Urgent advice reqd!

[mk1vanman]

hello there! first post! Well here i go, basically i have a spark in my house doing work for the plumbing company i have in fitting a new en suite for me, the house has an old style consumer unit, not rcd protected, but has one of these little rcd units for a shower that was put in by the previous owner, think its a 40amp breaker!? anyway, this spark plans to add another of these units for the new shower in the en suite, dont know why but somthing tells me this isnt right!? i could be wrong as i am no spark! ive had a look at where the tails are and where they go in, the out going tails for this little rcd shower unit leave which is fine, but surley there isnt room for yet another set of cables for the new shower breaker??
Please forgive if my terminology isnt great ive tried to describe it as best as i possibly can, really hoope the response will be "dont worry it sounds ok" but somthing just dosent sound correct here!!

any help/advice would be great folks! thank you!

 

[baldsparkies]

Is he registered under a competant person scheme ie NICEIC NAPPIT or ELECSA. Does he intend to provide certification and notification under local building control Part P. ?? You need YES answers to both questions.

 

[mk1vanman]

i do know that he definately registered with NICEIC so far mate.

 

[baldsparkies]

If so thats a good start, as said if he is supplying certificates for the work and also registering the works under labc which if nic registered he should, then as far as can be seen you should be fine. The fact he is putting rcd protection to your new shower is the way to go, seems ok on the info your providing.Obviously not seeing the work and going by what you say limits a more accurate opinion but as said seems ok.

 

[Dave]

Don't qoute me here but hasn't 17th edition altered on rcd's for bathrooms...they have to be installed now on certain circuits if i recall correct on info i have been told..?...bathrooms are a lot more strict now..

 

[mk1vanman]

just texted my plumber and he said that the spark is providing certs and is notifing the correct persons, maybe its just me, just didn't think it would look correct with 3 sets of cables comin out of there!?

 

[electricAl]

A bit more info would be helpful, as, on principle, it could still be done safely enough as you describe it if the terminals have enough capacity. Henley blocks would be an obvious alternative, but maybe they`re not strictly necessary. We can`t see it so you`d have to do the eyeballing stuff.

Assuming the tails from the meter run unbroken to existing CU, where exactly has he tapped off the feeds for these additional RCD units?
Cable size of feeds to RCD units?

 

[Spudnik]

It sounds fine to me.

The only thing you need to make sure is that all the circuits in a bathroom must now be RCD protected, including the lighting.

having said that, maybe ask him for a quote to upgrade your CU.

That way all the circuits will be in one CU with no need for additional for the showers

 

[mk1vanman]

tails from the meter run unbroken to existing CU, he has tapped of from where the tails come from the meter side as far as i remember, and the Cable size of feeds to RCD units seem to be same size as the tails,hence the lack of space i presumed!? hope this helps folks!

 

[baldsparkies]

The replies your recieving are of a positive nature ans I feel likewise. I think you can sleep easy generally speaking. If the guy is NICEIC registered there is a good bet all is good. Also at least he answers to a respected governing body. Its the one's that are't answerable you need to worry about.
Sleep easy my friend.

 

[mk1vanman]

guys within around twenty mins my questions have been answered perfectly, thank you all for your advice, its been great! ill definately sleep better tonight!

 

[electricAl]

guys within around twenty mins my questions have been answered perfectly, thank you all for your advice, its been great! ill definately sleep better tonight!

Nice to be appreciated

Good luck with the ensuite refurb.

 

[mags1972]

guys within around twenty mins my questions have been answered perfectly, thank you all for your advice, its been great! ill definately sleep better tonight!

To be totally honest pal, just fork out the money to replace your old CU for a new one, then everything will be RCD protected and you can sleep at night knowing you're completely protected because as someone said earlier, as well as your shower's, if the supplementary bonding isn't in place then all circuits supplying the bathroom need to be RCD protected providing the main bonding is in place and up to regs.
All future work will also need RCD protecting under the 17th ed so a new CU will be worth it in the long run!!!

 

[Moog]

tails from the meter run unbroken to existing CU, he has tapped of from where the tails come from the meter side as far as i remember, and the Cable size of feeds to RCD units seem to be same size as the tails,hence the lack of space i presumed!? hope this helps folks!

Are you saying he has the new shower connected before the CU? If this is the case and your whole installation exceeds the rating on the suppliers protection device then you will be paying out each time the suppliers fuse blows around £50 a time

 

[mk1vanman]

Are you saying he has the new shower connected before the CU? If this is the case and your whole installation exceeds the rating on the suppliers protection device then you will be paying out each time the suppliers fuse blows around £50 a time

yes i thinkso, his tails for this little rcd unit for the shower are not connected into the CU at all, they are into the bit where the main tails come in! so this isnt correct now??

 

[mags1972]

yes i thinkso, his tails for this little rcd unit for the shower are not connected into the CU at all, they are into the bit where the main tails come in! so this isnt correct now??

What are the the odds that the main fuse is 60A!!!!
The best way under your current setup would be to take a 6 or 10mm feed from a 40A fuse/MCB in the main Cu to the shower units, thats assumiong you had 2 spare ways. The main problem here is I'm assuming your main CU is full which is why this hasn't been done, and 2 electric showers plus your existing circuits will be probably more than your main fuse is rated at, however there is a wonderful thing known as diversity and the chance of all the circuits being full load at the same time aren't good so the fuse probably won't blow, this doesn't make it right though.
I know I'm sounding like a broken record but a new CU is the way to go. Not sure if its an old rewirable wylex CU you have but if it is then they need replacing anyway they should be illegal now!!

 

[lister]

can we have photos pleeeeeeease
then we can tell you one way or the other.

 

[Mr Mark Sparks]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moog
Are you saying he has the new shower connected before the CU? If this is the case and your whole installation exceeds the rating on the suppliers protection device then you will be paying out each time the suppliers fuse blows around £50 a time


yes i thinkso, his tails for this little rcd unit for the shower are not connected into the CU at all, they are into the bit where the main tails come in! so this isnt correct now??

dont worry this post by moog is a little misleading
the overall load on the suppliers fuse is the same no matter how or where the shower is connected
as said by most a new cu is ideal but what he is doing seems ok

 

[mk1vanman]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moog
Are you saying he has the new shower connected before the CU? If this is the case and your whole installation exceeds the rating on the suppliers protection device then you will be paying out each time the suppliers fuse blows around £50 a time


yes i thinkso, his tails for this little rcd unit for the shower are not connected into the CU at all, they are into the bit where the main tails come in! so this isnt correct now??

dont worry this post by moog is a little misleading
the overall load on the suppliers fuse is the same no matter how or where the shower is connected
as said by most a new cu is ideal but what he is doing seems ok

ok thats great, ill try get some pics tomorrow though and post them up tomorrow night!

 

[mags1972]

ok thats great, ill try get some pics tomorrow though and post them up tomorrow night!

Just out of curiosity, what is the power rating of the shower, 8.5 KW, 9.5KW, 10.5KW etc???