will get in board and it will be straight forward. From looking through their docs they are offering a service relating to electrical work however whether they actually play ball may be another story entirely as has been mentioned above

Roadhousezamora · Jan 2, 2022

New pics of the boards... Any advice re asbestos?

Thanks

timhoward · Jan 2, 2022

Roadhousezamora said:
New pics of the boards... Any advice re asbestos?

You are fine - none in that one.

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