Different standards different trades

[elevate]

Latest standard is EN81 which states that the cross sectional area for small power and lighting may be smaller as long as further protection is added. It does not say how much smaller you can get away with. Bearing in mind that everything from hoovers to power drills gets plugged into the top of car socket, i would say 0.75mm is too small especially on high rise buildings.

 

[Engineer54]

How would you get access to all the areas in a lift shaft? This is a completely acceptable limitation on an EICR.

Exactly the same way as the lift company would conduct lift a shaft inspection!! Ideally you would co-ordinate any EICR (or equivalent) with the lift companies schedule of inspections for a particular lift installation, it's certainly not a ''completely acceptable limitation'', lift shafts need to be inspected like any other area of a lifts installation.... Just needs a little more thought and coordination!!!

 

[tazz]

Tazz

Its the circuits on our side of the cu that cannot comply, as stated trailing flexes are 0.75mm for car lights and sockets.

power in Lift cars are deffo down to you

 

[Guest125]

Exactly the same way as the lift company would conduct lift a shaft inspection!! Ideally you would co-ordinate any EICR (or equivalent) with the lift companies schedule of inspections for a particular lift installation, it's certainly not a ''completely acceptable limitation'', lift shafts need to be inspected like any other area of a lifts installation.... Just needs a little more thought and coordination!!!

I would beg to differ. In an ideal world yes but in all reality testing will be carried out to the lift isolator and then stop.

 

[Guest125]

Did Tazz just say "defo"?

 

[Engineer54]

Latest standard is EN81 which states that the cross sectional area for small power and lighting may be smaller as long as further protection is added. It does not say how much smaller you can get away with. Bearing in mind that everything from hoovers to power drills gets plugged into the top of car socket, i would say 0.75mm is too small especially on high rise buildings.

If i remember, i'll have a look at our lift installions specification and lift company proposals tomorrow when i get to work.... lol!!

 

[Plonker 3]

Latest standard is EN81 which states that the cross sectional area for small power and lighting may be smaller as long as further protection is added. It does not say how much smaller you can get away with. Bearing in mind that everything from hoovers to power drills gets plugged into the top of car socket, i would say 0.75mm is too small especially on high rise buildings.

That can be down to the OCPD you fit in the DB provided to you for your power and lighting.

 

[elevate]

I would beg to differ. In an ideal world yes but in all reality testing will be carried out to the lift isolator and then stop.

Rules and regs say only qualified personell should enter the lift shaft. How many sparks are trained and qualified enter the shaft and work on top or underneath the lift car ?

 

[Engineer54]

I would beg to differ. In an ideal world yes but in all reality testing will be carried out to the lift isolator and then stop.

You can beg as much as you like, lift shaft electrical as well as fire protection inspections/testing is a requirement, carried out by the the lift company or by an independant company....

 

[tazz]

If i remember, i'll have a look at our lift installions specification and lift company proposals tomorrow when i get to work.... lol!!

Would be good to find out what covers what....I was under the impression, fixed shaft lighting and motor room itself was 7671....lift carriage, switch gear, motors was the lifts BS

 

[tazz]

You can beg as much as you like, lift shaft electrical as well as fire protection inspections/testing is a requirement, carried out by the the lift company or by an independant company....

As state previously, the main contractor may insist on a full inspection to prove safety.....

 

[Engineer54]

Rules and regs say only qualified personell should enter the lift shaft. How many sparks are trained and qualified enter the shaft and work on top or underneath the lift car ?

Elevate, i can't tell you how many times i've been up and down lift shafts on top of lift cars in the course of conducting inspections, far too many to count anyway. I wouldn't like to travel on top of the car however, before the car and system safety functions have been thoroughly tested and confirmed.... lol!!

 

[elevate]

Would be good to find out what covers what....I was under the impression, fixed shaft lighting and motor room itself was 7671....lift carriage, switch gear, motors was the lifts BS

I suppose it depends who installs and tests, if the works were carried out by electricians surely they would test to BS7671 in which case the cross sectional area of the trailers raises concern.
If we carry out the works we comply to BSEN81 or BS5655.

 

[tazz]

I like it, bit scary when the engineer removes the top limit switch tho ....so he can take it higher...lol

 

[elevate]

Elevate, i can't tell you how many times i've been up and down lift shafts on top of lift cars in the course of conducting inspections, far too many to count anyway. I wouldn't like to travel on top of the car however, before the car and system safety functions have been thoroughly tested and confirmed.... lol!!

Have taken many a sparks for a ride :angel_smile: however if we go by the book they are not supposed to.

 

[elevate]

I like it, bit scary when the engineer removes the top limit switch tho ....so he can take it higher...lol

Until you hit the final limit and are stuck up there.

 

[Plonker 3]

No the work will have to comply with the BS that covers that area not who ever installs it.

 

[Des 56]

How many sparks are trained and qualified enter the shaft and work on top or underneath the lift car

Can we include all lifts because the ones that some of us sparks worked on rode on top of, looked up at were sometimes filled with coal,the building lifts at the time would have been considered mere toys

 

[tazz]

only ride ontop to change smoke detectors these days, but always found lift engineers helpful guys.

 

[elevate]

No the work will have to comply with the BS that covers that area not who ever installs it.

How do you go about testing and signing off the cu and all circuits connected to it (which includes small power and lighting to the lift car) ?