Aico vs FireAngel with app notifications

[chriso]

Hi

I'm having a full house rewire. I want to have mains smoke alarms, heat alarms, carbon alarm next to boiler, internet connectivity to notify an app via gateway and a wall controller to test/silence.

Based on this I've priced up a FireAngel system (just on components) at £500. I've done a like for like on the spreadsheet looking at Aico and it comes out at £900.

The electricians that have come out have all recommended Aico. The thing is each alarm requires a separate rf module, which adds £330 to the price. It's a shame they aren't built in, even if the alarm was slightly more expensive.

Anyone has experience of both?

If I went with wired Aico, using the RF module is required to communicate with Ei1000G SmartLINK Gateway, which means no communication wire between them. I can't see which app you would get alerts on, there are different aico apps on the store by different developers.

p.s I like Google Nest but they've shot themselves in the foot not doing a heat alarm

Thanks

 

[westward10]

I'm not involved with this sort of thing but from what I have seen on this forum there will almost certainly be a unanimous choice for Aico.

 

[brianmoooore]

I'm not involved with this sort of thing but from what I have seen on this forum there will almost certainly be a unanimous choice for Aico.

I'll steal the above and post it as my own. Absolutely no contest. Toys versus professional equipment.

 

[pc1966]

Google Nest is not approved in Scotland for interlinked alarms due to the dependency on a 3rd party server.

All the feedback I have heard of gives Aico the top slot for something that actually works and meets the 10 year expectation. My own (very limited) experience was FireAngel sealed units failing with low battery after 2-3 years.

 

[chriso]

Google Nest is not approved in Scotland for interlinked alarms due to the dependency on a 3rd party server.

"Please note that the Nest Protect System will not meet the standard. This is because they do not meet the requirements for a heat alarm under the relevant British Standard. British Standard (BS 5839-6:2019) states that only heat alarms should be installed in kitchens."

Fire and smoke alarms: changes to the law

The law on fire alarms has changed which means all Scottish homes will need to have interlinked alarms. Guidance on what you need to know.

www.gov.scot

So the issue is no heat alarm, not the way they communicate between them.

 

[chriso]

Main things I'm wondering with Aico, aside from the extra £400, is notifications in an app when you are away from home. Anyone experience of that?

"Please note that the Nest Protect System will not meet the standard. This is because they do not meet the requirements for a heat alarm under the relevant British Standard. British Standard (BS 5839-6:2019) states that only heat alarms should be installed in kitchens."

Fire and smoke alarms: changes to the law

The law on fire alarms has changed which means all Scottish homes will need to have interlinked alarms. Guidance on what you need to know.

www.gov.scot

So the issue is no heat alarm, not the way they communicate between them.

Ah I see, they do use wifi between them, not RF, double whammy Google

Nest Fire System And Scottish Legislation, Why You Should Avoid It

Smoke alarms are mandatory in all private premises in Scotland and the rest of the UK, and modern technology developments are bringing to the market new smart

fireguardplus.co.uk

 

[pc1966]

So the issue is no heat alarm, not the way they communicate between them.

More than that and covered here:

Nest Fire System And Scottish Legislation, Why You Should Avoid It

Smoke alarms are mandatory in all private premises in Scotland and the rest of the UK, and modern technology developments are bringing to the market new smart

fireguardplus.co.uk

• Nest Fire Alarms Are Wi-Fi Interlinked
• Nest Fire Alarms Do Not Have Tamper-proof batteries
• Nest Fire Alarms Do Not Detect Heat
• Nest Fire Alarms Detect Smoke When It's Not Required

The WiFi linking is very important: if you have an electrical fault that starts a fire and takes out the supply to your router, etc, you have lest the interlinked benefit, etc.

 

[MJPD29]

Do not use fireangel. You may as well throw your money away, absolutley terrible products

 

[littlespark]

Unanimous.

Out of curiosity, £900 just for aico materials? How many detectors is that?
Granted, I don’t know how much the hub thing is.

You say “each alarm requires an rf module”
Do they? If they’re hard wired?
Is this so the app knows which detector has gone off?

 

[cliffed]

Do not use fireangel. You may as well throw your money away, absolutley terrible products

Totally agree having problems with 12 detectors all RF linked main/ battery… they keep alarming whenever… also the pairing set up …so fiddly when all have been installed

 

[cliffed]

Unanimous.

Out of curiosity, £900 just for aico materials? How many detectors is that?
Granted, I don’t know how much the hub thing is.

