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Hi,

First post so welcome all and here goes

Over the last month the GE RCD has tripped randomly, the last time when we were asleep in bed and nothing more anoying to wake up late as alarm not gone off and all house sockets dead.

When i try to reset the rcd it will not reset until i turn off all the breakers, then it resets and i turn on the breakers one by one and away we go.

Now if it tripped when i turned the breakers back on i could isolate the circiut thats causing the problem but it does not trip.

So i can only presume its the rcd as its so random, today it tripped when i turned on the tv.

Any Idea's should i replace the rcd 1st and see if it happens again or just get a sparky in.

Thanks
 
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Des 56

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Unless you have and are able to use test gear to identify the problem
You will be peeing against the wind,best go with your own suggestion.the spark
 

darkwood

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To help the sparkie also try identify when it trips... is it raining (maybe outside light), as you also say its doing it night and day its possible something that turns on intermitently so check if heating is on (faulty valve) and if neither of above fits the last but not least fridge/freezer (compressor fault).
But agree it still can be hard to trace even with test gear, isolation of circuit from rcd temp' and onto rcbo may be needed to narrow the fault down.

Either way i agree with previous post, might cost a callout but probably save on the hours you lose been late for work.
 
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  • #4
Thanks for info, i have isolated all outside lights and garden pump and it is still tripping so nothing outside, I did have to take a cover off the fridge a month ago to release the fan as it was frozen in ice so wether i trapped a wire i dont know so thats worth a look, is there any possibility it is the rcd as become faulty, its 15 years old now and a GE type.
 
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darkwood

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Pcb - printed circuit board..... are you mixing something up here?

Rcd .. should have a test button on it if it operates when you press it it shows it works physically but you would require testing gear to see if it complies, its rare for rcd's to trip because they are faulty usually they fail to trip if they are faulty, when you say you isolated lights - have you just switched them off? RCD's monitor Neutral as well and this wont be isolated when turning switch or even mcb off, this is why this kind of problem really needs a competent electrician.
 
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  • #7
Can a neutral fault just occur as we have had no wireing done for at least 5 years and that was on an extension and by approved sparky
 

darkwood

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May i also add - welcome to the forum, post you location we have many guys and gals on here and one may be local.
 
S

StuSpiers

Can a neutral fault just occur as we have had no wireing done for at least 5 years and that was on an extension and by approved sparky
Hah every fault I have attended the client has sworn blind no work has been done for years?

Usually forget about the new mirror they just hung into a cable.


Get an electrician to pop round - it will be sorted fairly quickly I'm sure.
 
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  • #10
Pcb - printed circuit board..... are you mixing something up here?

Rcd .. should have a test button on it if it operates when you press it it shows it works physically but you would require testing gear to see if it complies, its rare for rcd's to trip because they are faulty usually they fail to trip if they are faulty, when you say you isolated lights - have you just switched them off? RCD's monitor Neutral as well and this wont be isolated when turning switch or even mcb off, this is why this kind of problem really needs a competent electrician.
Yes the test button trips the rcd but then it will not reset unless i turn off all the 6 breakers, i have tried to reset it with each one at a time but it will not unless all 6 off, then i turn all six back on and its ok till it trips again. the outside pir lamps are isolated on a switch, would it be better if i pulled out wires from switch to take out the neutral monitor situation.
 
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  • #11
If there is any electrician on the forum in the leicester area who would like to come and sort out problem i would be happy just to get it sorted but i dont know any myself and dont want a cowboy coming and spending hours at my expence and making things worse hense my questions to help isolate it down so to make it easier for who comes to sort it out
 
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darkwood

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Sounds a little strange that it wont reset unless all load is removed, its resetting may be faulty but im not too sure this is your issue with the tripping... but this is the problem; we are at an impass now and test gear is needed, you can wait and ask all night but you will only get random shots in the dark as to its cause if not educated guesses but still all guesses and really it may confuse more than help...

Il bow out here as i cant see you getting any more help with this problem without an electrician and testing gear but hope i was of some guidence.
 
J

jpm646

Could be a faulty RCD so try a ramp test or could b a slow earth leakage.
My bet is on the latter one
 
J

jpm646

Have seen it with a few appliances where they have a earth to neutral fault usually fridges or computers but sometime on there own they aren't enough to trip RCD but some times when on together they will do or if it's one appliance it may take a while before the earth leakage trips the RCD only had this once or twice and was a ******* to fault find.
 

