Road Tax Rip Off

[UNG]

Sign the petition https://submissions.epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/70266 to hopefully force the government to review their new road tax rules that means a vehicle could be taxed twice in a month

 

[dingledong]

It's what they do rip us off

 

[Octopus]

ha. ha.

Now this is so well known, it will simply lead to more untaxed vehicles on the road.

 

[dingledong]

No it can't the police have a camera that reads your number plate and tells them your untaxed . So when they are driving to a real emergency they can stop and do you for no tax then carry on to the emergency

 

[Octopus]

No it can't the police have a camera that reads your number plate and tells them your untaxed . So when they are driving to a real emergency they can stop and do you for no tax then carry on to the emergency

There are still approx 5% (yes over 1 million) un taxed cars on the road - so I doubt things will change. These are "reportedly" in the crime "hot spots" of the UK and the Police don't bother with them!

Add to this the "cloned" cars and the problem is huge - in fact now its not a requirement to display a tax disc I can see the number of cloned cars increasing big time.

Another smack in the face for the law abiding Brit!

 

[dingledong]

Yes it can cause big big problems if your vehicle is cloned .ah well the government knows best

 

[Octopus]

A few weeks ago on LBC, a caller rang in to tell the tale of her car being cloned!

She got sent a massive amount of fixed penalties - each one was sent back stating the car had been cloned - this carried on for months until the mother and daughter decided to be Miss Marple and started "plotting" on a map where each offence was recorded. From this they could see patterns of parking offences, speeding, crossing into the London Congestion zone.....

With this detail they then pin pointed the area where the car driver must live.

This was then taken to the Police - who didn't want to know.

The fines only stopped when the car had a massive accident and the culprit ran away!

 

[dingledong]

Yes on tv a woman had big problems with congestion charges because of a cloned car

 

[Octopus]

Yes on tv a woman had big problems with congestion charges because of a cloned car

I think that if you get cloned, then the best course of action would be a number plate change VIA DVLA! Yes it would cost a few quid but at least it would "prove" your innocence!

 

[dingledong]

Or just clone your vehicle and make out you sold it haha

 

[UNG]

There are still approx 5% (yes over 1 million) un taxed cars on the road - so I doubt things will change. These are "reportedly" in the crime "hot spots" of the UK and the Police don't bother with them!

Having a tax disc or not is not going to change the 5%'s attitude to buying road tax

Add to this the "cloned" cars and the problem is huge - in fact now its not a requirement to display a tax disc I can see the number of cloned cars increasing big time.

How many cloned cars have you noticed because the tax disc doesn't match the reg plate

Another smack in the face for the law abiding Brit!

The biggest smack is the double taxation potential if you sell or buy a car part way through a month

 

[fuel]

Car insurance is the next big rip off, for me anyway. £2097 for a 1.0l Peaugot?! Hard to get a quote for a van, or when i did it was 4k+ for a 1.3 Combo... Daylight robbery.

 

[davesparks]

No it can't the police have a camera that reads your number plate and tells them your untaxed . So when they are driving to a real emergency they can stop and do you for no tax then carry on to the emergency

No they don't, police don't stop on a blue light run for anything.

It's not just the police that have ANPR cameras, they are all over the place for all sorts of applications.

The police have them in some vehicles, but not all, and they are often vans etc parked at the side of the road or dedicatee ANPR vehicles.
Their biggest weakness is the age of the database attached to the system as it is often up to 3 months out of date.

 

[Geordie Spark]

ha. ha.

Now this is so well known, it will simply lead to more untaxed vehicles on the road.

Become a Freeman On the Land standing under Common Law and de-register your vehicle.

 

[ayjay]

i have a citroen 2cv fully com is £130- a year inc breakdown cover and travel abroad

Car insurance is the next big rip off, for me anyway. £2097 for a 1.0l Peaugot?! Hard to get a quote for a van, or when i did it was 4k+ for a 1.3 Combo... Daylight robbery.

 

[7029 dave]

Yes, and it would have been nice of them to inform us of the changes.

 

[telectrix]

i have a citroen 2cv fully com is £130- a year inc breakdown cover and travel abroad

if you drive a 2cv, insurance is the least of your problems. you will be chasing villains for the foreseeable.

 

[snowhead]

Yes, and it would have been nice of them to inform us of the changes.

You've been out the Country for the last 18months then, while it's been plastered all over the Internet, papers and T.v.

It's been on the Dvla website for months as well.

 

[7029 dave]

You've been out the Country for the last 18months then, while it's been plastered all over the Internet, papers and T.v.

It's been on the Dvla website for months as well.

Ain't got a pc snow, lol anyway it would have been nice in person.

 

[dingledong]

Yes to save money on the last couple of months of tax discs they didn't perforate them , so had to cut them out with scissors

 

[7029 dave]

Yes to save money on the last couple of months of tax discs they didn't perforate them , so had to cut them out with scissors

Those holes are no good Ding anyway, allways rip it up, must be me big hands.

