Elecsa: Government changes to our scheme authorisation.

[Spudnik]

Government changes to our scheme authorisation The following information will affect all contractors registered on our Part P competent persons scheme. In June 2012 the department for Communities and Local Government (CLG) introduced its new authorisation criteria for Certification Bodies licensed to operate Competent Person Schemes. The new criteria requires certification bodies to: 1. Become UKAS accredited for all of their schemes 2. Consider Risk Based Assessments (RBA) 3. Introduce a mandatory Insurance Backed Warranty (IBW) The authorisation criteria contains other requirements for certification bodies that must be met in full by June 2014. The good news is that ECA Certification is already UKAS accredited for its competent person schemes. We also know from this years satisfaction survey that you would be in favour of a risk based approach to assessment and we have already done a considerable amount of work for government to consider on how this proposal could be implemented. However, in reviewing the authorisation criteria to implement the mandatory Insurance Backed Warranty (IBW) we will have to change the way in which the current warranty provision operates. Instead of being able to offer a free provision for the discretion of your customers to purchase, we will have to introduce the system where a compulsory warranty is added to the cost of the job notification fee. We appreciate that this will mean some additional cost for you but it will also mean that we can remove some of the administrative and assessment burden placed on you as to how you currently need to demonstrate that you meet this scheme criteria. You will also be able to provide the additional peace of mind to your customers that all of your work is automatically covered by the warranty without them having to do anything. The introduction of the mandatory IBW will be towards the end of March 2013 and we will continue to keep you updated on progress to make sure you have plenty of notice about these changes. No other Part P related fees will be changing in 2013. If you have any questions about the mandatory IBW please contact us on 0333 321 8220 or email[email protected].

 

[Octopus]

What a load of bxllxcks

 

[sparkdog]

Yes,just seen mine.I wonder how much that will add to job notification.Not sure what that risk assessment thing means?

 

[pencilpusher]

Here we go again, more cash drained from the trade. F*&^ng Bo&&ox

 

[brucelee]

Hi I have just read my emails and this is one of them

so this means now tha the customers have to buy an insurancebacked warranty for the work as its now compulsory and that we will have to include the cost in all jobs another crock of ???? which adds more unecessarry cost to the customers and more hassle and cost for us

 

[Spudnik]

Ignoring the comments, from what i understand, the NICEIC have been doing this for a while.( i would appreciate confirmation).

All Elecsa are doing is falling in line with them.

 

[thekingiam]

lol so for an extra socket outside we now have to charge more for insurance? what is risk assesment rubish all about we already have to write a risk assesment for each job? how is the price of the insurance going to work, per notification? cost of job? type of job? yearly payment never mind how many jobs you do?
if the customer doesn't want these scam insurance deals we now have to pay for it!!!
I am fumming! it's not just the cost it is the fact that again we the electrians have to pay.

 

[SYKRAPS]

Ignoring the comments, from what i understand, the NICEIC have been doing this for a while.( i would appreciate confirmation).

All Elecsa are doing is falling in line with them.

NICEIC have an insurance backed warrenty I can confirm

It costs £1.50 per notification if I remember rightly.

 

[thekingiam]

so it says ibw will be in place for march 2013, does that mean i need to buy it before then? last time i looked i still have another years membership paid for a bit short notice? surely not a reasonable time frame?

 

[tony mc]

I think you will find that you as a contractor are going to pay for the customers warranty and this will be added to the job notification!

I will be very surprised if the NICEIC are supplying free warranties with all notified work but I am sure their is a NICEIC rep on this forum who can comment on this.

I wonder how much it will be as I for one will call it a day as its bad enough now with priceing never mind adding more to the estimate!

 

[thekingiam]

ok about 3 quid to notify not too bad then.

 

[SYKRAPS]

I think you will find that you as a contractor are going to pay for the customers warranty and this will be added to the job notification!

I will be very surprised if the NICEIC are supplying free warranties with all notified work but I am sure their is a NICEIC rep on this forum who can comment on this.


I wonder how much it will be as I for one will call it a day as its bad enough now with priceing never mind adding more to the estimate!

NICEIC charge

£1.50 for notification
£1.50 for insurance backed warranty
£0.50 for duplicate certificate

 

[Octopus]

So is this like the "competitive" market we have for gas and electricity - i.e. one where they all put their prices up and we the poor sparkies have no option but pay??

 

[valleybilly]

There is no metion in the gov investigations/consultations to include warranties in the new part p , this is just a ploy to increase fees by over 30% .

 

[Des 56]

The person to blame for allowing all this taking the p to continue

http://www.insure.com/imagesvr_ce/2605/blaming300.jpg

 

[Toonlad]

Dawn French ?? lol jk

 

[nikmet]

uk-Nanny state, customers didn't want them when they are optional, so they make them mandatory and us to pick up the cost!!

 

[GNES]

Do customers using a gas safe engineer receive insurance backed warranties?

