Full rewire needed in new home...eeeek!

[AnnabelleAW]

Hello,

Just bought a new home, kind of knowing the electrics would need updating, got an electrician out to do a few bits and bobs and he said the house basically needs a full rewire as soon as possible - eek! Thank god we haven't done any decorating yet! Its all come as a bit of a shock and we're first time buyers so have done some googling but thought this might be a good place to get some advice?

It's a four bed house built in 1960s, has old consumer unit with those wires wrapped round (never seen one of those in my life before this week!), and from bits and bobs we've done around the house we're not seeing much evidence of new wiring with grey pvc stuff.

From a bit of googling I'm getting the impression this is a £5-6k job, which will take about 10 days, and it would be best for us to move out during the time to let the electricians work. I'm also anticipating that this will involve a lot of bringing up floors and bashing through walls and ceilings...?

So my questions are:

House has had new kitchen and bathroom in last 5-10 years, am I being gullible to hope that these rooms might have already been rewired?

What's the best way of finding a good electrician who can get this sorted for us? We live in Paisley in Scotland.

Is there anything else I really need to think about?

 

[ChrisElectrical88]

Got a Electrical Installation Condition Report done before jumping straight in, will cost £120-£150ish. This will tell you exactly what is needed. If rooms have been refitted recently then the report will more than likely save you more than it costs to have carried out. Have this done by someone independent who didn't tell you it needed rewiring.

 

[westward10]

If you are going for a rewire do it 100%.

 

[ChrisElectrical88]

Find an NICEIC Electrician or a Renewables Contractor - https://www.niceic.com/find-a-contractor/find-contractors

 

[telectrix]

that price looks about right, but get a couple more quotes, not necessarily going for the cheapest. ask friends and family if they can recommend anyone. leaving the house empty with little furniture in saves a lot of time and should reflect in the price quoted. make sure you discuss the project fully with the electricain/s you employ and be available to discuss any changes or recommendations.

 

[westward10]

If the wiring predates pvc I would suggest a Condition Report is a waste of money. Some is likely to be pvc but if the property is empty pull the lot out and start again to your own specifications.

 

[Octopus]

What did the survey on the property say about the electrics?

1960's house or earlier is always going to be tricky unless you get a proper electrical condition report done prior to purchase....

 

[AnnabelleAW]

In Scotland so it was just the home report - but basically said nothing at all - it was marked as a 1 on the home report with some waffle that wasn't even accurate. Sorry not a helpful response!

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Agree with post #6. If this is intended to be your home start with a clean slate and points where you want them, not where they are now. I'd always advise finding a long established local company if possible. These guys rely on reputation, word soon gets around if the service is poor.
New kitchens can be very hard to rewire without disturbance and damage. It's worth a bit of investigation to see if the new kitchen involved properly installed electrics which can be re-used, but all to often I'm afraid new kitchens hide a can of electrical worms waiting to be opened.

 

[Midwest]

Moving yourself and furniture out, should be reflected in the quotation, and shorten the process. It will also save any accidental damage to your furniture. If you intend to save/reuse you existing kitchen units and bathroom flooring, it may easier & cheaper to have the kitchen ceiling replaced/plastered, the same for the ceiling below the bathroom. In fact, if you have any fixed flooring (tiled/laminate etc), you may wish to consider that as a general option.

Building regulations are different to England & Wales, where most members like me are commenting from, so ensure you have the appropriate building warrants, electricians etc. This may be of some help;

Building Regulations in Scotland - http://www.electricalsafetyfirst.org.uk/guides-and-advice/building-regulations/scotland/

Good luck, and I admire your decision to rewire etc, most people who come on here for advice, are more interested in spending money on flashy kitchens, bathrooms or floor coverings

 

[AnnabelleAW]

Thank you everyone!

The kitchen and bathroom are both quite new and we can't really afford to replace them - I'd factored in that we'd need to replaster/redecorate rooms and that there might be damage to floors (most rooms have original solid wood floor) but hadn't really factored in new kitchen/bathroom costs too, so the ceiling suggestion is a useful one @Midwest. Because they both have new spotlights in the ceiling I was hoping they'd both been rewired to a good enough standard.