 

[dingledong]

Yes Dave your right they weren't that good he he
But I can't see how not percolating the disc has saved any money

 

[Adam W]

No they don't, police don't stop on a blue light run for anything.

I think there may have been a suggestion of irony in dongle's comment, ie the only chance the police are likely to have to catch someone, they're too busy to catch them.

It's not just the police that have ANPR cameras, they are all over the place for all sorts of applications.

The police have them in some vehicles, but not all, and they are often vans etc parked at the side of the road or dedicatee ANPR vehicles.

I don't see how that's going to be any cheaper than sending out little bits of paper.
They're trying to sell it to us with the idea of £X savings every year, but as a proportion of what they make from tax discs I imagine the cost of producing them to be barely significant.

As it is a policeman or PCSO on foot patrol, a traffic warden, any one of the numerous council wardens who go around handing out fines to easy targets, or even the local busybody can all identify an untaxed vehicle.

 

[dingledong]

Thank you for noticing adam

 

[UNG]

I think there may have been a suggestion of irony in dongle's comment, ie the only chance the police are likely to have to catch someone, they're too busy to catch them.

You only have to watch some of these police programmes to see how many wanted people are accidentally caught

I don't see how that's going to be any cheaper than sending out little bits of paper.
They're trying to sell it to us with the idea of £X savings every year, but as a proportion of what they make from tax discs I imagine the cost of producing them to be barely significant.

Look at how much it costs to send an invoice out when you take into account the materials used paper, envelope, printing and postage and taking it to the post box if customers will accept it I email a PDF invoice as it is a much cheaper alternative this is all the DVLA have done in not producing tax discs anymore they don't incur postage costs sending them out

As it is a policeman or PCSO on foot patrol, a traffic warden, any one of the numerous council wardens who go around handing out fines to easy targets, or even the local busybody can all identify an untaxed vehicle.

I have reported untaxed vehicles before and weeks and months later they are still on the road untaxed even after reporting them again and again. With mobile datacoms improving all the time there is no reason why the police, PCSO's and parking wardens could not have mobile ANPR terminals or other number plate checking technology

 

[Geordie Spark]

Further to Post #14


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbM5FwrAvwY

 

[Octopus]

Further to Post #14


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbM5FwrAvwY

ha ha. A plumber........

 

[Adam W]

You only have to watch some of these police programmes to see how many wanted people are accidentally caught

I suspect some of these police programmes may have been sexed up for the TV - they might show you two or three wanted people being accidentally caught, but that isn't a relative cross-section of detection rates - they don't tend to show you criminals getting away with it, or even coppers going around winding up drunks on a Friday and Saturday night then arresting them under section 5 of the public order act when they swear, but it happens. I've seen it.
These police programmes are bordering on propaganda - broadcasting the idea that if you break the law you will be caught

Look at how much it costs to send an invoice out when you take into account the materials used paper, envelope, printing and postage and taking it to the post box if customers will accept it I email a PDF invoice as it is a much cheaper alternative this is all the DVLA have done in not producing tax discs anymore they don't incur postage costs sending them out

That's not the same thing at all - that would be like getting sent an email or text message to tell you you'd been caught by a speed camera.
The point is printing and posting a bit of paper is going to be cheaper than designing, building and maintaining a network of ANPR cameras, which still won't work if a vehicle has been cloned.

I have reported untaxed vehicles before and weeks and months later they are still on the road untaxed even after reporting them again and again. With mobile datacoms improving all the time there is no reason why the police, PCSO's and parking wardens could not have mobile ANPR terminals or other number plate checking technology

If the police can't detect untaxed vehicles when they know where they are, then what chance do they have when they don't? So they might drive past a camera on the motorway and get an invoice sent to a false address; hardly a deterrent.

 

[UNG]

That's not the same thing at all - that would be like getting sent an email or text message to tell you you'd been caught by a speed camera.

I'll have to disagree with you it is exactly the same thing the point I was making everything has a cost may be tax discs by PDF was something they didn't think about.

May be in time you will get speeding tickets by text or email

The point is printing and posting a bit of paper is going to be cheaper than designing, building and maintaining a network of ANPR cameras, which still won't work if a vehicle has been cloned.

But they were printing and sending out discs to people who paid not catching those that don't the money saved can be used for enforcement

 

[Adam W]

I'll have to disagree with you it is exactly the same thing the point I was making everything has a cost may be tax discs by PDF was something they didn't think about.

May be in time you will get speeding tickets by text or email



But they were printing and sending out discs to people who paid not catching those that don't the money saved can be used for enforcement

Do you mean if a pdf were sent with an image of the tax disc and the motorist printed it at home?
That's a nice idea but it would be too open to forgery. The idea of the tax disc as it stands is that there is a visible indication in a windscreen that tax has been paid.
Abolishing tax discs may be saving the treasury printing and postage costs, but these savings aren't being passed onto the motorist. While the cost of road tax may be staying the same, the revenue increased should slightly increase, but could substantially decrease.