unbelievable. own van and tools for this.

[telectrix]

Electrician/Stoke-Upon-Trent/Social Housing job - Decision Recruitment - Stoke-on-Trent | Indeed.co.uk

can't see many takers.

 

[MDJ]

Probably a tenner an hour as well, may suit a 17 Day wonder though

 

[ChrisElectrical88]

What are these 17 day wonders you talk about, are they even worse than the Electrical Trainee?

 

[MDJ]

What are these 17 day wonders you talk about, are they even worse than the Electrical Trainee?

The short course guys take a 5 week course and some go on to further training and some work as mates before doing work themselves, I think some of the short course guys are decent fellas and misunderstood, that said not all by any means. The 17 Day wonders are members of the public like school caretakers and shop supervisors who go to a training centre and take a 17 day course. At the end of the course they have "Achieved Part P understanding" some of these people then think they are electricians and think the part p understanding course mean they can undertake electrical work in someones home. Unfortunatley the scams are happy to take their money and allow then to do so as well. The short course guys often get mixed up with the 17 Day course guys and end up getting a slating here, a lot of them justified. But as mentioned IMO some of the 5 week guys do end up as decent sparks after further training, no so the 17 day whizz kids.

 

[ChrisElectrical88]

wow, a new breed of 'sparks' i didn't even know about!!!

 

[MDJ]

Vertually the same really except the 5 week course is a little longer, I believe my local college does a couple of evenings a week for a 3-4 month period, not sure what the difference in actual work taught is but there you are. Maybe the 17 day course is purely part p and the 5 week a little in depth regarding regulations in general.

 

[UNG]

That advert is a bit ambiguous when you view or apply for the job offers £12.60/hr with a van and fuel card and then says you need your own van and tools makes you wonder what they are not telling you

Got to agree with Tel can't see many being interested at those rates

 

[Engineer54]

The short course guys take a 5 week course and some go on to further training and some work as mates before doing work themselves, I think some of the short course guys are decent fellas and misunderstood, that said not all by any means. The 17 Day wonders are members of the public like school caretakers and shop supervisors who go to a training centre and take a 17 day course. At the end of the course they have "Achieved Part P understanding" some of these people then think they are electricians and think the part p understanding course mean they can undertake electrical work in someones home. Unfortunatley the scams are happy to take their money and allow then to do so as well. The short course guys often get mixed up with the 17 Day course guys and end up getting a slating here, a lot of them justified. But as mentioned IMO some of the 5 week guys do end up as decent sparks after further training, no so the 17 day whizz kids.

Check out the various training sites that offer these 17 day and 5 week courses and you'll see there is no misunderstanding at all. You'll find it's basically the same crap for both, the 5 week'er may come away with a PAT testing certificate, but that's about it!! Both of these short courses are specifically targeted and advertised at those wanting to work as an electrician (Domestic Installer) in the domestic sector. This is the whole point of having a National Register of Qualified Electricians, to put a stop once and for all, to all this back door entry malarky.

There is no place for either of these graduates in our electrical industry as far as i'm concerned. I think you'll find that over 90% of all these back door wannabe's, are sole traders, applying and registering with the part Pee scams within day's of passing out of these fast track training centres. Very few of either, will go on to take further training, and basically without the electrical core qualification and skill training they shouldn't be allowed to work alone in anyone's property.

A bit harsh i know, but then reality and truth normally is!!!

 

[Zebra Stripe]

£12.60.......JIB rates arent they

 

[UNG]

£12.60.......JIB rates arent they

The rate is a little bit below the JIB transport provided rate but as the job description is very sketchy are they providing a vehicle or is it own van and tools and it is only a temporary job so I would suggest they are looking for more of a subby for not a lot of money

 

[Zebra Stripe]

Hey, I wasnt saying it was a decent rate of pay, far from it.
I was being sarcastic and insinuating that JIB rates are appalingly low as well, although not surprisingly, due to their dubious links with employment agency parasites.

 

[MDJ]

A bit harsh i know, but then reality and truth normally is!!!

Yup Probably right, I know there are a few good lads here who came the short course route, but I cannot deny you may well be right regarding initial training, I obviously came through the 236 and AM1 and AM2 route so know next to nothing about the short courses except as an employer I have been bombarded several times from training centres regarding how it works etc, I never took much notice of them before and am well aware the part p courses are a total joke. I am still not sure the short electrical courses are the same but hey You are probably correct, lets see what the short course guys say compaired to what a part p 17 dayer says I suppose lol.

 

[Engineer54]

Yup Probably right, I know there are a few good lads here who came the short course route, but I cannot deny you may well be right regarding initial training, I obviously came through the 236 and AM1 and AM2 route so know next to nothing about the short courses except as an employer I have been bombarded several times from training centres regarding how it works etc, I never took much notice of them before and am well aware the part p courses are a total joke. I am still not sure the short electrical courses are the same but hey You are probably correct, lets see what the short course guys say compaired to what a part p 17 dayer says I suppose lol.

Well, considering that the electrical trainee's course is 25 days, which is just 6 days (no weekends) more than the other lot, nothing of any consequence would be my estimation!! Just enough time to complete that numbty PAT course, clutching that useless and unbelievable Level 3 qualification. lol!!

 

[ipf]

A bit strange that ad. Are they saying that the successful applicant will be fully employed by them...........but have to provide their own NICEIC certificates?

 

[Guest111]

Check out the various training sites that offer these 17 day and 5 week courses and you'll see there is no misunderstanding at all. You'll find it's basically the same crap for both, the 5 week'er may come away with a PAT testing certificate, but that's about it!! Both of these short courses are specifically targeted and advertised at those wanting to work as an electrician (Domestic Installer) in the domestic sector. This is the whole point of having a National Register of Qualified Electricians, to put a stop once and for all, to all this back door entry malarky.