I just wish it was two weeks ago and the house was still empty....I think we can move out and there's enough room to move things around a bit to make it easier, but there's no chance in hell we can empty the property totally

Much as I'd love snazzy new kitchen and bathroom, I'm currently more concerned about burning to death in my nice new house....

 

[telectrix]

there's one or two members in the Glasgow area. maybe one of them could give you a quote.

 

[Midwest]

Thank you everyone!

The kitchen and bathroom are both quite new and we can't really afford to replace them - I'd factored in that we'd need to replaster/redecorate rooms and that there might be damage to floors (most rooms have original solid wood floor) but hadn't really factored in new kitchen/bathroom costs too, so the ceiling suggestion is a useful one @Midwest. Because they both have new spotlights in the ceiling I was hoping they'd both been rewired to a good enough standard.

I just wish it was two weeks ago and the house was still empty....I think we can move out and there's enough room to move things around a bit to make it easier, but there's no chance in hell we can empty the property totally

Much as I'd love snazzy new kitchen and bathroom, I'm currently more concerned about burning to death in my nice new house....

Just think of the dust & microwaved takeaways, go visit Mum for a week, she'll spoil you rotten.

 

[telectrix]

Thank you everyone!

The kitchen and bathroom are both quite new and we can't really afford to replace them - I'd factored in that we'd need to replaster/redecorate rooms and that there might be damage to floors (most rooms have original solid wood floor) but hadn't really factored in new kitchen/bathroom costs too, so the ceiling suggestion is a useful one @Midwest. Because they both have new spotlights in the ceiling I was hoping they'd both been rewired to a good enough standard.

I just wish it was two weeks ago and the house was still empty....I think we can move out and there's enough room to move things around a bit to make it easier, but there's no chance in hell we can empty the property totally

Much as I'd love snazzy new kitchen and bathroom, I'm currently more concerned about burning to death in my nice new house....

if the electrics in the kitchen and bathroom prove to be sound on inspection by your electrician, they can be incorporated into a rewire of the rest of the house.

 

[Octopus]

In Scotland so it was just the home report - but basically said nothing at all - it was marked as a 1 on the home report with some waffle that wasn't even accurate. Sorry not a helpful response!

Firstly thank you for responding - so many people don't bother / don't think they need to.

For the benefit of ANYONE viewing this thread at a later date, if you are in the process of buying a 1960's or earlier house, getting a friendly spark to do some form of inspection is highly recommended - not because said Spark wants to earn a few bob, more to determine if said property may need a rewire .... and thus the buyer needs to factor this into their offer....

Other "signs" are extensions done at different times...

 

[AnnabelleAW]

OK - so I've messaged the two members of the forum that work in the area and put the feelers out with some friends/family. Here's hoping I can get this mess sorted out sooner rather than later. Thanks again everyone for your help - any other nuggets of wisdom always welcome.

 

[telectrix]

OK - so I've messaged the two members of the forum that work in the area and put the feelers out with some friends/family. Here's hoping I can get this mess sorted out sooner rather than later. Thanks again everyone for your help - any other nuggets of wisdom always welcome.

don't eat yellow snow.

 

[The Ghost]

At the initial stage of purchase there are usually "raising enquiries" by your solicitor. It should have asked if any electrics (among other things) have been done. If the kitchen and bathroom were honestly answered (i.e. yes) then the enquiry would also ask for all building certificates especially gas and electrical work certificates to be forwarded. You should have copies of this in your purchase pack if the sale/purchase has been properly done otherwise enquire of the agents who handled your sale. You can also enquire of your local building control to search work done and recorded certificates. If a new circuit has been put into the Kitchen and bathroom it should have a notice at your "fuse board" telling you when it is to be inspected. Which in turn would date the installations. In the absence of such proper procedures and evidence it does not bode well

 

[The Ghost]

