Discuss Great start to my electrical career... in the UK Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

DNS1

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As I said on another thread, I was doing a mock EICR and fault find today for a friend. She's in a 1900ish house with various extensions and partial rewires and has had trouble with nuisance tripping of the RCD (ELCB as I now find it is). Said I'd take a look for the experience of it and run a few tests to get used to my shiny new tester.

Day started off by finding that the DNO had sealed the MET enclosure for some reason... No-one seems to know why.

A couple of hours later I turned the power off, only to find that it set off the burglar alarm... and the code I'd been given didn't work! Half an hour later it finally shut up so I disconnected it completely (they didn't want it anyway!).

I did the tests, had the usual problems involving things being left plugged in, hidden behind wardrobes etc but all seemed to be going fine. Found a less than ideal IR results, but then it was to be expected.

Still didn't find the reason for the nuisance tripping. I'd been told it tended to happen when the heating was running, usually after 20 minutes or so, so I fired up the boiler. 2 minutes later, BANG! Not only did the ELCB trip, but so did the breaker on a lighting circuit...

I've run the IR tests again on that circuit and I'm now getting constant fails between line and neutral.

I've not disturbed anything at all, except at the DB end where all looks good, but I'm getting a resistance reading between line and neutral of 16 ohms.

Anyone got any ideas for me? Apparently the heating hasn't been used for a couple of years because of the problems it was causing, they've been making do with electric heaters instead. Reckon it could be a case of cables run next to a heating pipe and the insulation has just degraded to the point that it's given up the ghost? Although this place has evidence of a couple of partial rewires, the lighting circuits are mainly in black rubber coated cabling (pulling down the ceiling roses shows that the insulation is in a really bad way...)
 
Sounds like the boiler is fed from the lighting circuit,6-amp breaker going out on a dead short and probably to earth. If you have the old rubber cables I would suggest a full rewire is on the cards.
 
Thanks for the help chaps,

Boiler feed is rather helpfully by means of a 13 amp plug which is run from the kitchen circuit.

Full rewire definitely on the cards but seeing as the lights are now completely dead, it's going to have to be sooner rather than later!
 
but that's cold resistance. could be an inductive load with a hot impedance of zzzzzzz
 
Lol, I know the occupant very well, I've never know her to do welding!

Annoyingly, there's nothing permanently connected in this house which could draw that sort of load... No immersion heater and all the appliances are on 13a plugs.
 
Black rubber still in use? Then deffo rewire, you just need to wiggle that stuff and insulation falls off

I reckon you have disturbed a lighting cable, its shed its insulation and created your l- n fault
 
Thanks for the help chaps,

Boiler feed is rather helpfully by means of a 13 amp plug which is run from the kitchen circuit.

Full rewire definitely on the cards but seeing as the lights are now completely dead, it's going to have to be sooner rather than later!

Is it a combi boiler or is there a water tank?
Is there separate hot water and heating controller somewhere?
 
Is it a combi boiler or is there a water tank?
Is there separate hot water and heating controller somewhere?

It's a combi and is powered from a 13a socket, along with it's timer.

I took a couple of lighting fixtures down to see if I could split the radial and isolate the problem as a temporary fix, but the cables just crumbled in my hands.

Told her it would be too dangerous to attempt a fix because of the state of the rest of the wiring...

Time to purchase that long overdue chaser and do a full rewire...
 

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