What am I allowed to do in Scotland?

[Mike Johnson]

I would never describe myself as a qualified anything when the so call qualifications are not recognised by the Regulating authority i.e. the UK Government in a statute, all of the available so called qualifications are from made up organisations that purport to be either a training organisation or publish (miss leading) document saying they are Regulations when in fact they are just their interpretation of a BS and published by the IEE as "Regulations" the IEE document goes a long way toward this, but has not been adopted into statute and issued by the Secretary of State and therefore are not UK Regulations. The electrical industry needs a UK Government recognised body (institute or Association) and sanctioned training organisation that "want to be electricians" can join/attend and become members of with examinations (not multi choice) which prove they have the required skills and not just sat in a class room and had a BS read to them, certainly if electricians wish to be accepted as professionals within the construction industry this will need to change. The problem existing electricians have is they are so many that to implement and obtain that change will be almost impossible, but only almost, new and budding electricians could be the new breed or professionals that the industry is crying out for, never know may be able to charge a living wage or dare I say fee for their work as a percentage of the overall value of a contract, or am I being too ambitious.

 

[Jock from the north]

Certainly I would never describe myself as a fully qualified anything when the so call qualifications are not recognised by the Regulating authority i.e. the UK Government in a statute, all of the available so called qualifications are from made up organisations that purport to be either a training organisation or publish (miss leading) document saying they are Regulations when in fact they are just their interpretation of a BS and published by the IEE as "Regulations" the IEE document goes a long way toward this, but has not been adopted into statute and issued by the Secretary of State and therefore are not UK Regulations. The electrical industry needs a UK Government recognised body (institute or Association) and sanctioned training organisation that "want to be electricians" can join/attend and become members of with examinations (not multi choice) which prove they have the required skills and not just sat in a class room and had a BS read to them, certainly if electricians wish to be accepted as professionals within the construction industry this will need to change.

Probably never going to happen when there's to much money to be made from schemes like napit etc.scotland has the sqa which describes itself as a non departmental body that reports directly to the scottish government.

 

[megaohm]

I'm looking to remove the shaver socket in our bathroom because it's never been used, but apparently this might be "notifiable" or "certifiable" under updated regs as it's "altering" a circuit in the bathroom.

A google led me to Part P but this doesn't apply in Scotland. So...searching and trying to navigate the Scottish building regs is a total mess, going round in circles. It's like someone has taken Part P and re-written it into 80 pages. I'm reading stuff about competent person is no longer applicable and now has to be done by a "qualified" person but they don't specify what qualified actually means. I've been out of the industry for about 30 years but I have a degree is in EEE. I'm sure that I'm competent enough to remove the socket and make it safe - but am I qualified?

Surely I don't need to pay a spark to do this and certify it? Can anyone clarify?

Back to the original question...

Its a slight simplification but in scotland if the work is on a bungalow or 2 story house then almost nothing is notifiable, whereas in a flat or 3 story house almost everything is notifiable. If the OP is in a normal house then the work is not notifiable.

 

[Jock from the north]

I would never describe myself as a qualified anything when the so call qualifications are not recognised by the Regulating authority i.e. the UK Government in a statute, all of the available so called qualifications are from made up organisations that purport to be either a training organisation or publish (miss leading) document saying they are Regulations when in fact they are just their interpretation of a BS and published by the IEE as "Regulations" the IEE document goes a long way toward this, but has not been adopted into statute and issued by the Secretary of State and therefore are not UK Regulations. The electrical industry needs a UK Government recognised body (institute or Association) and sanctioned training organisation that "want to be electricians" can join/attend and become members of with examinations (not multi choice) which prove they have the required skills and not just sat in a class room and had a BS read to them, certainly if electricians wish to be accepted as professionals within the construction industry this will need to change. The problem existing electricians have is they are so many that to implement and obtain that change will be almost impossible, but only almost, new and budding electricians could be the new breed or professionals that the industry is crying out for, never know may be able to charge a living wage or dare I say fee for their work as a percentage of the overall value of a contract, or am I being too ambitious.