There is no place for either of these graduates in our electrical industry as far as i'm concerned. I think you'll find that over 90% of all these back door wannabe's, are sole traders, applying and registering with the part Pee scams within day's of passing out of these fast track training centres. Very few of either, will go on to take further training, and basically without the electrical core qualification and skill training they shouldn't be allowed to work alone in anyone's property.

A bit harsh i know, but then reality and truth normally is!!!

Just one question,re your mentions of back door entry,why bring sex into a discussion about Electrical Trainee's?

 

[jimmymac]

The short course guys take a 5 week course and some go on to further training and some work as mates before doing work themselves, I think some of the short course guys are decent fellas and misunderstood, that said not all by any means. The 17 Day wonders are members of the public like school caretakers and shop supervisors who go to a training centre and take a 17 day course. At the end of the course they have "Achieved Part P understanding" some of these people then think they are electricians and think the part p understanding course mean they can undertake electrical work in someones home. Unfortunatley the scams are happy to take their money and allow then to do so as well. The short course guys often get mixed up with the 17 Day course guys and end up getting a slating here, a lot of them justified. But as mentioned IMO some of the 5 week guys do end up as decent sparks after further training, no so the 17 day whizz kids.

Although I agree with most of your post, to make an assumption such as that is a little unfair. What's to stop a guy who's done a 17 day course going into further training? As far as I know, we don't have 17 day course in Scotland but if we did, I'd certainly give one of these guys a chance if I thought he/she had the right attitude and potential. After all, he's the one that's been scammed by the training provider, not you. It's not his fault

 

[Deleted member 9648]

[/B]
Although I agree with most of your post, to make an assumption such as that is a little unfair. What's to stop a guy who's done a 17 day course going into further training? As far as I know, we don't have 17 day course in Scotland but if we did, I'd certainly give one of these guys a chance if I thought he/she had the right attitude and potential. After all, he's the one that's been scammed by the training provider, not you. It's not his fault

I dont think anyone is blaming the 17 day/Electrical Trainee......they are being conned into believing they are electricians as E54 has already stated. The problem may well be that these people do NOT go on to further training but straight into the domestic sector where they are a liability,you only have to check out some of the very basic questions which pop up on here every day and are clearly asked by people charging for their services to see that is the case.

 

[MDJ]

[/B]
Although I agree with most of your post, to make an assumption such as that is a little unfair. What's to stop a guy who's done a 17 day course going into further training? As far as I know, we don't have 17 day course in Scotland but if we did, I'd certainly give one of these guys a chance if I thought he/she had the right attitude and potential. After all, he's the one that's been scammed by the training provider, not you. It's not his fault

Well your entitled to your view, which I respect, I just do not agree, no hard feelings.

 

[ipf]

I dont think anyone is blaming the 17 day/Electrical Trainee......they are being conned into believing they are electricians as E54 has already stated. The problem may well be that these people do NOT go on to further training but straight into the domestic sector where they are a liability,you only have to check out some of the very basic questions which pop up on here every day and are clearly asked by people charging for their services to see that is the case.

Indeed this conning lark is the main problem, giving the 'qualifiers' an opportunity to become domestic installers. These ambitious, moneymaking, conmen, quite often not having the slightest interest in a decent future for the trade, are basically bandwagon jumpers. Who is it who have given THEM the opportunity? The rot is deeply embedded
Just look at the latest installment of the parliamentary debate....all the schemes under one banner...but still in competition for members...do me a favour.

However, not all of the 'qualifiers' go in blind. Plenty know the situation and have the confidence to fast track, convinced they can, or will, succeed.

 

[GLENNSPARK]

well...i think we need to know what the reddys were per hour first....dont we...

 

[jimmymac]

Well your entitled to your view, which I respect, I just do not agree, no hard feelings.

Of course there's no hard feelings, I wouldn't mess with you if look anything like your profile pic!
Your quite right, the people that have completed the 17 day course are a million miles away from being an electrician, in any sense of the word, but surely if they received further training they can progress?? Also, as E54 said, there's only 6 days difference between the Electrical Trainee and the 17 day boys, so what can they be taught in those 6 days?? I assume the 17 day course consists of single phase, domestic training, which means the Electrical Trainee's will be taught all there is to know about 3 phase, commercial & industrial in 6 days?? That's unrealistic to say the least

- - - Updated - - -

well...i think we need to know what the reddys were per hour first....dont we...

Assuming you are going to be paid Glenn?? lol

 

[NJR]

I did a 5 week course a couple of years ago and must admit it doesnt teach anything of real use or understanding. They mainly teach you how to pass exams. I straight away got in with a small local firm and learnt more in a day on site than in those 5 weeks. I quickly realised i had been mugged off but what could i do. I am still working part time for this firm and now feel competent, i am looking at proper college courses to back up my practical knowledge with theory now.

 

[GLENNSPARK]

Of course there's no hard feelings, I wouldn't mess with you if look anything like your profile pic!
Your quite right, the people that have completed the 17 day course are a million miles away from being an electrician, in any sense of the word, but surely if they received further training they can progress?? Also, as E54 said, there's only 6 days difference between the Electrical Trainee and the 17 day boys, so what can they be taught in those 6 days?? I assume the 17 day course consists of single phase, domestic training, which means the Electrical Trainee's will be taught all there is to know about 3 phase, commercial & industrial in 6 days?? That's unrealistic to say the least

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Assuming you are going to be paid Glenn?? lol

oh...i assure you i would....