You say “each alarm requires an rf module”
Do they? If they’re hard wired?
Is this so the app knows which detector has gone off?

Always try & hard wire… it’s so easy not too, but pain if they play up

 

[pc1966]

Always try & hard wire… it’s so easy not too, but pain if they play up

If you are rewiring anyway then probably cheaper on top.

But for retrofitting without easey cable routing then the Aico ones at least seem to work well and the "remote control" module to test/silence is such a God send when it comes to folks setting them off due to dumb things (smoky candles in living room, etc) without getting A&E involved due to falling off ladders trying to silence ones on a 10' or 12' high ceiling.

 

[chriso]

Unanimous.

Out of curiosity, £900 just for aico materials? How many detectors is that?
Granted, I don’t know how much the hub thing is.

You say “each alarm requires an rf module”
Do they? If they’re hard wired?
Is this so the app knows which detector has gone off?

3 heat alarms, 2 smoke alarms, 1 carbon alarm.

Yes, if you want to communicate with the gateway and outside world, each one needs a rf module installed, which is £55. Its not clear if they have an app or just sms/email notifications.

Screenshot attached.

 

[Midwest]

I swopped my smoke alarms to Aico recently, and was going to have rf module, so I could use the app. Perhaps a landlord might benefit from the use of the app, but not sure what a homeowner would gain?

Another vote for the remote control, which you can get as a hard wired one.

 

[Dobes_88]

I've previously installed Aico detectors and integrated them with a Texecom intruder alarm system via a relay base (Ei128R) for notifications through the Texecom app, an option to look into if you're just after notifications whether they've activated or not.

 

[nicebutdim]

If you are rewiring anyway then probably cheaper on top.

That would have been my first suggestion, but marketing info for Aico's SmartLink Gateway states that it's for use with RF devices. I suspect this means it will only communicate with heads that are fitted with RF modules, but would suggest OP confirms this with Aico. Money to be saved if they could get away with only one RF module, but I don't think they can.


Edit: should have finished reading the thread before responding as OP confirmed my suspicion in post #13.

 

[pc1966]

That would have been my first suggestion, but marketing info for Aico's SmartLink Gateway states that it's for use with RF devices. I suspect this means it will only communicate with heads that are fitted with RF modules, but would suggest OP confirms this with Aico. Money to be saved if they could get away with only one RF module, but I don't think they can.


Edit: should have finished reading the thread before responding as OP confirmed my suspicion in post #13.

I think you would only need one RF & mains base to allow the radio link, all alarms could be hard-wired sort. But not something I have actually looked in to in any detail, but did fir two mains and 3 radio devices to a friend's using that approach.

 

[chriso]

Hmm, so the SmarkLink app looks like its just for installers?

‎SmartLINK

‎Ei Electronics SmartLINK app is designed to work with the Ei1000G gateway and SmartLINK cloud portal installation. This app guides installers through the process of installing Ei Electronics alarms and allows the install data to be pushed to the SmartLink Cloud Portal providing a complete...

apps.apple.com

Looking at the screenshot and description. Its also all 1 star reviews saying you can't login, with them responding

"Thanks for your feedback. The SmartLINK App is designed for users with existing log-in details provided to them by their SmartLINK Portal system administrator. If you do not have log-in details for the SmartLINK App, contact your administrator"

It doesn't look like it lets you see an alarm and the status. Not very clear.

Compared to the Nest app which does show you alerts and system status

‎Nest

‎At Google Nest, we make products that are beautiful, helpful and easy to use. The Nest app is no exception. Control your Nest thermostat, arm and disarm your Nest Secure alarm system, see your home with Nest Cam, and get an alert if Nest Protect goes off – all in one place. And receive...

apps.apple.com

 

[WallaceP]

I can't see much utility in having an app alert you if there is a problem, I have never used the Aico Gateway myself but I could see the information it sends out being rather limited. You might be cheaper with a hardwired aico system and maybe a nest alarm in the hall, in addition to the aico system?

 

[chriso]

I can't see much utility in having an app alert you if there is a problem

If there is a fire and we are away from home, I get an alert and can call the firebrigade and neighbours, rather than waiting for a neighbour to spot it.

I'm not asking whether or not I should have internet connected smart alarms, I'm trying to work out if Aico, the brand all the electricians have recommended, have their tech together with this stuff.

 

[Midwest]

If there is a fire and we are away from home, I get an alert and can call the firebrigade and neighbours, rather than waiting for a neighbour to spot it.