 

[Richard Burns]

Elecsa have said that the additional cost for the compulsory warranty will be £1.50, added to the current notification it will therefore double the cost to us.
The risk based assessment only applies to other areas than Part P notifications.

Gets a bit silly sometimes, more and more cost for less and less work, great!

 

[Octopus]

Firstly there was PPI insurance and then the miss selling claims.... then Elecsa and HM Gov step in with compulsory insurance

Another mess in the making IMHO

 

[gdr7671]

Part P and all the rest of this registration lark has just priced professionals completely out of the domestic market. What happened to the approved contractor HEY. Approved; end of story. They will want you to confirm your bowl habits next. Big hand to Tony Blair, NICEIC, ECA, NAPIT and BSI who all jumped on a band wagon and ripped us off. Ironic when you think about it really. We are professionals and take our profession seriously. Why should i pay these rip off merchants to keep within a pathetic law. From tomorrow i am closing down all i have built up for 32 years. I have truly had enough of government interference. Let the eastern Europeans deal with it. But i suppose it will be cash in hand no doubt. I wish you all on here a good future; i truly wish you luck. Best wishes GDR7671

 

[sima24]

I had my elecsa part p assessmemt yesterday, wasnt told anything about this!!! Was just told to offer one to customers ( to be fair to him he did tell me they were a load of crap). Testers, calibration, elecsa fees, van insurance, liability insurance, notification fees! May as well work illegaly cash in hand with no insurance as a court fine would be cheaper than paying all this

 

[sparkdog]

Well,at least you get a van sticker with both NICEIC and ELECSA on it.Mine just arrived.

 

[Clink]

Had my ELECSA assessment on Monday and was informed by my guy of the changes to the warranty arrangements comming up. I know it's another gripe but this cost will be a small part of any overall job cost and isn't going to break the bank. I'll just use it as a plus when explaining to customers rather than trying to flog them another 'extended warranty' product separately which was no benefit to me.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

How long are these warranties going to be for?
What warrenty do customers get at present if they don't opt to purchase the insuranced backed warrenty?
What do the insurance backed warrenties cover, that would not be covered as standard, or by the tradesman's Public Liability Insurance?

If I were a customer, I would expect the work to comply with current Regulations, and for everything to work correctly for at least a year.
If you then consider the life expectancy of cables and accessories, and the fact that guidance indicates that domestic installations should be inspected every 10 years, it would not be unreasonable for a customer to expect that everything should work correctly for at least the 10 years or even for as long as the life expecancy of the cables or accessories.

As a customer, I would not expect to have to purchase a warrenty to cover what should be provided as standard.

 

[Octopus]

I still think this "compulsory" insurance is a bit like PPI - let the misselling claims begin

 

[Clink]

How long are these warranties going to be for? 6years
What warrenty do customers get at present if they don't opt to purchase the insuranced backed warrenty? Bugger All
What do the insurance backed warrenties cover, that would not be covered as standard, or by the tradesman's Public Liability Insurance? Cost of rectification for non-compliant notifiable work.

If I were a customer, I would expect the work to comply with current Regulations, and for everything to work correctly for at least a year.
If you then consider the life expectancy of cables and accessories, and the fact that guidance indicates that domestic installations should be inspected every 10 years, it would not be unreasonable for a customer to expect that everything should work correctly for at least the 10 years or even for as long as the life expecancy of the cables or accessories.

As a customer, I would not expect to have to purchase a warrenty to cover what should be provided as standard.

Tell that to Currys

 

[Octopus]

Tell that to Currys

??????

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Tell that to Currys

I would, but they appear to be closed.
It does seem a bit wierd that you should purchase insurance against non-compliant work from the person who is going to conduct the work.
A bit like purchasing car theft insurance from a car thief.

 

[Steve_P]

I spoke to an Elecsa assessor a while ago and he told me that the insurance that we had to let the customer know about had something like a 1% take up. I've since switched to NIC who add £1.50 to the cost of notification for this. So instead of just telling the customer "there's insurance if you want it" I now add a couple of quid extra to notify. Not really much of an issue just a load more useless red tape and cost to deal with.

 

[Dave 85]

I had a chat about the existing warranty system with the elecsa man the other day. He told me that of 70 000 jobs registered in 2011 only 12 warranties were sold which essentially renders the whole thing pointless, which is what I thought from the start.
The warranty is essentially there so that if a contracter has gone through someones house and cut a 6inch hole through every joist, as you do, and then they all snap simaltaneously and the walls cave in, as they do, and the contracter has folded his firm so there is no longer a public liabily insurance policy for the client to claim on, then they can apparently use the elecsa warranty to cover the cost of building a new house.
If however the contracter has done a rough old wiring job and the house burns down, the client is apparently not covered by the warranty!!!?????
This is how he explained it to me anyway.
So from what I gather the warranty is only there to protect them from the house falling down due to non electrical work carried out by the electrician and only if the firm has previously gone bust.

Its all a load of nonsense if you ask me, I dont see why they dont just scrap the whole scheme.