new consumer unit certification

[neilyboy]

What certification do I need when replacing a consumer unit ?

Here are the details.

I am semi retired (electrician) and work for a company as the maintenance man which rents out flats as serviced accommodation, we are currently in the process of having the flats (25 of them) tested (fixed wiring testing EICR)

We have brought in an outside company to do the testing and one of the flats will require a board change.

The company have quoted for this and various other C1 and C3 fault rectifications and as well as that have said that the smoke detectors require work done to them as well.

I know that the smoke detectors are out with the scope of an EICR and together with some of the other "faults" they have flagged up I think they are trying to generate income.

Can I change the board myself ? if so what certification would I need bearing in mind all the fixed wiring has been tested and the results logged on the EICR.
We are in scotland and I've trawled tinternet for the answers but its very confusing, is it a minor works certificate needed ? building control informed ?EIC ?
Ta

 

[Julie.]

If you are competent, then you can do the work.

It will need a full EIC .

The need to inform the local authority is not really on the type of work like England, but on the location and type of premises (and a bit on the work).

Taking the two extremes, if you have a detached property, then no notice is required for a cu change. However if it is say a tenement, then notice is required.

If you are in a scheme, you can do the work and notify through the scheme, if not you must inform the authority ahead of doing any work.

The authority will decide whether to perform their own tests (cost by them but passed on to you in terms of the cost of the warrant), or accept your tests if you can demonstrate appropriate qualifications, and test equipment.

 

[neilyboy]

When you say EIC are you meaning all the fixed wiring again IR test,continuity,impedence etc or just an EIC for the new unit ie RCD times

and everything else you have said is pretty much what I've gleaned from tinternet

 

[catdog1121]

You say serviced accommodation... Would the property be considered residential or commercial... If residential it will fall into part P so you would need an EIC (To do this you will need an MFT in calibration) and building regs compliance certificate.. (The easiest way to comply is being part of a CPS)

You also need to be aware of changes that have been made to the current regulations...

I would also be concerned that as a maintenance man your companies insurance may not cover you doing such extensive electrical work.. As the designer and installer you would need both liability and indemnity insurance...

Why not get another quote or two to understand if the quote given is reasonable? It seems a little over-reaction to decide to do it yourself, with all the potential problems that may occur.

 

[catdog1121]

When you say EIC are you meaning all the fixed wiring again IR test,continuity,impedence etc or just an EIC for the new unit ie RCD times

and everything else you have said is pretty much what I've gleaned from tinternet

By you producing the EIC you are stating you are the designer, constructor and tester so yes you would need to carry out all the relevant tests for the fixed wiring again.. You could rely on the EICR results but its your name on the certificate and you were the last person to touch it so if something goes wrong you are the one signing to say you have tested it... Do you want to rely on someone else's test results?

 

[Julie.]

You say serviced accommodation... Would the property be considered residential or commercial... If residential it will fall into part P so you would need an EIC (To do this you will need an MFT in calibration) and building regs compliance certificate.. (The easiest way to comply is being part of a CPS)

You also need to be aware of changes that have been made to the current regulations...

I would also be concerned that as a maintenance man your companies insurance may not cover you doing such extensive electrical work.. As the designer and installer you would need both liability and indemnity insurance...

Why not get another quote or two to understand if the quote given is reasonable? It seems a little over-reaction to decide to do it yourself, with all the potential problems that may occur.

It will not fall into part P.

There is no such thing, part P is England and Wales.

 

[loz2754]

If residential it will fall into part P so you would need an EIC

Doesn't apply in Scotland

 

[neilyboy]

I thought Part P only applied to England and Wales, neither here nor there though, I'm sure it is classed as commercial.

The liability and indemnity question has been brought up before as I do the repairs to the domestic appliances and anything needed looked at in the building ,emergency lights, stairwell lights,I talked them into buying me a megger MFT 1721 as well.
I wouldn't have said that changing a CU was extensive work however I think going back to the company and mentioning the smoke detector issue being out with the scope of work for an EICR may force their hand to re-quote

 

[loz2754]

By you producing the EIC you are stating you are the designer, constructor and tester

Yes you are, but only of the works done by you, not the whole installation.

 

[Julie.]

When you say EIC are you meaning all the fixed wiring again IR test,continuity,impedence etc or just an EIC for the new unit ie RCD times

and everything else you have said is pretty much what I've gleaned from tinternet

Full EIC, you are changing all the circuit protection, must test and certify to current edition 100%

Edit:
As stated above, you don't have to take responsibility for things you can't see, or do, so ensuring Zs is correct - this is down to you (as will ensuring the protection is suitable, ir test ok, polarity etc), but that the cables are within zones within a wall etc , then no, not you unless you have reason to believe the existing installation is not to standard

 

[catdog1121]

Doesn't apply in Scotland

Sorry yes didnt see that bit, forgot the sweaties like to be different..

 

[catdog1121]

Yes you are, but only of the works done by you, not the whole installation.

Your connecting all the circuits to a consumer unit, do you not test all those circuits? What do you put in the schedule of test results, do you just leave it blank... Thats the first time anyone has given that interpretation..

 

[catdog1121]

I thought Part P only applied to England and Wales, neither here nor there though, I'm sure it is classed as commercial.

The liability and indemnity question has been brought up before as I do the repairs to the domestic appliances and anything needed looked at in the building ,emergency lights, stairwell lights,I talked them into buying me a megger MFT 1721 as well.
I wouldn't have said that changing a CU was extensive work however I think going back to the company and mentioning the smoke detector issue being out with the scope of work for an EICR may force their hand to re-quote

Yes sorry missed the bit of being in one of the outlier countries (Just kidding).. Your MFT 1721 will do the job sterlingly and sounds like you have thought about it.. Not sure on what you need in Scotland but sounds like your on the ball..

 

[Deleted account]

if you have a detached property, then no notice is required for a cu change.

really? I never new this.

 

[neilyboy]

AS I said at the start very very confusing ......

 

[loz2754]

Your connecting all the circuits to a consumer unit, do you not test all those circuits? What do you put in the schedule of test results, do you just leave it blank... Thats the first time anyone has given that interpretation..

Yes I test all the circuits, but I don't inspect everything as thoroughly as would be required in an EICR.
Perhaps I read something into your post that wasn't there, sorry about that.

 

[Julie.]

AS I said at the start very very confusing ......

It isn't really, it is only when you start looking or getting information about other countries which causes confusion.

You need to look at the information from the Scottish government, all the building regulations are there and lay out when a warrant is needed, don't look at foreign countries, or information it is often different.

 

[neilyboy]

You need to look at the information from the Scottish government, all the building regulations are there and lay out when a warrant is needed, don't look at foreign countries, or information it is often different.

Yep that's exactly what I've done and my understanding is as quoted earlier ie notify building control and they may or may not decide to check it or charge to check it.
When you mean foreign countries do you mean "dan sarf"....

 

[Julie.]

really? I never new this.

It's laid out with the Scottish building regulations, explaining when is, or when isn't a warrant required.

 

[Julie.]

Yep that's exactly what I've done and my understanding is as quoted earlier ie notify building control and they may or may not decide to check it or charge to check it.
When you mean foreign countries do you mean "dan sarf"....

Any other countries other than Scotland!

For some reason people try to imply their local regulations apply wider than their own country, unfortunately there is lots of misinformation out there in the Internet as people write what they know, without explaining that they are applying 'US' or English, or whatever local regulations.

Really bad for DIYers who see nonsense on you tube and think it is OK for them. (Use US techniques or standards in the UK, or visa versa ).