polarity argument at work

[Guest123]

Wrong POLL, you didn't read my entire post did you Lenny

*** I hope you have your smiley head on ***

#

Gotcha.

:wink5:

 

[Knobhead]

I couldn't give a ---- so long as it's consistant through the install.

Just think of the combinations you could have with new added to old View attachment 14744

 

[Darkwood]

If you all want to have a sly dig at me Derek then go ahead. But I'm the main man so u can all bore off. And I'll tell my apprentices what I want

Somehow i knew you would say that, and in response its not a dig its an overview of your comment and what the replies to the O/P has revealed as to his starting query, take it as a dig if you want but it wasn't written that way yes your the main man at work and what you say goes irrespective of right or wrong but as you have already found out you are not the main man on here nor are we your apprentices and it will be pointed out when you are wrong so you will have to learn to take critisism and admit when you are wrong but as is the nature of this forum you will get a 'like' notification if someone agrees strongly with you and/or a thankyou if they think you have helped them.

And although belated my i say Welcome to the forum

 

[ayjay]

why did the coulours change in the first place? and then need to be sleeved a different coulour? it is becuse the idiots/ at the top need to be kept earning a wage/salery-
i heard it was to harmonize with europe ,yet they have totally crap electrical wiring systems

 

[beatboaby924y]

As long as the same colours are kept constant throughout the installation and are sleeved correctly then I would say it doesn't matter. Then again I'm quite sensible :coolgleamA:

 

[alarm man]

If you all want to have a sly dig at me Derek then go ahead.

are you talking to yourself..

 

[derektaylor]

Each to their own. But I still stick by my opinion.

 

[1shortcircuit]

Each to their own. But I still stick by my opinion.

Good for you:coolgleamA: The world would be a very dull place if everyone's was the same. I do however believe that your post was a little out of order, you may act god at work but you'll have your work cut out in here with the attitude you adopted a short while ago.

The OP was merely asking for opinions on who does it which way, there is no right or wrong it's just the preference of the person carrying out the work at the time.

Also, Welcome to the forum:seeya:

 

[Knobhead]

Derek, I for one don’t believe that you’ve 20 years in the trade under your belt. You are nothing but an immature Troll.
Resign you’re membership before it is terminated.

View attachment 14745

 

[Thomas123]

Lenny don't tell me about my attitude please because nothing is out of line. And tbh Íve been sparkying for over 20 yrs now and I love my job and have a great passion for it and it really gets to me when people act thick and class black as permanent. Rant over !

Like Lenny said, how is it wrong when all the manufactures use black as the permanent???

Personally I use black as perm, purely because I've been taught that way and everyone I work with uses that way.

 

[bartkusal]

Like Lenny said, how is it wrong when all the manufactures use black as the permanent???

Personally I use black as perm, purely because I've been taught that way and everyone I work with uses that way.

Exactly, if the lighting system throughout uses perm live as black , so am I, you always been told look at manufacturers, it makes sence to keep the same.

This Dereck guy acts very srangely, perhaps he had a hard day I suppose.........

 

[Deleted member 26818]

I've never understood why the NICEIC have such a bee in their bonnet about de-neutralising the black.

 

[johnboy6083]

if you tried to play god with me on site derek, then id jack there and then.i couldnt and wouldnt work for someone who tried to enforce their opinion as right.
I have a rule, if i disagree with an opinion at work, i make my opinion known, and give my reasons. I listen to the other persons opinion. I then go away and try to find info to justify either my or their opinions, and if possible find regs to back it up.
Even if i then dont go back and tell the person who i was arguiing with that i was right, ive often learnt something.
If i went around not listening, then i wouldnt know as much as i do, and i wouldnt learn as much as i want to learn.

 

[ipf]

We go on about sleeving everything but, if that's the way to go, why are blacks (live) not sleeved in made up plug in roses (gregs) ? I always sleeve or mark, by the way.

 

[Rockingit]

The bottom line here is that the regs don't prescribe anything, so it's left up to us. Then see what happens....... So maybe we need a few MORE regs, or a few less?

In the meantime, I'll just keep using my eyes and brain to check what others have done. Oh, and keep the supply of sleeving in the van well stocked.

 

[derektaylor]

Basically I am like god on my sites I run. So my way or the highway. But I do take into account everyone is different

 

[imago]

Basically I am like god on my sites I run. So my way or the highway. But I do take into account everyone is different

At least when you're working for someone like that you know where you stand, which is far better IMHO than someone who says "whatever you think" then moans afterwards.

Personally I work in this order:-
1) Follow convention on site.
if there isn't one
2)Follow the convention on acessories
if that doesn't apply
3) Whichever gets the sleeve becomes the switched line

If the job is mine or I'm running it then I follow 3) as a general rule for no other reason than personal preference. Whatever way it's done, to be honest there are more important things in life and work to get excited about.

