Age of those who can build a control panel and control a process

[Geordie Spark]

I designed and built a control panel for my Hornby model railway when I was about ten years old.

If I can find them maybe I should send the drawings to the UKRail bloke??? :angel_smile:

 

[PEG]

I designed and built a control panel for my Hornby model railway when I was about ten years old.

If I can find them maybe I should send the drawings to the UKRail bloke??? :angel_smile:

Yesterday morning,i was waiting for the missus,so logged on to pass the time,and ended up following yer mans' trail,she asked what i was absorbed in,just said there were two fellas who looked like they were up to duggery....don't know why,just a feeling...and he was one.

Come on later,and had missed the entire episode...

Oh well,move along...nothing to see here...:conehead:

 

[Patto]

for the last 14years i have worked for a company who own 5 big fuel stations, i started doing maintenance for them and really enjoyed the variety of the job, i eventually got given a van to be able to cover the full 5 sites and loved it, i did basic building plumbing and electrics, working with contractors was pretty good as i was able to gather a bit of info and skills along the way, i took a real interest in the electrical side though and decided to put myself through college on a night so over the last 3 years i completed the 2330 lv2-3 and also did the 2382 recently, its been hard though as ive tried to pursue a career in the electrical industry but at 34 its hard to get a start with very little practical experience..

on monday i was due to go for an interview with a newly started company mainly domestic work but i got a call from a company we used to use in my current job so i went for a chat, they want me to go work for them working with plc, motors and other areas, i have no experience in this and told them the same but there keen as they no me and my attitude to work there going to pair me up and train me so have taken me on as an electrical improver, im crapping myself moving away from my secure job but feel like this is something i cant pass up on.........

so hopefully if i ever need help you guys can be there as i feel this is were i fit not in the domestic business..


Craig

 

[Darkwood]

Several years of doing this with the correct training and your set for life as there's is a massive black hole of skilled industrial sparks with old retiring and no knew to fill in... crap yourself but it will reward you and not an opportunity to be passed... if it gets too hard then at least you had a go... house bashing is not really a money making market anymore and is very prone to the fluctuations of the housing market and economy..

 

[Patto]

my thoughts exactly, if it gets to hard ive tried and probably picked up a lot more information and skills along the way..

 

[Patto]

the guys i met with said the same, have people coming to the end of there working life so need to start new lads...

 

[edexlab]

After spending 12 years as an installation electrician mainly commercial/ industrial with a bit of housebashing thrown in I had a rethink about where I was going and looked at the electricians I'd met out of several hundred only about 6 could do even half of the things listed , this prompted me to head in the general direction Hv/ Controls/Maintenance as there will definitely be a huge gap in the market, mainly due to the courses and quality of teaching available and the fact that a lot of young lads leave college and think the learning is over!
I'm currently 41 can now wire control panels the practical side ie motors, inverters etc I have no problems with , and have basic understanding of control circuits , starting to learn a plc although its an inhouse system not used by anyone else, design basics........
Still a long way to go!!

 

[smiley125]

Long time lurker but saw this and signed up.

I'm 24 and started my apprenticeship straight from school, I work for a company where our prime area of work is the industrial sector.

I design control panels and their associated safety systems, program PLC's from the basic EASY relays, to the high end AB/ Schneider modular gear. I or one of our lads build the panels and then we install them.

But we have struggled to find anyone that we deem competent enough to supplement our team and feel that unless we train from apprentices (There have been 2 since me) we just cannot find anyone with the required skills.

Speaking from experience of the Apprenticeship scheme which taught me very well in cable calcs the regs ect which was more than enough to take in but we only did one half day on any sort of industrial/ motor control systems. we wired a brook DOL starter, theres no wonder nobody else knows what's going on apart from the well trained/ grandfather rights of the elder generation.

 

[shanky887614]

Long time lurker but saw this and signed up.

I'm 24 and started my apprenticeship straight from school, I work for a company where our prime area of work is the industrial sector.

I design control panels and their associated safety systems, program PLC's from the basic EASY relays, to the high end AB/ Schneider modular gear. I or one of our lads build the panels and then we install them.

But we have struggled to find anyone that we deem competent enough to supplement our team and feel that unless we train from apprentices (There have been 2 since me) we just cannot find anyone with the required skills.