Signs to look for in employing the right contractor.
A complaints procedure
Health and safety policy.
A properly written contract detailing the work and timescales and cost.
Properly written quote detailing labour and equipment properly broken down so you know exactly what you are paying for.
Membership of a competent person scheme.
Proper liability insurance.
Contract should stipulate what the contractor will and will not do.
i.e. replaster or not?
Carpets (may not count in your case) whether you should employ your own carpet layer etc.
Making good.
Removal of waste, there will be a lot.
What happens in the event of problems/disputes and who is suggested for alternate resolution. i.e. with trading standards approved status they undertake to resolve disputes. Initially your complaints should go to the contractor.
Someone who invoices for work after it has been completed and to your satisfaction not asking for money up front apart from a reasonable deposit (25%)
Considerate as to times that suit you for work agreed in advance.
Something very close to that anyway

 

[Gazthesparky]

Hello,

Just bought a new home, kind of knowing the electrics would need updating, got an electrician out to do a few bits and bobs and he said the house basically needs a full rewire as soon as possible - eek! Thank god we haven't done any decorating yet! Its all come as a bit of a shock and we're first time buyers so have done some googling but thought this might be a good place to get some advice?

It's a four bed house built in 1960s, has old consumer unit with those wires wrapped round (never seen one of those in my life before this week!), and from bits and bobs we've done around the house we're not seeing much evidence of new wiring with grey pvc stuff.

From a bit of googling I'm getting the impression this is a £5-6k job, which will take about 10 days, and it would be best for us to move out during the time to let the electricians work. I'm also anticipating that this will involve a lot of bringing up floors and bashing through walls and ceilings...?

So my questions are:

House has had new kitchen and bathroom in last 5-10 years, am I being gullible to hope that these rooms might have already been rewired?

What's the best way of finding a good electrician who can get this sorted for us? We live in Paisley in Scotland.

Is there anything else I really need to think about?

Hi Annabelle

We are glasgow based if you would like us to come out to have a look and provide a quotation should the property need rewiring .

If you would like us to come and have a look please drop me a message

Regards
Garreth

Udell Electrical Services

 

[Gazthesparky]

Hello,

Just bought a new home, kind of knowing the electrics would need updating, got an electrician out to do a few bits and bobs and he said the house basically needs a full rewire as soon as possible - eek! Thank god we haven't done any decorating yet! Its all come as a bit of a shock and we're first time buyers so have done some googling but thought this might be a good place to get some advice?

It's a four bed house built in 1960s, has old consumer unit with those wires wrapped round (never seen one of those in my life before this week!), and from bits and bobs we've done around the house we're not seeing much evidence of new wiring with grey pvc stuff.

From a bit of googling I'm getting the impression this is a £5-6k job, which will take about 10 days, and it would be best for us to move out during the time to let the electricians work. I'm also anticipating that this will involve a lot of bringing up floors and bashing through walls and ceilings...?

So my questions are:

House has had new kitchen and bathroom in last 5-10 years, am I being gullible to hope that these rooms might have already been rewired?

What's the best way of finding a good electrician who can get this sorted for us? We live in Paisley in Scotland.

Is there anything else I really need to think about?

Hi Annabelle

We are glasgow based if you would like us to come out to have a look and provide a quotation should the property need rewiring .

If you would like us to come and have a look please drop me a message

Regards
Garreth

Udell Electrical Services

 

[Jurassic Sparks]

I amazes me, that the most expensive purchase you make in life, is one upon which people will not pay out for a full structural survey
even though I have worked in the trade for three million years, when we looked to move to this house 20 years ago, I paid for a full survey
think it cost 1200 all in
report said
wiring dodgy and full of DIY work ( it had been split into bed sits )
C/H boiler U/S and need replacement
All sanitary ware needs replacing ( cracked due to frost damage whilst empty for so long)
Joists in 2 rooms rotten and needing repair
but the biggie
toilet installed by a bodger in the old kitchen cupboard,no sink, only one door between it and the kitchen ( building regs say 2 )
and the connection to the drain in the garage had been done by smashing the old ceramic pipe, and placing polythene bags and soil around it then back-filling

boiler and electrics we knew about

drainage cost something like 4 thousand pounds to dig the outside of the house up and replace it all with new, and fit new hoppers and a connection for a sink in the downstairs toilet
we got that off the price of the house, and half of the rest off the price
even with my poor maths thats money saved
always buy subject to survey
if they wont sell like that somethings badly wrong

if you buy a house with shared drains, common in Victorian terraced, you could be liable for a percentage of the drain under each house

if you buy a house next to an old church or chapel
get a survey to check that there are no Chancel repairs listed against it
( you could be liable for tens of thousands of pounds )

 

[AnnabelleAW]

Update: Got a few electricians round and now I have a good number of quotes in for the rewire, so definitely going to bite the bullet and just get it all done.

