Steca (Studer) XPC 2200-24 inverter problem.

[Spacebass]

Firstly Thank You for the opportunity to join your forum.

I have just bought a Steca (Studer) XPC 2200- 24 inverter second hand for my 24 volt solar system .
When I wired it up and turned it on with AC in and out connected the AC present light was flashing which means suitable AC is not present at the input (which it was) , on the AC out side after a few minutes this indicator light was also blinking which means the device is searching for a load , I had this output connected to an automatic switchover switch whatever was reaching this because the indicator light on it was flickering was not enough to make it switch to this unit. The battery status light was on 100% and the on off indicator light was at soms stage flashing which means 'the unit is temporarily turned off and will automatically turn on ' which I did not see.

 

[Spacebass]

Original post with all details too long so butchered it.

 

[marconi]

What was the transfer led doing?

the inverter will go to sleep if it does not detect a load - blinking ac output light. This will be the case before the transfer switch changes contacts to the inverter. Try putting a 60 or 100W lamp directly on the inverter ac output to fool the inverter sense logic that there is actually a load at the inverter input contacts of the transfer switch. Please tell me what happens.

the blinking ac input light is because the ac input monitoring logic detects the ac in is out of range for voltage and frequency. Factory set is voltage must be greater than 200V and frequency between 44 and 65Hz. The thresholds for voltage can be adjusted ( range is 150 to 230V) too so it may well be you have use the knobs on the back of the inverter to set voltage and frequency to the values as supplied to your home by the grid. Please measure the ac input voltage. See 4.8.1 of reference for voltage threshold adjustment method.

Last for now check the overload protection has not operated. The small button to the right of the negative input terminal should be in.

dc input must be 19 - 32V again please measure at inverter dc terminals.

Let me know what you find please.

http://pdfstream.manualsonline.com/f/fe2c9ce0-7ce0-4b36-9f2a-2e89ea4846d5.pdf

Page 9 of Studer Innotec Battery Charger XPC 2200-24 User Guide | ManualsOnline.com - http://powertool.manualsonline.com/manuals/mfg/studer/xpc_2200_24.html?p=9

 

[Jim_e_Jib]

It's not completely clear in the photo but there does appear to be a lot of corrosion inside the unit. Could this be contributing to the problems?

 

[marconi]

Just so you know the transfer delay is set to off - slide switch 2.
Battery equalise is set to on - slide switch 1.

Is the ac in from the grid or from a generator?

 

[Spacebass]

Thanks for replies ! Yes there is corrosion mainly on the two posts that hold the DC in cables a top and this is white powdery and goes everywhere I have hoovered it out. I guess it is old !
The Ac in is grid I measured it at the breaker in OK I have taken special care when I put the cables back, I set the two sliders as such because have lead acid batteries can take 40 amp equalise and not to lose internet on transfer delay.

 

[Spacebass]

What was the transfer led doing?

the inverter will go to sleep if it does not detect a load - blinking ac output light. This will be the case before the transfer switch changes contacts to the inverter. Try putting a 60 or 100W lamp directly on the inverter ac output to fool the inverter sense logic that there is actually a load at the inverter input contacts of the transfer switch. Please tell me what happens.

the blinking ac input light is because the ac input monitoring logic detects the ac in is out of range for voltage and frequency. Factory set is voltage must be greater than 200V and frequency between 44 and 65Hz. The thresholds for voltage can be adjusted ( range is 150 to 230V) too so it may well be you have use the knobs on the back of the inverter to set voltage and frequency to the values as supplied to your home by the grid. Please measure the ac input voltage. See 4.8.1 of reference for voltage threshold adjustment method.

Last for now check the overload protection has not operated. The small button to the right of the negative input terminal should be in.

dc input must be 19 - 32V again please measure at inverter dc terminals.