Speaking from experience of the Apprenticeship scheme which taught me very well in cable calcs the regs ect which was more than enough to take in but we only did one half day on any sort of industrial/ motor control systems. we wired a brook DOL starter, theres no wonder nobody else knows what's going on apart from the well trained/ grandfather rights of the elder generation.

i have never wired a DOL starter only inverter driven, the minimum requirements are so low now

 

[edexlab]

I did a night course for 3 years and the instructors were always flummoxed when I said ok we've done motor theory, when do we learn to control one and even see one, they fished out a DOL for me to wire, saying "its not on the curriculum but here you go"
Just to shut me up,
This was the only course available locally , even further afield the industrial biased courses were day study only which pretty much rules out older trainees who are working.
Interestingly I've just come back from a job in Germany and employers there have to allow a worker time off with pay (subsidised by the government) if they want to retrain in engineering,medicine or other areas identified as having a skills deficit.
I can't help but think if we stopped messing around with all the stupid legislation which is supposed to bring us in line with the euro states that bogs this country down, we could be doing something practical like this!
Also had contact with an electrician (he ran the submain into our main db) who told me they pretty much all train to be Industrial sparks and domestic is a supplementary "add on" mainly regs etc as its not considered to be the main route for training unlike here!

 

[Darkwood]

Long time lurker but saw this and signed up.

I'm 24 and started my apprenticeship straight from school, I work for a company where our prime area of work is the industrial sector.

I design control panels and their associated safety systems, program PLC's from the basic EASY relays, to the high end AB/ Schneider modular gear. I or one of our lads build the panels and then we install them.

But we have struggled to find anyone that we deem competent enough to supplement our team and feel that unless we train from apprentices (There have been 2 since me) we just cannot find anyone with the required skills.

Speaking from experience of the Apprenticeship scheme which taught me very well in cable calcs the regs ect which was more than enough to take in but we only did one half day on any sort of industrial/ motor control systems. we wired a brook DOL starter, theres no wonder nobody else knows what's going on apart from the well trained/ grandfather rights of the elder generation.

welcome to the forum .... dumbed down education is the reason there is a massive black hole in the industrial sector .... and its the fallout of political point scoring to show high pass rates regardless of actual intellect.

 

[smiley125]

Definitely. The problem with it all was the syllabus we had to be taught to. I couldn't of asked for a better tutor but he was limited to the extras he could teach due to having to learn so much in so little time.

 

[D Skelton]

they fished out a DOL for me to wire, saying "its not on the curriculum but here you go"
Just to shut me up,

The first time we were introduced to DOLs in college I was curious as to what all the wires did. Straight away I was asking how it actually worked but was told something along the lines of "don't worry about it, you'll never need to know" lol

 

[ElectroChem]

So what level of control systems is the 'average' trainee exposed to in the UK? In five weeks, my entire class has an assessment and will have to wire up at the very least a latching contactor circuit. Anyone who can't do it perfectly is at great risk of having to repeat the subject at their own expense.

 

[Knobhead]

The first time we were introduced to DOLs in college I was curious as to what all the wires did. Straight away I was asking how it actually worked but was told something along the lines of "don't worry about it, you'll never need to know" lol

I’m just glad I didn’t need to worry about how the 1000’s of motors we had on plant worked. Such a weight off my mind.

 

[smiley125]

So what level of control systems is the 'average' trainee exposed to in the UK? In five weeks, my entire class has an assessment and will have to wire up at the very least a latching contactor circuit. Anyone who can't do it perfectly is at great risk of having to repeat the subject at their own expense.

The average house bashing apprentice learns next to nothing about control in their years at college..it's left to the employer to teach, but many of those don't know it either...

 

[shanky887614]

The average house bashing apprentice learns next to nothing about control in their years at college..it's left to the employer to teach, but many of those don't know it either...

i did the 2330 and didnt cover any controls, covered dol starters etc.

did a lot on different types of motors in the last year

 

[D Skelton]

I was very lucky to have a real genius of a tutor in my third year. He used to help me and another with extra curricular studies; motors, controls, protective measures, gennys, plcs, safety circuits, deeper science and principles. He didn't have to, but he gave up his own time just to give people a better understanding of things than was required by the course. I have a lot to thank him for!

You won't get that with electricskills4u or any other similarly named short course training provider!

 

[Knobhead]

I suppose I was lucky in that my brother became an apprentice industrial electrician when I was 8. By the time I was 10 he’d built me a board in the garage similar to the boards modern apprentices use. He’d stripped an old control panel out at work and they let him have the gear. This board had contactors, timers and so on.

H&S, what’s that? All of it was 240V control 13A plug and no RCD. If I got a belt it was my bloody fault! Yes, I was working on it live.

Both of us are retired, if we were still talking to each other we could set up a training centre.

 

[Engineer54]

The average house bashing apprentice learns next to nothing about control in their years at college..it's left to the employer to teach, but many of those don't know it either...

That's because the whole curriculum now seems to be based almost wholly on domestic and small commercial installations, which was definitely not the case when i was doing C&G courses, the installation 236 C&G being just one of them. Controls were part and parcel of the job so were covered in depth...

But then the company i did my training with had it's own in house trade training school so we got an across the board training both at the school and on the shop floor. A few of the tutors being ex electrical/mechanical foreman (or similar) that ended their working days before retiring, (some were actually retired too) teaching at the company school. ....Happy days!!