PEG

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If a "cowbow" takes a very long time to relieve himself whilst out on the plains........thats a slow earth leak....
 

darkwood

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Have seen it with a few appliances where they have a earth to neutral fault usually fridges or computers but sometime on there own they aren't enough to trip RCD but some times when on together they will do or if it's one appliance it may take a while before the earth leakage trips the RCD only had this once or twice and was a ******* to fault find.
I get you now... computers, LED lamps etc have a design leakage, this is normal but what you are getting at is an accumulative leakage of several items with design leakage and/or fault leakage as this can creep past the approx 18mA which is then in the tripping territory of a 30mA rcd/rcbo.

There is a 'slow rise leakage' but this is less common and is a fault within an appliance normally where the leakage slowly ramps up until it trips rcd, this can be caused by heat expansion that creates earth leakage in proportion to temperature rise and can be seen occasionally in lighting ballasts for example, sorry to pull you on it i was more curious to what you meant as appose to having a dig.
 
J

jpm646

I get you now... computers, LED lamps etc have a design leakage, this is normal but what you are getting at is an accumulative leakage of several items with design leakage and/or fault leakage as this can creep past the approx 18mA which is then in the tripping territory of a 30mA rcd/rcbo.

There is a 'slow rise leakage' but this is less common and is a fault within an appliance normally where the leakage slowly ramps up until it trips rcd, this can be caused by heat expansion that creates earth leakage in proportion to temperature rise and can be seen occasionally in lighting ballasts for example, sorry to pull you on it i was more curious to what you meant as appose to having a dig.
No worries m8 i knew what I ment I just knew it to be call it a slow earth leakage
 
My guess is a loose neutral in consumer unit(probably factory connections)....can be fine for ages and trip but not reset with load on it....fire waiting to happen as there is obviously a reason for it to trip in first place, so I would get it looked at if I were you :)
 
If the mcbs are on and the rcd won't reset, that could be cumulative earth leakage on start up (computers, fridge etc).

The random tripping on what you have said, the socket circuits, points towards high earth leakage just below the tripping point of the rcd until an electrical item requires more current, eg fridge or something on a timer.

It also could be damp/condensation at a socket or switch with all this heavy rain we have been getting?

As said before it needs professional investigating and I wish him good luck. Please come back and tell us how it goes.
 
S

sedgy34

My money is on the appliance he mentioned the fan clogged with ice on round it
 
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  • #24
I know the outside lights been turned off - but just by a SP switch?
I have now isolated the outside light by disconecting wires from int connector so have to wait and see if it trips again, just a case of narrowing down possible cause one by one.
 
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  • #25
Think i might have narrowed it down to a 2 gang socket, the socket in question just has the washing machine plugged in to it. i tried to plug in the freezer to same socket and it trips yet when i plug freezer into its original socket it fine, yet when i plug the washing machine into it it fine as well. I have a spark coming round on Monday so at least he has a starting point.

Cannot understand why it trips when i plug in freezer but not the washing machine, if it was a fault with the freezer would that not trip it when plugged into its original socket. weird
 
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  • #26
It is defo the freezer causing the problem as i put both the washer and the freezer on ind RCd's and the last two trips of the main rcd the washer has been ok but freezer rcd tripped as well. So now i need to find someone to look at that,i have looked at compressor and no damp there so no idea what the problem there is.
 

telectrix

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new freezer?
 
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  • #28
You got to be kidding its a 2k usa type, and believe it or not works perfectly apart from blowing the god dam rcd. I know somwone local who services them so il just have to spend Sparkys money on that.

new freezer?
 

darkwood

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Remember here Gollum your confusion has arised from the simple fact you can plug the freezer in and it may not trip, but the freezer has a control circuit and may not call the compressor for hours so can be misleading, some freezers have more complex controls too so can hide the fault until certain criteria is met e.g. some models have heating coils to maintain the freezer has differing temp as the fridge all from one compressor circuit.
 
K

kenny james

have you considered having the freezer put onto its own dedicated circuit run seperately from the consumer unit?.
 
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