In defence of the short course trainee

[richy3333]

I don't necessary disagree with you Eng54, but forum members constantly banging on about it here and it does no good to anyone with all this negativity.

I saw a 2 year old CU fitted by a 'competitor' last week. This chaps got 40 years experience 'man and boy'. The board is not to 17th Ed, heck the board wasn't even new when he fitted it as its populated with parts from 3 differant manufacturers. It was barely held onto the wall and had cover fixing screws missing. No labelling and no certificate. He certainly wasn't a Electrical Trainee. Transpires he still hasn't done his 17th update and isn't with a scheme provider etc. No one's checking his work except me when I get to rectify the faults.

So there's good and bad in all aspects of the industry?

To end on a positive note - at least some of these Electrical Trainee are asking questions on here rather than just blindly undertaking work (yes I know there are others that don't and I also appreciate they might not be of a sufficient standard to do the work they are asking about, but at least they are asking).

 

[mechelec]

Experience comes with time that is why apprenticeships were 4 or 5 years. If the industry thought it could train competant electricians in 5 weeks and send them out on their own making the company money, dont you think they would have done????
Companies spend thousands training appreticies and lose valuable time when they are at college. if it could be done in 5 weeks they would do it it is common sense. IT CANT BE DONE. industry knows it, experienced electricians know it, the part p assesors must know it but pass them anyway (money) and the poor suckers who spend thousands only to end up on here asking basic questions must quickly realise it to.
Part P has given the cowboys and chancers a way to look legitimate in a minimum amount of time. Joe public, well the few who know about part P look to these people and trust them as they are part of a scheme.
If only they knew the questions these Electrical Trainee have to ask on here it makes me shudder to think of the quality and safety of some of the work.

 

[Engineer54]

I don't necessary disagree with you Eng54, but forum members constantly banging on about it here and it does no good to anyone with all this negativity.

I saw a 2 year old CU fitted by a 'competitor' last week. This chaps got 40 years experience 'man and boy'. The board is not to 17th Ed, heck the board wasn't even new when he fitted it as its populated with parts from 3 differant manufacturers. It was barely held onto the wall and had cover fixing screws missing. No labelling and no certificate. He certainly wasn't a Electrical Trainee. Transpires he still hasn't done his 17th update and isn't with a scheme provider etc. No one's checking his work except me when I get to rectify the faults.

So there's good and bad in all aspects of the industry?

To end on a positive note - at least some of these Electrical Trainee are asking questions on here rather than just blindly undertaking work (yes I know there are others that don't and I also appreciate they might not be of a sufficient standard to do the work they are asking about, but at least they are asking).

What don't you agree with ??

 

[imago]

So there's good and bad in all aspects of the industry?

It's always been that way I'm afraid, and no amount of schemes, governing bodies, regulation or assessments wil cure the problem completely. It could be massively improved with rigorous enforcement of the regulations and standards, along with properly structured training for those new to the trades. Unfortunately everyone from the governing bodies, through training providers, right up to the government departments responsible are only interested in numbers and revenue.

 

[Knobhead]

See if you can get a local part peer to work with,just to get some experience lol

You will learn about not exporting pme,rod depths.Unusually high Zs on TT systems,earthing plastic water pipes and how to condemn fuse boards as well
After a few weeks any faults you come across,you can post them up on here

I’d rather put my fingers in a food mincer.

But having said that if I was still working I would love to have an apprentice with me. I’ve spent hours going through faults with a lad / laddet and enjoyed every minute of it. One of the most inquisitive was a girl, she wanted answers there and then!

 

[Engineer54]

I’d rather put my fingers in a food mincer.

But having said that if I was still working I would love to have an apprentice with me. I’ve spent hours going through faults with a lad / laddet and enjoyed every minute of it. One of the most inquisitive was a girl, she wanted answers there and then!

Don't they ALL!! lol!!!

 

[Specialist]

Experience comes with time that is why apprenticeships were 4 or 5 years. If the industry thought it could train competant electricians in 5 weeks and send them out on their own making the company money, dont you think they would have done????
Companies spend thousands training appreticies and lose valuable time when they are at college. if it could be done in 5 weeks they would do it it is common sense. IT CANT BE DONE. industry knows it, experienced electricians know it, the part p assesors must know it but pass them anyway (money) and the poor suckers who spend thousands only to end up on here asking basic questions must quickly realise it to.
Part P has given the cowboys and chancers a way to look legitimate in a minimum amount of time. Joe public, well the few who know about part P look to these people and trust them as they are part of a scheme.
If only they knew the questions these Electrical Trainee have to ask on here it makes me shudder to think of the quality and safety of some of the work.

:hurray: Totally agree with you, but as has been said: there are an awful lot of supposedly Skilled & Qualifed sparks out there doing Diabolical work as well. They're all Degrading the Industry & it's skills not Just the Electrical Trainee.

 

[malcolmsanford]

Imago my man that is the nail well and truly hit.

In my mind these courses are for you guys that have had training, experience in the industry but want to change tact and do another area, you have the under pinning knowledge to be able to use what you learn, interpret it and use the new skills to augment your existing, and good on you for that.

My last real course I did was my PV course, now to be honest I learnt very little, in fact nothing electrically, but did learn roofing skills and such that i never had, but because of my electrical training the electrical side was easy and it augmented my existing skills.

I don't care if your a doctor, baker shoe maker or candle stick maker, you will never ever, be electrically competent in 5 weeks, 10 weeks or however long it is, if you do not understand why things happen, why if you get this, what gets you this and if you don''t get this what do I do next, to make sure it is safe.

For Electrical Trainee course achievers read " A little knowledge is dangerous" , they are sold a dream of qualifying into an industry that basically is now in it's death throes, because governments, companies, Trade schemes et al have undersold us, they have treated the industry with contempt and now decided it is time to kill it off completely by making the public believe that anyone with 5 weeks training can be competent in it.

I'm sorry if this upsets forum members, I think my record shows i'm not an argumentative person or someone that is aloof , but I have worked for many years in this industry, I have loved my work and it's like seeing a member of my family being striped of it's dignity and being killed off slowly, by organisations that just don't give a dam.

 

[Octopus]

What is amazing is that the 5 week courses don't include any "coal face" experience at all.

At the very least C & G should add a minimum period of hands on work to be mandatory with their qualifications, and the Part P providers should insist on this too.

 

[JD6400]

I have in the past semi defended the Electrical Trainee posters that have taken a good slating for asking a question , we all need to learn somewhere , but i do still feel exactly like you Malcolm .
Perfectly said !