Let me know what you find please.

http://pdfstream.manualsonline.com/f/fe2c9ce0-7ce0-4b36-9f2a-2e89ea4846d5.pdf

Page 9 of Studer Innotec Battery Charger XPC 2200-24 User Guide | ManualsOnline.com - http://powertool.manualsonline.com/manuals/mfg/studer/xpc_2200_24.html?p=9

Wow thanks for the reply!
The transfer light was off all the time I thought the transfer switch might be a problem I did rig a socket to try an appliance instead but ended up taking it off to check the fuse inside which I couldn't find until I realised it actually was a 3 mm wide metal bar connecting the minus in to the board right in front of me ! I run two systems one night one day , hence transfer switch and am changing the inverter on day system this one because existing one is too big 3kw cont and once had a loose connection on the black dc out that melted the plastic output housing works but connection goes black after a while and black wire gets hot.
This inverter can only alter factory settings with optional aux board and also can only reset to factory with it , I think. Disgraceful in 1000eu device. The overload pin sticks out quite far but does not feel like it has popped .
Does seem great quality but old so hope can save it , have got the manual thanks.

 

[marconi]

If cables and their terminations are becoming so hot that damage is being caused then maybe:

1. The cables are too thin. What thickness are they? Are they multi-stranded and reasonably flexible? Or are they only a few strands and very stiff to bend? They need to be multistranded to make a good connection. At 3kW output the dc input current is 3000/(dc input voltage); so if dc voltage is 25V the current is 3000/25 = 120Amps. 120Amps requires cabling to be 35mm2 in cross sectional area. Thicker cables also help conduct heat away from terminations.


35mm2 240 A Amps Flexible PVC Battery Welding Cable Black Red 1M 1 M Lengths CAR | eBay - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/201705780993?chn=ps&var=501503053801&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=710-134428-41853-0&mkcid=2&itemid=501503053801_201705780993&targetid=1140163976049&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9045003&poi=&campaignid=12125451065&mkgroupid=120711382790&rlsatarget=pla-1140163976049&abcId=9300480&merchantid=110778415&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIkvnz5KOo8AIVmt_tCh2HcgDFEAQYCSABEgKFX_D_BwE

2. The cables must be correctly and tightly terminated and the copper conductors must be clean. For bolt connections the cable needs to be terminated in a ring connector with washers and anti vibration rings. Screws terminals often need to be tightened up after an hour or so because the copper deforms loosening the connection.

3. Cables should be short.

4. If you cannot keep your fingertip on low voltage connection then it is too hot.

 

[Spacebass]

If cables and their terminations are becoming so hot that damage is being caused then maybe:

1. The cables are too thin. What thickness are they? Are they multi-stranded and reasonably flexible? Or are they only a few strands and very stiff to bend? They need to be multistranded to make a good connection. At 3kW output the dc input current is 3000/(dc input voltage); so if dc voltage is 25V the current is 3000/25 = 120Amps. 120Amps requires cabling to be 35mm2 in cross sectional area. Thicker cables also help conduct heat away from terminations.


35mm2 240 A Amps Flexible PVC Battery Welding Cable Black Red 1M 1 M Lengths CAR | eBay - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/201705780993?chn=ps&var=501503053801&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=710-134428-41853-0&mkcid=2&itemid=501503053801_201705780993&targetid=1140163976049&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9045003&poi=&campaignid=12125451065&mkgroupid=120711382790&rlsatarget=pla-1140163976049&abcId=9300480&merchantid=110778415&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIkvnz5KOo8AIVmt_tCh2HcgDFEAQYCSABEgKFX_D_BwE

2. The cables must be correctly and tightly terminated and the copper conductors must be clean. For bolt connections the cable needs to be terminated in a ring connector with washers and anti vibration rings. Screws terminals often need to be tightened up after an hour or so because the copper deforms loosening the connection.

3. Cables should be short.

4. If you cannot keep your fingertip on low voltage connection then it is too hot.

This hot cable problem is of the the inverter I am replacing with the. XPC, it started when the. connection at the terminal became loose.
The XPC is supplied with I would say 35 sqm cables 1.3 metres long I will cut them down to .5 metre. for now the system is working with yet another inverter I will let it run tonight and tomorrow try. the XPC again. with a straight load to start and. post. what happens.
Thank You for your interest.

 

[Spacebass]

If cables and their terminations are becoming so hot that damage is being caused then maybe:

1. The cables are too thin. What thickness are they? Are they multi-stranded and reasonably flexible? Or are they only a few strands and very stiff to bend? They need to be multistranded to make a good connection. At 3kW output the dc input current is 3000/(dc input voltage); so if dc voltage is 25V the current is 3000/25 = 120Amps. 120Amps requires cabling to be 35mm2 in cross sectional area. Thicker cables also help conduct heat away from terminations.