I'm not asking whether or not I should have internet connected smart alarms, I'm trying to work out if Aico, the brand all the electricians have recommended, have their tech together with this stuff.

It won't tell you that you have a fire I think, only that an alarm has activated. The FB would not be impressed, being called to a false activation of a fire alarm system, although your neighbours could confirm.

As said, its a good system for landlords, so they know if tenants are altering a safety system, that the landlord is responsible for.

 

[Vortigern]

The best thing here to do is phone Aico they are very helpful.

 

[Taylortwocities]

If there is a fire and we are away from home, I get an alert and can call the firebrigade and neighbours, rather than waiting for a neighbour to spot it.

I'm not asking whether or not I should have internet connected smart alarms, I'm trying to work out if Aico, the brand all the electricians have recommended, have their tech together with this stuff.

Like most folk, I have "do not disturb" set on my smartfone from 11pm - 7am, so I wouldn't get a notification anways!

 

[timhoward]

I'm not asking whether or not I should have internet connected smart alarms, I'm trying to work out if Aico, the brand all the electricians have recommended, have their tech together with this stuff

They have their tech together for the primary purpose of the system, namely detecting fires and ensuring that all units sound using a reliable protocol. Their primary interest is getting everyone out.

Alerting the home owner via a gimmick app is (rightly) secondary. If you want that fit a relay base and use another system for it, e.g.
a) an input to a monitored intruder alarm
b) a CLS Mini Air in bell trigger mode
c) A shelly module with nothing on the output side, which can have rules assigned in Nest.

 

[pirate]

I'm going back to the basic question which the OP posted.
Fit Aico, not FireAngel. I have never had a call-back to an Aico unit. To be fair, I've never fitted FireAngel, but I wouldn't risk it given many online comments about their unreliability/difficulty in pairing.
As a side-note, before the new Scottish regs came into play, whereby RF fully wireless alarms were permitted, I installed a few "hybrid" systems whereby there was a mains unit in the hall, and 10-year battery alarms elsehwere with RF modules in each unit. Thus, there was a mains supplied unit with RF connectivity (permitted) and other units purely on battery with RF...I did enquire of the LA in all cases and they had no idea, didn't care...and of course these systms are now legitimised by the current regs. Those early installations are all still working fine...and they were all Aico. I test them annually and they just keep on working. The reason for the hybrid nature was to avoid damage to period cornicing and other features.
I did fit another brand recently, customer supplied, and they seemed fine, just as easy to install as Aico, just as easy to pair, and quite a bit smaller and cheaper. I'll try to find out what make they are and post later.
My main reason for this post is to say that prices vary enormously for the Aico units, so it is worth shopping around. Indeed, from some suppliers, the smoke with the RF module included and already installed, is cheaper than the basic unit was during lockdown and before...lockdown was a supply chain problem too.
Today, I checked the price from my 2 main suppliers of Aico units, and compared the price of just one item, the Aico Ei650RF.
On one site, the price is £92.83 inc. VAT and claims a price reduction of £40.84...
On another site, and the one I use now, the same unit is showing at £57.30 inc. VAT.
Both claim that they are ready to go, with RF module included. From my experience, both are.
On that basis, fit Aico, wireless, fit and forget...or add an extra interrogation/reporting module and other accessories to suit your needs.
Aha! I hear you ask, which site was the cheaper of the two?
Well, that'll cost you £30!
LOL!
Seriously...Edwardes was the cheaper site...but always shop around.

 

[pirate]

and I have the name of the real cheapos...HiSpec
seem to be ok, but you'll never know until you need them!
Have to say, they were very good to install and pair...

 

[littlespark]

Im looking for a battery RF HiSpec heat detector coincidently.

A customer bought a house, and these are already fitted... but they put a smoke in the lounge near a coal fire. I recommended changing to a heat, and putting the smoke somewhere else.
None of my local wholesalers or sheds have them in stock, but i suppose they can get them in.

 

[123]

and I have the name of the real cheapos...HiSpec
seem to be ok, but you'll never know until you need them!
Have to say, they were very good to install and pair...

HiSpec aren't great, never fitted them but pulled out quite a few faulty ones. One of my wholesalers had a big crate of them full of faulty units that had been returned.

Aico all the way for me, not sure if anyone else has recommended it yet lol

 

[pirate]

I think you'll find a few folks have recommended Aico!

 

[123]

I think you'll find a few folks have recommended Aico!

Emoji's are all broken (at least my end), but I did put an lol in there to indicate sarcasm ;-)