18th edition - any point?

[Deleted member 26818]

I think ‘understate’ would be more appropriate.

 

[oracle]

I'd now be doing a life stretch for failure to apply a mixed colour label. The worst thing that could possibly happen is Bs7671 becoming statutory. There's not one spark on here that hasn't at some point left a job with a minor,not safety related departure from the regs due to a memory lapse. Be careful what you wish for.

How would you feel if they scrapped the Road traffic act because some drivers have a memory lapse?

Laws are for protecting us, you will always find criminal negligence. Other countries, first and third world, manage to legistrate their wiring regulations.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Problem with other countries legislating their wiring Regulations, is all the ones cited focus more on protecting the livelihood of electricians than on safety.

 

[Deleted member 9648]

How would you feel if they scrapped the Road traffic act because some drivers have a memory lapse?

Laws are for protecting us, you will always find criminal negligence. Other countries, first and third world, manage to legistrate their wiring regulations.

I'm not sure the analogy really applies, Bs7671 is so complex, how are you going to appropriate 'punishment' for departures....will the consequences of breaking the law by failure to apply a sticker carry the same penalty as failure to provide an adequate earthing system?
EICR's will be a legal minefield, I really believe those calling for 7671 to be law really haven't thought through the potential consequences.

 

[Andy78]

How about keeping it simple and expanding the scope of the EAWR to apply to anyone who picks up a screwdriver ?

 

[Deleted member 26818]

How about keeping it simple and expanding the scope of the EAWR to apply to anyone who picks up a screwdriver ?

I have to comply with EAWR if I assemble an Ikea book case?

 

[westward10]

I'm not sure the analogy really applies, Bs7671 is so complex, how are you going to appropriate 'punishment' for departures....will the consequences of breaking the law by failure to apply a sticker carry the same penalty as failure to provide an adequate earthing system?
EICR's will be a legal minefield, I really believe those calling for 7671 to be law really haven't thought through the potential consequences.

Unless measures are put in place providing an earthing system is a legal requirement under the Electricity at Work Regulations 1989. Should you fail to do so and the worse happens you have no defence in a court of law as it is an Absolute Requirement.

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Unless measures are put in place providing an earthing system is a legal requirement under the Electricity at Work Regulations 1989. Should you fail to do so and the worse happens you have no defence in a court of law as it is an Absolute Requirement.

As would be failure to provide a mixed colour label. If a DIYer was electrocuted trying to put up a new light on the partial rewire you recently completed no doubt his lawyer will be making the case that your failure to apply a sticker (as now required by law) was the reason he was killed.
Like I said, those calling for 7671 to be statutory need to really think it through

 

[Octopus]

As would be failure to provide a mixed colour label. If a DIYer was electrocuted trying to put up a new light on the partial rewire you recently completed no doubt his lawyer will be making the case that your failure to apply a sticker (as now required by law) was the reason he was killed.
Like I said, those calling for 7671 to be statutory need to really think it through

Utter rubbish ...............

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Utter rubbish ...............

I think you may have taken the statement as it is currently law, what I was in fact meaning is that if those who want 7671 to be statutory then it will be law. I can see that wasn't clear in my post. If 7671 in it's entirety does become law then the above scenario will be highly likely.

 

[Intoelectrics]

With the 18th edition coming out, will this just mean more rules broken? Judging by the number of questions on this forum most electricians struggle with the 17th edition! I assume any installations wired under the 17th edition are now dangerous? Mmm better think about rewiring my stables. Only joking, you know me and the regs!

The 18th edition like the 17th and the 16th before that and so forth is about improvements. Its about gathering data, implementing the latest technology and making improvements to the "best practice" of electrical installation, remedial and repair works. Why is that so bad? some of it will seem really silly as it may contradict what was accepted in previous editions. But the underlining aim of any regulation is to ensure best practice is taken to reduce/minimize risks and conserve functionality. This does not mean that installations carried out in accordance with previous editions are unsafe. It just means that (in theory) future installs will be safer still.

In a court of law the regs though not mandatory, would be taken as such. You would have to explain & prove to the court a very good reason why any work you did was acceptable if it did not follow the regs. In other words you would have to prove that work completed was better practice than that advised by the regs.

 

[Intoelectrics]

Duplicate post

 

[Percyprod]

Mmm I suppose the thousands who have been taken to court for carrying out wiring which doesn't comply with the regs would agree with you. I would think a qualified electrician who made a mistake would be more likely to appear in court than some one who totally ignored the regs and made a complete balls up of an installation.

 

[Intoelectrics]

Mmm I suppose the thousands who have been taken to court for carrying out wiring which doesn't comply with the regs would agree with you. I would think a qualified electrician who made a mistake would be more likely to appear in court than some one who totally ignored the regs and made a complete balls up of an installation.

I suppose that depends on how successful the authorities are at holding the responsible parties accountable. the guy who holds his hands up and says "yep it was me i'm sorry, my bad" is an easy target. the cowboy installer maybe not so easy to track down.
life is not fair, when things go wrong the natural progression is to find somebody to blame, we are all guilty of this at some point.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

I blame the government.

 

[MDJ]

Mmm I suppose the thousands who have been taken to court for carrying out wiring which doesn't comply with the regs would agree with you. I would think a qualified electrician who made a mistake would be more likely to appear in court than some one who totally ignored the regs and made a complete balls up of an installation.

Name 20?

 

[Midwest]

Can list a couple that haven't complied with Building Regs, if I can be arsed. Think the problem lies with taking up a the case for a prosecution, or responsibility there of.

Perhaps they should come up with a fixed penalty scheme for failure to comply. If you get 12 points or more on your JIB card, you're suspended & have to go and take a retest.

 

[Percyprod]

My point was that I don't think any DIY spark has been taken to court, so of course I couldn't name ay

 

[Deleted member 26818]

My point was that I don't think any DIY spark has been taken to court, so of course I couldn't name ay

Sarcasm or irony?

 

[Percyprod]

Neither. Just stating a fact. No point having rules if they're not enforced. A professional electrician goes through all the hoops to work to them. If he makes a mistake he can be done for it, as he has registered the work. Some one doing the same unofficially gets away with it, as there is no record of it.