I do just have one more question that I was wondering if you guys could help with - we obviously want everything done 'by the book', compliant with whatever it needs to be compliant with and certificated properly.....

We've got a quote from a company who's NIC EIC registration has expired/ended - but they are telling that it would still be certified. I think I might be a bit confused about what it all means.

I thought I read something about it needing to be done by an NICEIC approved installer or it would need to be certified by a third party or something...or not compliant with building regs. Feeling like I've got myself a bit muddled, can someone who knows the rules in Scotland help me out?

 

[Jurassic Sparks]

if their registration has expired, check with the Niceic first
they might have been booted out !

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

If the NICEIC registration has lapsed then i am not sure how they are going to notify the job and issue the building regs certificate afterwards?
They may well rejoin or be joining another scheme... likwise they could have been kicked out for poor work?
If in doubt ring the niceic up and ask for clarification over the companies status... better safe than sorry.
It doesn't have to be a NICEIC company there are other schemes such as Elecsa, Stroma , Napit and one or two more obscure ones. but whoever they are with ring up the body and check and also verify the insurance certificate by asking for a copy and ringing the insurance firm who will happily verify it is authentic and the level of cover.
Another tip is do not pay all upfront for the work and some may disagree with me but hold some back until the end... when i do a rewire i take the money for materials and then take 1/3 on first fix/ the remainder minus 10% on 2nd fix and certification. the final 10% is when the paperwork comes through. only done this 4 times but it works for both parties and not had an issue with it yet.

 

[Octopus]

Remember the op is in Scotland so they have different regs and no part p

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

Remember the op is in Scotland so they have different regs and no part p

My mistake. They have that warrant thing which is like buiding regs i think up there...????

 

[Midwest]

OP as has been pointed, requirements for building regs are different in Scotland. There are Scottish members here, who may be along to give the relevant advice. Having seen similar discussions before, a warrant for a domestic rewire (house), was dependant on the property not having a storey above 4.5m (flat warrant required) + (with other caveats), I think!

It is the persons ordering the work responsibility, to ensure whether a warrant is needed or not. I would strongly suggests you contact your local building control, and seek guidance from them.

 

[AnnabelleAW]

OP as has been pointed, requirements for building regs are different in Scotland. There are Scottish members here, who may be along to give the relevant advice. Having seen similar discussions before, a warrant for a domestic rewire (house), was dependant on the property not having a storey above 4.5m (flat warrant required) + (with other caveats), I think!

It is the persons ordering the work responsibility, to ensure whether a warrant is needed or not. I would strongly suggests you contact your local building control, and seek guidance from them.

Thanks for that @Midwest, and sorry I'm not trying to be annoying here - I understand its my responsibility and I know that rewires do not require a building warrant in Scotland (or at least not in my case as in detached house). The bit I don't understand is whether some sort of certification is still required etc, and even if not technically required, presumably some sort of accreditation/approval by something like NICEIC or the like would still be better. I'm embarrassed to say having trailed all the building reg, NICEIC, local authority, Scottish Government websites etc I still don't quite understand the difference between what is required and what is desirable in the case of a rewire.

 

[Midwest]

I would recommend you contact your local building control, for advice on this matter. You should receive an Electrical Installation Certificate, as part of the works. As regards accreditation in Scotland, I wouldn't want to offer advice, in an area I have no experience. Give your building control a ring, I'm sure they would be only to happy to advise.