35mm2 240 A Amps Flexible PVC Battery Welding Cable Black Red 1M 1 M Lengths CAR | eBay - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/201705780993?chn=ps&var=501503053801&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=710-134428-41853-0&mkcid=2&itemid=501503053801_201705780993&targetid=1140163976049&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9045003&poi=&campaignid=12125451065&mkgroupid=120711382790&rlsatarget=pla-1140163976049&abcId=9300480&merchantid=110778415&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIkvnz5KOo8AIVmt_tCh2HcgDFEAQYCSABEgKFX_D_BwE

2. The cables must be correctly and tightly terminated and the copper conductors must be clean. For bolt connections the cable needs to be terminated in a ring connector with washers and anti vibration rings. Screws terminals often need to be tightened up after an hour or so because the copper deforms loosening the connection.

3. Cables should be short.

4. If you cannot keep your fingertip on low voltage connection then it is too hot.

I am aware of wire size requirements, in this case I bought 50mmsq cable to try and resolve the problem but the black behave exactly the same as the smaller cable before i.e. got hot and blackened at the terminal . Pictured with 16 sqmm cable I like to use my load generally never above 1.3kw .

 

[marconi]

Please send me some photos of what the terminals look like at each end of both red and black cables.

 

[DPG]

I am aware of wire size requirements, in this case I bought 50mmsq cable to try and resolve the problem but the black behave exactly the same as the smaller cable before i.e. got hot and blackened at the terminal . Pictured with 16 sqmm cable I like to use my load generally never above 1.3kw .

That has also got corrosion. Why is this?

 

[Spacebass]

That has also got corrosion. Why is this?

It wasn't on for long I live in the tropics maybe that does not help and maybe I cannot clamp the cable tightly enough in the O ring connector socket.

Back to the main subject The XPC 2200 -24 today I plugged it in again and some different things happened 1. When I turned on the AC the yellow AC light came on and stayed on solid quite a long time about 1 minute then started flashing 2. The battery was making what I believe is a charging sound quite vigorously , 3. The AC output light did not come on at all 4. I plugged my usual load into the AC output socket this usually shows 1, 3 or 5% on the 3000 watt inverter I don't know what was happenning with that load but when I turned on 3 watt led bulb by the set up coming from the same consumer box the inverter made a buzzing noise and turned off and then turned on again it did this 4 times as listed in the 'overload section of the Steca XPC manual.
I left it that quite a lot to hapenn in a couple of minutes doesn't make much sense to me, will try again in the next couple of days.

 

[marconi]

I will read the manual more carefully. It is important that you do not re-use heat damaged o terminals and that re- made connections use bright new clean copper and are very tightly crimped so that there is no movement between o terminal and cable.

 

[marconi]

What is the usual load you mentioned?

You have connected ac in and ac out correctly?

if you disconnect the inverter completely from switchover switch what happens?

if you connect a 60 to 100W load directly to output of inverter what happens?

where does inverter get its ac supply from? It must not be the consumer unit the inverter ac output feeds because this would connect the inverter output to its input.

Some pictures of installation would help me.

ps: whereabouts are you in Thailand to city level please? Adds to my interest to look up in an atlas.

 

[Jim_e_Jib]

It wasn't on for long I live in the tropics maybe that does not help and maybe I cannot clamp the cable tightly enough in the O ring connector socket.

Back to the main subject The XPC 2200 -24 today I plugged it in again and some different things happened 1. When I turned on the AC the yellow AC light came on and stayed on solid quite a long time about 1 minute then started flashing 2. The battery was making what I believe is a charging sound quite vigorously , 3. The AC output light did not come on at all 4. I plugged my usual load into the AC output socket this usually shows 1, 3 or 5% on the 3000 watt inverter I don't know what was happenning with that load but when I turned on 3 watt led bulb by the set up coming from the same consumer box the inverter made a buzzing noise and turned off and then turned on again it did this 4 times as listed in the 'overload section of the Steca XPC manual.
I left it that quite a lot to hapenn in a couple of minutes doesn't make much sense to me, will try again in the next couple of days.

Could the corrosion be contributing to a poor electrical contact with the DC cables or the bus bars that appear to connect to those posts? Does it need more than just a vacuum cleaner - perhaps a thorough clean to ensure good metal to metal contact throughout the DC circuit?