I'm not certain myself but if for instance an experienced electrician who had kept up all relevent training who found themselves in a uk court on manslughter charges due to some incident in there work place then a judge or prosecutor might very well refer to them as a qualified electrician .I'm no expert on law but I believe common law can make decisions through former judicial decisions rather than statutes .the prosecutor might make it his/her buissness to persuade the judge and jury that the person is qualified due to all there extensive training ,even if it was delivered via a recognised body [and not a uk Government body]which I believe select in Scotland are [there very cosy with the snp]then when your in jail awaiting appeal you can call yourself a qualified electrician. Most of this I gleamed from the Internet but not all.ive been on jury duty on an armed robbery case lasting 2 weeks and I've seen the way the defence and Lord advocate operate

I would never describe myself as a qualified anything when the so call qualifications are not recognised by the Regulating authority i.e. the UK Government in a statute, all of the available so called qualifications are from made up organisations that purport to be either a training organisation or publish (miss leading) document saying they are Regulations when in fact they are just their interpretation of a BS and published by the IEE as "Regulations" the IEE document goes a long way toward this, but has not been adopted into statute and issued by the Secretary of State and therefore are not UK Regulations. The electrical industry needs a UK Government recognised body (institute or Association) and sanctioned training organisation that "want to be electricians" can join/attend and become members of with examinations (not multi choice) which prove they have the required skills and not just sat in a class room and had a BS read to them, certainly if electricians wish to be accepted as professionals within the construction industry this will need to change. The problem existing electricians have is they are so many that to implement and obtain that change will be almost impossible, but only almost, new and budding electricians could be the new breed or professionals that the industry is crying out for, never know may be able to charge a living wage or dare I say fee for their work as a percentage of the overall value of a contract, or am I being too ambitious.

 

[Mike Johnson]

I have worked with the insurance Ombudsman as an expert witness for both the defence and prosecution on cases involving the death of an individual, during cross examination (after briefing the barrister) I have answered the question that only the BS is within the statute and that if any installation/work conformed with that BS or indeed exceeded the requirement of it then it is within the law, it is then up to the bench to decide if there is a case to answer.

 

[Mike Johnson]

I'm not certain myself but if for instance an experienced electrician who had kept up all relevent training who found themselves in a uk court on manslughter charges due to some incident in there work place then a judge or prosecutor might very well refer to them as a qualified electrician .

The problem is relevant training by whom? A judge would never call anyone Qualified they would ask any one standing on the witness rostrum what qualifications they had this would be open for the prosecution or defence to refute as not recognised by an authority or statute, the judge can only decide that someone with a degree in the discipline involved in the case carries more weight than someone that has attended a course by a spurious training organisation that has given a certificate saying they are trained in BSxxxx.

 

[Jock from the north]

I have worked with the insurance Ombudsman as an expert witness for both the defence and prosecution on cases involving the death of an individual, during cross examination (after briefing the barrister) I have answered the question that only the BS is within the statute and that if any installation/work conformed with that BS or indeed exceeded the requirement of it then it is within the law, it is then up to the bench to decide if there is a case to answer.

I gathered from your posts and threads etc you have great expertise within the industry.thats terrible the death of an individual wheather work related or otherwise .I realise this is a public forum so will not attempt to ask you regarding the cases .I did attend an niceic road show a few years back when they went into some detail of 2 fatal incidents in England where simple measures could have prevented it .they even said a piece of insulation tape over mcb saying "do not switch on" would have meant the guy would have went home at night .I think what they were referring to is when it comes to the death of an individual even though tape of course is in no means a way of safe isolation in this particular case it could and probably would have saved the man's life . I feel I need to add that in no way am I advocating the use of insulating tape as a method of safe isolation.

 

[westward10]

I think this record has been played before.

 

[Mike Johnson]

I think this record has been played before.

Indeed It has, but not as often as posters on here claiming to be a "fully qualified electrician"

 

[Jock from the north]

I think this record has been played before.

Speaking about records I was and still am a big jam fan .

 

[Mike Johnson]

Marmalade for me, lady mostly, gitchy gitchy la la.