 

[44ALLAN]

Ermmmm.........what's wrong with doing that? :angel_smile:

 

[44ALLAN]

Brown perm L for me and then black (sleeved brown ) would be the switched live

Still finding other sparks sleeving the black with blue to make it a neutral then sleeving grey with Green and Yellow in swa and for some reason drives me mad

Ermmmm........what's wrong with doing that?:angel_smile:

 

[derektaylor]

I did have a hard day at work actually. Bloody young kids using black as permanent , no communication on the job. So they've made me foreman to look after it and do what I do best !

 

[telectrix]

as i have said before, this was never a problem before some d***head in a suit decided that the cable colours that had been used since the year dot should be changed to colours that have no logical reason or sense.

 

[kathwilcox]

I generally use brown as live, black as switched, grey as neutral BUT when working with others always clarify what they are using as what, simple communication!

I don't agree with bad attitudes, putting people down and shouting and balling on jobs/sites does any good, it just leads to a bad working atmosphere and poor work!

At the end of the day you should be able to go to work get along with everyone, have a few laughs and go home!

A happy work place is a more productive work place!

 

[trev]

Basically I am like god on my sites I run. So my way or the highway. But I do take into account everyone is different

I am so glad I went self employed when I read posts like that.

 

[BigAndyB]

Damn mouse!! How do I change my answer.

Brown is always live!! its easy.

 

[imago]

I don't agree with bad attitudes, putting people down and shouting and balling on jobs/sites does any good, it just leads to a bad working atmosphere and poor work!

Quite right, it usually ends in tears.

 

[telectrix]

last time i worked on site, this clever t*** decided it would be a good idea to cut into the insulation on my VDE cutters. he wasn't happy to find a dog turd in his toolbox.

 

[telectrix]

and it was laid by a rotty!

 

[kathwilcox]

last time i worked on site, this clever t*** decided it would be a good idea to cut into the insulation on my VDE cutters. he wasn't happy to find a dog turd in his toolbox.

Take it his tools were turd then! haha serves him right!

You should never give what you can't take, bet he was the laughing stock of the site!

 

[derektaylor]

Telectrix- think I can smell something bull**** right there. Nothing to do with the argument!

 

[bartkusal]

Telectrix- think I can smell something bull**** right there. Nothing to do with the argument!

I thought the argument was finished, many opinions , main consensus was that keep consistent throughout or match manufacturers lighting systems, and regards you, I think it don’t mater, you still going to "rape" your pure lads on site
:6:, feel sorry for them. lol......

I think you are a very very good spark, otherwise I find it hard to understand how you achieved what you achieved (being a foreman on many sites). I bet you going to buy some beer for them lads on Friday, aren’t you?

 

[mogga]

How many posts do you have to have made before picking a fight with a moderator is allowed?

3,893 s a good number lol

 

[jaresquire]

So..,why sleeve over Black when it is now a 'Live' colour?

Edit: I mean 'Line', I'm on night work at the moment!

 

[mogga]

I Have argued that Jare it all comes down to single ph 3 ph new old confused EU wiring
as for SWA Grey is to be used as neutral as recomended by ESC to prevent confusing things If they dont like "Confusing" things WTF did they agree to change to bring us inline with those EU members who cant wire anything right anyways

 

[BigAndyB]

Surely, the point is if it sleeved, there is no problem what you use. As long as both ends are the same.
The problem occurs when there is no sleeving, and assumptions are made, and we know what assumption is - the mother of all **ck-ups.

 

[Adam W]

The problem arises when you put the sleeved black in the L terminal and the brown in the A terminal on the emergency fittings, while someone has fed the permanent live into the sleeved black and taken the brown back from the switch.
Either that or when you use prewired connectors where the manufacturer has wired brown to L and black to A, but the installer insists on doing it the other way around.

Can anyone explain how they wire non-emergency fittings if they're using black as switched live? Do you take a 4 core to the fitting and terminate the brown so you can continue using sleeved black as switched live? Bear in mind the NICEIC recommend any unused cores should be earthed, does this mean brown is now earth in part of the installation?

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Telectrix- think I can smell something bull**** right there. Nothing to do with the argument!

I think I can see your problem.
You are looking for an argument.
Unfortunately you've chosen the wrong subject.
Other than you, no one cares enough about the subject to argue about it.
As long as the same colour is used at both ends of the cable, it doesn't matter which one it is.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

So..,why sleeve over Black when it is now a 'Live' colour?

Edit: I mean 'Line', I'm on night work at the moment!

It's a live colour only on 3phase.
Single phase has to be brown.

 

[jaresquire]

Thanks Spin, I got all ---- anyway and looked up table 51 in the BGB!