 

[polo1]

OP, unless you are in a flat Building Warrant is not required. However the Co doing the work should issue an Electrical Installation Certificate upon completion of the work. The two trade bodies in Scotland are the NICEIC and SELECT. A company doing electrical work does not require to be registered with either, but by choosing a company that is, you can be assured that they have the necessary PL insurance in place.
TBH you cannot beat personal recommendation of a company for work like this. As has been stated earlier, get a written quote ( not estimate) which details all info i.e. number of sockets in each room, dedicated circuits e.g. for an electric shower and type of accessories e.g. White plastic, chrome etc. Also lighting - is it down lights or single pendants, the former will cost more.
We are Glasgow based, but too busy to offer anything but advice at the moment. But keep asking questions on here till you have all the answers you need.

 

[Hellmooth]

Same as what Polo has said, I recently left the NICEIC because it costs too much money for what I get out of it, I can do a re wire without notifying, as long as all certs are done then no issues there. I would also give a quote but booked past September. Hope all goes well and keep in touch let us know how it goes!

 

[AnnabelleAW]

Well.... the rewire has been quite the journey! Currently out of the house and hoping that tomorrow will be the last day of the job.

I’ve never done this before so can I ask - are you meant to tip a sparky?

 

[Octopus]

^^ anything extra will be appreciated!

 

[MJPD29]

It's there's not much evidence of pvc cable and the cables you are talking about are vir cables he is probably right

 

[MJPD29]

A couple of tins never goes a miss lol

 

[telectrix]

A couple of tins never goes a miss lol

tins???? maybe a couple of tins for a socket/light replacement. full rewire warrants a bottle of Glenlivet or similar.

 

[westward10]

Well.... the rewire has been quite the journey! Currently out of the house and hoping that tomorrow will be the last day of the job.

I’ve never done this before so can I ask - are you meant to tip a sparky?

Absolutely no way, they are being paid for the job.

 

[Pete999]

tins???? maybe a couple of tins for a socket/light replacement. full rewire warrants a bottle of Glenlivet or similar.

A case, Tel you're selling yourself short

 

[SparkyChick]

Absolutely no way, they are being paid for the job.

Fundamentally I agree with @westward10 on this... they are being paid to do the job.

However, I have had a couple of customers give me extra and it is appreciated. In most cases it's been when I got my estimate wrong and the job overran (despite my protestations that it's my problem, they've insisted) but in a couple of cases it's been because they were pleased with the service and speedy fixes for their problems.

 

[Midwest]

I'm just pleased I get my cheque ten days later

 

[telectrix]

Absolutely no way, they are being paid for the job.

but you'll always accept a brew. that's a tip of sorts.

 

[Strima]

As long as you inform HMRC of the tips you receive so they can take more money off you...

 

[westward10]

but you'll always accept a brew. that's a tip of sorts.

Don't drink tea or coffee

 

[Pete999]

Don't drink tea or coffee

Bah humbug

 

[Toneyz]

Well.... the rewire has been quite the journey! Currently out of the house and hoping that tomorrow will be the last day of the job.

I’ve never done this before so can I ask - are you meant to tip a sparky?

Most of us electricians as well as earning a good living out of our profession want to do a job we can look back and be proud of eg. stick our chest out and say we did you a good job there for a competitive price now we've finished this job give us another go. If you are pleased with the rewire the electrician has done and has been accommodating to your needs it is always good to have a pat on the back ,we don't want to be loved just appreciated.

 

[AnnabelleAW]

Thanks all - I went with some nice beers, a bottle of wine for his Mrs who had been doing the clean-up and some chocolate buttons for their little one.

House is now officially re-wired! Thanks to everyone for advice throughout, its been much appreciated.

 

[Phil Thompson]

I’d get at least 1-2 a week, sometimes it’s a fiver or tenner to get yourself a drink, the other day was £15 to get myself and the apprentice lunch.

The randomest thing was early this year a lady gave me a Xmas tree brand new in the box lol

Gonna get used this year instead of the stupid fibre optic one lol

 

[westward10]

Thanks all - I went with some nice beers, a bottle of wine for his Mrs who had been doing the clean-up and some chocolate buttons for their little one.

House is now officially re-wired! Thanks to everyone for advice throughout, its been much appreciated.

Glad it has all gone well Annabelle and thanks for the feedback we don't often hear about the outcomes.

 

[Midwest]

Is that the first satisfied customer we've had, if not one of the fist positive feedbacks. Its good to talk.